Posted By: Daryl
"It Is Finished"?? - 04/17/03 03:50 AM
Jesus said while on the cross that "it is finished."
What did He mean when He said that?
What did He mean when He said that?
"It Is Finished"??
Posted By: Mountain Man
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 04/17/03 08:20 PM
He was referring to the cup of God's wrath. It's the same cup the unsaved will drink in the lake of fire. But Jesus conquered the cup. He was alive when He proclaimed - It is finished. Thus, He did not die the second, rather He defeated it and is therefore now the lawful owner of the keys of hell and of death.
1. Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, "It is finished." John 19:30. The battle had been won. His right hand and His holy arm had gotten Him the victory. As a Conqueror He planted His banner on the eternal heights. Was there not joy among the angels? All heaven triumphed in the Saviour's victory. Satan was defeated, and knew that his kingdom was lost. {DA 758.1}
2. What a support Christ would have found in His earthly relatives if they had believed in Him as one from heaven, and had co-operated with Him in doing the work of God! Their unbelief cast a shadow over the earthly life of Jesus. It was a part of the bitterness of that cup of woe which He drained for us. {DA 325.3}
3. The message of the Greeks, foreshadowing as it did the gathering in of the Gentiles, brought to the mind of Jesus His entire mission. The work of redemption passed before Him, from the time when in heaven the plan was laid, to the death that was now so near at hand. A mysterious cloud seemed to enshroud the Son of God. Its gloom was felt by those near Him. He sat rapt in thought. At last the silence was broken by His mournful voice, "Now is My soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save Me from this hour?" In anticipation Christ was already drinking the cup of bitterness. His humanity shrank from the hour of abandonment, when to all appearance He would be deserted even by God, when all would see Him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. He shrank from public exposure, from being treated as the worst of criminals, from a shameful and dishonored death. A foreboding of His conflict with the powers of darkness, a sense of the awful burden of human transgression, and the Father's wrath because of sin caused the spirit of Jesus to faint, and the pallor of death to overspread His countenance. {DA 624.3}
4. In the upper chamber of a dwelling at Jerusalem, Christ was sitting at table with His disciples. They had gathered to celebrate the Passover. The Saviour desired to keep this feast alone with the twelve. He knew that His hour was come; He Himself was the true paschal lamb, and on the day the Passover was eaten He was to be sacrificed. He was about to drink the cup of wrath; He must soon receive the final baptism of suffering. But a few quiet hours yet remained to Him, and these were to be spent for the benefit of His beloved disciples. {DA 642.1}
5. Behold Him contemplating the price to be paid for the human soul. In His agony He clings to the cold ground, as if to prevent Himself from being drawn farther from God. The chilling dew of night falls upon His prostrate form, but He heeds it not. From His pale lips comes the bitter cry, "O My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from Me." Yet even now He adds, "Nevertheless not as I will, but as Thou wilt." {DA 687.2}
6. Turning away, Jesus sought again His retreat, and fell prostrate, overcome by the horror of a great darkness. The humanity of the Son of God trembled in that trying hour. He prayed not now for His disciples that their faith might not fail, but for His own tempted, agonized soul. The awful moment had come--that moment which was to decide the destiny of the world. The fate of humanity trembled in the balance. Christ might even now refuse to drink the cup apportioned to guilty man. It was not yet too late. He might wipe the bloody sweat from His brow, and leave man to perish in his iniquity. He might say, Let the transgressor receive the penalty of his sin, and I will go back to My Father. Will the Son of God drink the bitter cup of humiliation and agony? Will the innocent suffer the consequences of the curse of sin, to save the guilty? The words fall tremblingly from the pale lips of Jesus, "O My Father, if this cup may not pass away from Me, except I drink it, Thy will be done." {DA 690.2}
7. Satan with his fierce temptations wrung the heart of Jesus. The Saviour could not see through the portals of the tomb. Hope did not present to Him His coming forth from the grave a conqueror, or tell Him of the Father's acceptance of the sacrifice. He feared that sin was so offensive to God that Their separation was to be eternal. Christ felt the anguish which the sinner will feel when mercy shall no longer plead for the guilty race. It was the sense of sin, bringing the Father's wrath upon Him as man's substitute, that made the cup He drank so bitter, and broke the heart of the Son of God. {DA 753.2}
8. Amid the awful darkness, apparently forsaken of God, Christ had drained the last dregs in the cup of human woe. In those dreadful hours He had relied upon the evidence of His Father's acceptance heretofore given Him. He was acquainted with the character of His Father; He understood His justice, His mercy, and His great love. By faith He rested in Him whom it had ever been His joy to obey. And as in submission He committed Himself to God, the sense of the loss of His Father's favor was withdrawn. By faith, Christ was victor. {DA 756.3}
9. Reasoning from prophecy, Christ gave His disciples a correct idea of what He was to be in humanity. Their expectation of a Messiah who was to take His throne and kingly power in accordance with the desires of men had been misleading. It would interfere with a correct apprehension of His descent from the highest to the lowest position that could be occupied. Christ desired that the ideas of His disciples might be pure and true in every specification. They must understand as far as possible in regard to the cup of suffering that had been apportioned to Him. He showed them that the awful conflict which they could not yet comprehend was the fulfillment of the covenant made before the foundation of the world was laid. Christ must die, as every transgressor of the law must die if he continues in sin. All this was to be, but it was not to end in defeat, but in glorious, eternal victory. Jesus told them that every effort must be made to save the world from sin. His followers must live as He lived, and work as He worked, with intense, persevering effort. {DA 799.3}
1. Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, "It is finished." John 19:30. The battle had been won. His right hand and His holy arm had gotten Him the victory. As a Conqueror He planted His banner on the eternal heights. Was there not joy among the angels? All heaven triumphed in the Saviour's victory. Satan was defeated, and knew that his kingdom was lost. {DA 758.1}
2. What a support Christ would have found in His earthly relatives if they had believed in Him as one from heaven, and had co-operated with Him in doing the work of God! Their unbelief cast a shadow over the earthly life of Jesus. It was a part of the bitterness of that cup of woe which He drained for us. {DA 325.3}
3. The message of the Greeks, foreshadowing as it did the gathering in of the Gentiles, brought to the mind of Jesus His entire mission. The work of redemption passed before Him, from the time when in heaven the plan was laid, to the death that was now so near at hand. A mysterious cloud seemed to enshroud the Son of God. Its gloom was felt by those near Him. He sat rapt in thought. At last the silence was broken by His mournful voice, "Now is My soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save Me from this hour?" In anticipation Christ was already drinking the cup of bitterness. His humanity shrank from the hour of abandonment, when to all appearance He would be deserted even by God, when all would see Him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. He shrank from public exposure, from being treated as the worst of criminals, from a shameful and dishonored death. A foreboding of His conflict with the powers of darkness, a sense of the awful burden of human transgression, and the Father's wrath because of sin caused the spirit of Jesus to faint, and the pallor of death to overspread His countenance. {DA 624.3}
4. In the upper chamber of a dwelling at Jerusalem, Christ was sitting at table with His disciples. They had gathered to celebrate the Passover. The Saviour desired to keep this feast alone with the twelve. He knew that His hour was come; He Himself was the true paschal lamb, and on the day the Passover was eaten He was to be sacrificed. He was about to drink the cup of wrath; He must soon receive the final baptism of suffering. But a few quiet hours yet remained to Him, and these were to be spent for the benefit of His beloved disciples. {DA 642.1}
5. Behold Him contemplating the price to be paid for the human soul. In His agony He clings to the cold ground, as if to prevent Himself from being drawn farther from God. The chilling dew of night falls upon His prostrate form, but He heeds it not. From His pale lips comes the bitter cry, "O My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from Me." Yet even now He adds, "Nevertheless not as I will, but as Thou wilt." {DA 687.2}
6. Turning away, Jesus sought again His retreat, and fell prostrate, overcome by the horror of a great darkness. The humanity of the Son of God trembled in that trying hour. He prayed not now for His disciples that their faith might not fail, but for His own tempted, agonized soul. The awful moment had come--that moment which was to decide the destiny of the world. The fate of humanity trembled in the balance. Christ might even now refuse to drink the cup apportioned to guilty man. It was not yet too late. He might wipe the bloody sweat from His brow, and leave man to perish in his iniquity. He might say, Let the transgressor receive the penalty of his sin, and I will go back to My Father. Will the Son of God drink the bitter cup of humiliation and agony? Will the innocent suffer the consequences of the curse of sin, to save the guilty? The words fall tremblingly from the pale lips of Jesus, "O My Father, if this cup may not pass away from Me, except I drink it, Thy will be done." {DA 690.2}
7. Satan with his fierce temptations wrung the heart of Jesus. The Saviour could not see through the portals of the tomb. Hope did not present to Him His coming forth from the grave a conqueror, or tell Him of the Father's acceptance of the sacrifice. He feared that sin was so offensive to God that Their separation was to be eternal. Christ felt the anguish which the sinner will feel when mercy shall no longer plead for the guilty race. It was the sense of sin, bringing the Father's wrath upon Him as man's substitute, that made the cup He drank so bitter, and broke the heart of the Son of God. {DA 753.2}
8. Amid the awful darkness, apparently forsaken of God, Christ had drained the last dregs in the cup of human woe. In those dreadful hours He had relied upon the evidence of His Father's acceptance heretofore given Him. He was acquainted with the character of His Father; He understood His justice, His mercy, and His great love. By faith He rested in Him whom it had ever been His joy to obey. And as in submission He committed Himself to God, the sense of the loss of His Father's favor was withdrawn. By faith, Christ was victor. {DA 756.3}
9. Reasoning from prophecy, Christ gave His disciples a correct idea of what He was to be in humanity. Their expectation of a Messiah who was to take His throne and kingly power in accordance with the desires of men had been misleading. It would interfere with a correct apprehension of His descent from the highest to the lowest position that could be occupied. Christ desired that the ideas of His disciples might be pure and true in every specification. They must understand as far as possible in regard to the cup of suffering that had been apportioned to Him. He showed them that the awful conflict which they could not yet comprehend was the fulfillment of the covenant made before the foundation of the world was laid. Christ must die, as every transgressor of the law must die if he continues in sin. All this was to be, but it was not to end in defeat, but in glorious, eternal victory. Jesus told them that every effort must be made to save the world from sin. His followers must live as He lived, and work as He worked, with intense, persevering effort. {DA 799.3}
Posted By: Davros
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/01/05 02:08 PM
In answer to the question that is the topic, no.
quote:
For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.
Matthew 5:18
Posted By: Daryl
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/01/05 05:24 PM
Well, let's look at the verse where Christ said that it is finished.
In regards to Dave Hoover's post, what then is the difference between it is finished and until all is accomplished?
John 19:30When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost. This is the only place where it has been recorded regarding Christ saying it is finished, therefore, something was obviously finished by Christ at that point in time, which Mike Lowe posted to in his post.
In regards to Dave Hoover's post, what then is the difference between it is finished and until all is accomplished?
Posted By: Mountain Man
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/01/05 06:15 PM
Yes, "it" was finished. Jesus said so. Obviously, He wasn't referring to the plan of salvation or the great controversy, because neither one were finished on the cross.
Posted By: Rosangela
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/01/05 08:29 PM
For all practical purposes, at the cross God defeated Satan, won the great controversy and consummated the plan of salvation. From then on, it was just a matter of time.
"When Christ cried out from the cross, 'It is finished,' all Heaven triumphed. The controversy between Christ and Satan in regard to the execution of the plan of salvation was ended.... When Christ died on Calvary's cross, he exclaimed in his expiring agony, 'It is finished;' and Satan knew that he had been defeated in his purpose to overthrow the plan of salvation" (ST, September 23, 1889).
"Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, 'It is finished.' John 19:30. The battle had been won. His right hand and His holy arm had gotten Him the victory. As a Conqueror He planted His banner on the eternal heights. Was there not joy among the angels? All heaven triumphed in the Saviour's victory. Satan was defeated, and knew that his kingdom was lost. To the angels and the unfallen worlds the cry, 'It is finished,' had a deep significance. It was for them as well as for us that the great work of redemption had been accomplished. They with us share the fruits of Christ's victory. ... Well, then, might the angels rejoice as they looked upon the Saviour's cross; for though they did not then understand all, they knew that the destruction of sin and Satan was forever made certain, that the redemption of man was assured, and that the universe was made eternally secure. Christ Himself fully comprehended the results of the sacrifice made upon Calvary. To all these He looked forward when upon the cross He cried out, 'It is finished.' (DA 758, 764)
"When Christ cried out from the cross, 'It is finished,' all Heaven triumphed. The controversy between Christ and Satan in regard to the execution of the plan of salvation was ended.... When Christ died on Calvary's cross, he exclaimed in his expiring agony, 'It is finished;' and Satan knew that he had been defeated in his purpose to overthrow the plan of salvation" (ST, September 23, 1889).
"Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, 'It is finished.' John 19:30. The battle had been won. His right hand and His holy arm had gotten Him the victory. As a Conqueror He planted His banner on the eternal heights. Was there not joy among the angels? All heaven triumphed in the Saviour's victory. Satan was defeated, and knew that his kingdom was lost. To the angels and the unfallen worlds the cry, 'It is finished,' had a deep significance. It was for them as well as for us that the great work of redemption had been accomplished. They with us share the fruits of Christ's victory. ... Well, then, might the angels rejoice as they looked upon the Saviour's cross; for though they did not then understand all, they knew that the destruction of sin and Satan was forever made certain, that the redemption of man was assured, and that the universe was made eternally secure. Christ Himself fully comprehended the results of the sacrifice made upon Calvary. To all these He looked forward when upon the cross He cried out, 'It is finished.' (DA 758, 764)
Posted By: Davros
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/01/05 10:42 PM
I was just present the argument use to do away with the law. It is reasoned that when Jesus said it is finished, he meant the law and all requirements. At that very point, plenty was finished: his life, the ceremony, and the need for sacrifice to name a few. But, if we are asking if it is all finished, no, it is not. Just one example is the text I quoted.
Posted By: vastergotland
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/02/05 02:06 AM
Anyone else find it interesting that it seems whatever it was, it was finnished before He died and not trough His death.
/Thomas
/Thomas
Posted By: Charlene Van Hook
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/02/05 06:01 AM
"it is finished" referes to what took place on the earth...[courtyard} and His life as our example....fulfilling the ceremonial laws defeting Satan.
Study "it is done" to find out what was completed in heaven, as our High Priest, before He can come.
There are two phases of the plan of salvation and one is just as important as the other.
The Great Controversy-- Facing Life's Record
-PG- 489
"The intercession of Christ in man's behalf in the sanctuary above is as essential to the plan of salvation as was His death upon the cross. By His death He began that work which
after His resurrection He ascended to complete in heaven. ".........
- Ellen G. White: The Early Years Volume 1 - 1827-1862---- Sustained in a Continued Ministry
-PG- 107
The Place of the Vision in Confirming the Sanctuary Truth
Significantly, the Day-Star Extra dated February 7, 1846, had been devoted to the Bible study of Hiram Edson and O.R.L. Crosier in which they set forth from the Scriptures the evidence for the understanding that the two phases of ministry in the earthly sanctuary service were a type of Christ's ministry in the heavenly
sanctuary. Consequently, according to Edson and Crosier, events that were to come to pass, beginning on October 22, 1844, were
events taking place in heaven.
Study "it is done" to find out what was completed in heaven, as our High Priest, before He can come.
There are two phases of the plan of salvation and one is just as important as the other.
The Great Controversy-- Facing Life's Record
-PG- 489
"The intercession of Christ in man's behalf in the sanctuary above is as essential to the plan of salvation as was His death upon the cross. By His death He began that work which
after His resurrection He ascended to complete in heaven. ".........
- Ellen G. White: The Early Years Volume 1 - 1827-1862---- Sustained in a Continued Ministry
-PG- 107
The Place of the Vision in Confirming the Sanctuary Truth
Significantly, the Day-Star Extra dated February 7, 1846, had been devoted to the Bible study of Hiram Edson and O.R.L. Crosier in which they set forth from the Scriptures the evidence for the understanding that the two phases of ministry in the earthly sanctuary service were a type of Christ's ministry in the heavenly
sanctuary. Consequently, according to Edson and Crosier, events that were to come to pass, beginning on October 22, 1844, were
events taking place in heaven.
Posted By: Rosangela
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/02/05 03:43 PM
quote:I beg to differ, Thomas.
Anyone else find it interesting that it seems whatever it was, it was finnished before He died and not trough His death.
Whatever it was, it was accomplished through His death. Of course He couldn’t have said anything after He died; therefore, He pronounced these words in the exact moment He was dying. Please notice the following excerpts of the texts I quoted in my last post:
“When Christ died on Calvary's cross, he exclaimed in his expiring agony, 'It is finished;'”
“with His parting breath He exclaimed, 'It is finished.'”
Posted By: Ronnie Whalon
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/03/05 12:12 AM
The words that Christ exclaimed at Calvary reveal that a climatic goal had been reached in the plan of salvation – the antitypical sacrifice had been offered.
There are two more sayings of similar wording and they are described as this:
I saw angels hurrying to and fro in heaven. An angel with a writer's inkhorn by his side returned from the earth and reported to Jesus that his work was done, and the saints were numbered and sealed. Then I saw Jesus, who had been ministering before the ark containing the ten commandments, throw down the censer. He raised His hands, and with a loud voice said, "It is done." And all the angelic host laid off their crowns as Jesus made the solemn declaration, "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still." {EW 279.2} - the antitypical close of probation.
All heaven had united with Jesus, as they heard the fearful words, "It is done. It is finished." The plan of salvation had been accomplished, but few had chosen to accept it. And as mercy's sweet voice died away, fear and horror seized the wicked. With terrible distinctness they heard the words, "Too late! too late!" {EW 281.1}
It is at midnight that God manifests His power for the deliverance of His people. The sun appears, shining in its strength. Signs and wonders follow in quick succession. The wicked look with terror and amazement upon the scene, while the righteous behold with solemn joy the tokens of their deliverance. Everything in nature seems turned out of its course. The streams cease to flow. Dark, heavy clouds come up and clash against each other. In the midst of the angry heavens is one clear space of indescribable glory, whence comes the voice of God like the sound of many waters, saying: "It is done." Revelation 16:17. {GC 636.2} - the antitypical jubilee.
His words exclaimed before his death do not elute to the fact that all was finished. The mystery that the Apostle Paul revealed in Col.1:26-27 has to be fulfilled and it is at the antitypical jubilee that God will have such a people.
There are two more sayings of similar wording and they are described as this:
I saw angels hurrying to and fro in heaven. An angel with a writer's inkhorn by his side returned from the earth and reported to Jesus that his work was done, and the saints were numbered and sealed. Then I saw Jesus, who had been ministering before the ark containing the ten commandments, throw down the censer. He raised His hands, and with a loud voice said, "It is done." And all the angelic host laid off their crowns as Jesus made the solemn declaration, "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still." {EW 279.2} - the antitypical close of probation.
All heaven had united with Jesus, as they heard the fearful words, "It is done. It is finished." The plan of salvation had been accomplished, but few had chosen to accept it. And as mercy's sweet voice died away, fear and horror seized the wicked. With terrible distinctness they heard the words, "Too late! too late!" {EW 281.1}
It is at midnight that God manifests His power for the deliverance of His people. The sun appears, shining in its strength. Signs and wonders follow in quick succession. The wicked look with terror and amazement upon the scene, while the righteous behold with solemn joy the tokens of their deliverance. Everything in nature seems turned out of its course. The streams cease to flow. Dark, heavy clouds come up and clash against each other. In the midst of the angry heavens is one clear space of indescribable glory, whence comes the voice of God like the sound of many waters, saying: "It is done." Revelation 16:17. {GC 636.2} - the antitypical jubilee.
His words exclaimed before his death do not elute to the fact that all was finished. The mystery that the Apostle Paul revealed in Col.1:26-27 has to be fulfilled and it is at the antitypical jubilee that God will have such a people.
Posted By: Mountain Man
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/03/05 01:59 AM
Yes, I agree with you Thomas, Jesus did not lay down His life until after He had accomplished His goals on the cross, until after the cup was dry and empty. Laying down His life happened after He had triumphed over our sin and second death.
DA 758
Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, "It is finished." John 19:30.
DA 758
Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, "It is finished." John 19:30.
Posted By: Tom
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/03/05 02:03 AM
I agree with Rosangela's explanation, which is that "it" refers to the Great Controversy in "It is finished." I will flesh out some of thoughts as to what this entails.
What were the primary issues involved in the Great Controversy? I can think of three. The first one involves God, the second sin, and the third the principle of self-exaltation.
Regarding God, Satan had made the accusation that God did not have the best interests of His creatures in mind. This was insinuated in Eden by way of his tempations to Eve. Christ fully proved the falseness of this idea by His death on the cross, which proved that God indeed places the interests of others above His own. We see this both from the perspective of God the Father, who was willing to send His Son at the risk of failure and eternal loss, and from the perspective of Christ Himself, who could not see through the portals of the tomb, yet was willing to die for all eternity if it would mean our salvation. (Hallelujah!)
Regarding the second issue, Satan had claimed that God had lied when he stated that sin would result in death. This lie has been a very important one of Satan's, and has led to many errors. One error is that if we believe that sin is basically innocuous, and does not have the power to destroy that God says it does, we will be led to false ideas regarding God. If we see sin as powerless to destroy, then the destruction which sin causes we will mistakenly cast upon God, just as the deceiver would wish. This leads us to a religion based on fear, where we view God as saying, "Do what I say, or I will kill you," rather than seeing reality, which is, "Trust in what I am telling you, or sin will destroy you."
The death of Christ demonstrates the truth about the awful power of sin. It caused even Christ to feel that He was being abandoned by God, and it was only due to His great trust in God and firm belief in the truth about God which led Him to victory.
The final issue regards the principle of self-exaltation. Christ's whole life, and His death in particular, demonstrates the insidiousness of the principle of self-exaltation and unmasked its inventor. Self-exaltation led God's creatures to crucify Him. This demonstrates our disposition towards God, apart from His grace.
The cross also laid bare the truth about the deceiver. After the cross, Satan had no more audience, as everyone knew who he was. And so it is written that the Accuser was "cast down."
God overcame and won the Great Controversy not by force (the principle of Satan's government), but on the basis of the principles of love and truth.
What were the primary issues involved in the Great Controversy? I can think of three. The first one involves God, the second sin, and the third the principle of self-exaltation.
Regarding God, Satan had made the accusation that God did not have the best interests of His creatures in mind. This was insinuated in Eden by way of his tempations to Eve. Christ fully proved the falseness of this idea by His death on the cross, which proved that God indeed places the interests of others above His own. We see this both from the perspective of God the Father, who was willing to send His Son at the risk of failure and eternal loss, and from the perspective of Christ Himself, who could not see through the portals of the tomb, yet was willing to die for all eternity if it would mean our salvation. (Hallelujah!)
Regarding the second issue, Satan had claimed that God had lied when he stated that sin would result in death. This lie has been a very important one of Satan's, and has led to many errors. One error is that if we believe that sin is basically innocuous, and does not have the power to destroy that God says it does, we will be led to false ideas regarding God. If we see sin as powerless to destroy, then the destruction which sin causes we will mistakenly cast upon God, just as the deceiver would wish. This leads us to a religion based on fear, where we view God as saying, "Do what I say, or I will kill you," rather than seeing reality, which is, "Trust in what I am telling you, or sin will destroy you."
The death of Christ demonstrates the truth about the awful power of sin. It caused even Christ to feel that He was being abandoned by God, and it was only due to His great trust in God and firm belief in the truth about God which led Him to victory.
The final issue regards the principle of self-exaltation. Christ's whole life, and His death in particular, demonstrates the insidiousness of the principle of self-exaltation and unmasked its inventor. Self-exaltation led God's creatures to crucify Him. This demonstrates our disposition towards God, apart from His grace.
The cross also laid bare the truth about the deceiver. After the cross, Satan had no more audience, as everyone knew who he was. And so it is written that the Accuser was "cast down."
God overcame and won the Great Controversy not by force (the principle of Satan's government), but on the basis of the principles of love and truth.
Posted By: vastergotland
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/03/05 03:26 AM
All I know is that the gospel of John puts it this way
/Thomas
quote:And no, this is no atempt to remove the importance of the death, for :
John 19: 28Later, knowing that all was now completed, and so that the Scripture would be fulfilled, Jesus said, “I am thirsty.” 29A jar of wine vinegar was there, so they soaked a sponge in it, put the sponge on a stalk of the hyssop plant, and lifted it to Jesus' lips. 30When he had received the drink, Jesus said, “It is finished.” With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.
quote:Nevertheless, something seems to finnish before the death. Either this or John understood something wrong.
1 John 2: 1My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense–Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
/Thomas
Posted By: John H.
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/04/05 12:56 AM
John simply narrated what happened. As has been pointed out, Jesus couldn't say, "It is finished" after He was dead. He had to say it while He was yet living. But it was His death that ratified the New Covenant. "Without shedding of blood is no remission." Hebrews 9:22.
Posted By: myarsman
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/05/05 04:32 AM
I think that it is of importance that we note what events transpired immediately after Jesus said "It is finished".
Matthew 27:50,51; "And when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom...."
This reference to the veil being torn from top to bottom would seem to indicate that Jesus death had some impact upon the Jewish sacrificial services. In fact, the event of Jesus death brought an end to the need for any further sacrifices to be offered.
More specifically, Jesus' Death was a fulfillment of the typical sacrifice of the "Lord's Goat" on the Day of Atonement.
"It is Finished" meant that the critical event that these sacrificial services had been fulfilled. Mankind's salvation had been accomplished in its totality. God, through the death of His Son, had done all that needed to be done in order for mankind to be saved. (Of course, the ultimate salvation of mankind rested solely upon his acceptance of this sacrifice in his behalf.)
The other types of the Day of Atonement services was fulfilled shortly after Jesus Death and Resurrection.
When Jesus arose on the third day, He made a special appearance before His Father which was typlified by the Jewish High Priest entering into the Most Holy Place with the blood of the "Lord's Goat".
Shortly after Jesus ascension to Heaven, the War in Heaven" took place(See Revelation 12) and Satan was banished to this earth. This was typlfied by the Scapegoat being banished from the temple/congregation and into the wilderness.
So, as can be seen, Jesus words "It is Finished" had a very important meaning for us. The Jewish Sacrificial Services had met their "Anti-Type" and their fulfillment was complete at the cross and shortly afterward.
God had done all that needed to be done to effect our salvation.
Matthew 27:50,51; "And when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom...."
This reference to the veil being torn from top to bottom would seem to indicate that Jesus death had some impact upon the Jewish sacrificial services. In fact, the event of Jesus death brought an end to the need for any further sacrifices to be offered.
More specifically, Jesus' Death was a fulfillment of the typical sacrifice of the "Lord's Goat" on the Day of Atonement.
"It is Finished" meant that the critical event that these sacrificial services had been fulfilled. Mankind's salvation had been accomplished in its totality. God, through the death of His Son, had done all that needed to be done in order for mankind to be saved. (Of course, the ultimate salvation of mankind rested solely upon his acceptance of this sacrifice in his behalf.)
The other types of the Day of Atonement services was fulfilled shortly after Jesus Death and Resurrection.
When Jesus arose on the third day, He made a special appearance before His Father which was typlified by the Jewish High Priest entering into the Most Holy Place with the blood of the "Lord's Goat".
Shortly after Jesus ascension to Heaven, the War in Heaven" took place(See Revelation 12) and Satan was banished to this earth. This was typlfied by the Scapegoat being banished from the temple/congregation and into the wilderness.
So, as can be seen, Jesus words "It is Finished" had a very important meaning for us. The Jewish Sacrificial Services had met their "Anti-Type" and their fulfillment was complete at the cross and shortly afterward.
God had done all that needed to be done to effect our salvation.
Posted By: Mountain Man
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/05/05 10:57 PM
Bob, I like what you posted about the death of Jesus, but your ideas regarding the war in heaven and the scapegoat do not coincide with the SDA statement of truth.
Posted By: Mountain Man
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/05/05 11:07 PM
John, without the resurrection there can be no remission of sins, either. It wasn't a matter of convenience that Jesus declared, It is finished, before He was dead. It was the truth. Jesus could not die before it was finished. Dying before it was finished would have left it unfinished. Don't forget, the sense of His Father's disfavor was withdrawn before He died. He was victorious before He died.
Suffering the pain and agony associated with sin and guilt is what pays the penalty for sinning, that satisfies the just and holy demands of the law - not death. Death is the end of suffering and punishment. Therefore, Jesus could not die before He paid the penalty. Thus, He suffered the punishment for the sins of the world before He died.
Suffering the pain and agony associated with sin and guilt is what pays the penalty for sinning, that satisfies the just and holy demands of the law - not death. Death is the end of suffering and punishment. Therefore, Jesus could not die before He paid the penalty. Thus, He suffered the punishment for the sins of the world before He died.
Posted By: Tom
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/07/05 09:28 AM
What Christ suffered was simply the results of sin. It was not an arbitrary imposition on the part of God. God did not change; He just continued being Himself. Christ was affected by taking our sin upon Him:
quote:
4Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 BUT he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
Posted By: Rosangela
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/07/05 04:09 PM
quote:Mike, the following text doesn't seem to support this conclusion:
Don't forget, the sense of His Father's disfavor was withdrawn before He died.
"All Heaven was gazing with profound interest upon the scene. The glorious Redeemer of a lost world was suffering the penalty of man's transgressions of the Father's law. He was about to ransom his people with his own blood. He was paying the claims of God's holy law. This was the means through which an end was to be finally made of sin and Satan, and his host to be vanquished. {PH169 8.2}
"Oh! was there ever suffering and sorrow like that endured by the dying Saviour? It was the sense of his Fathers's displeasure which made his cup so bitter. It was not bodily suffering which so quickly ended the life of Christ upon the cross. It was the crushing weight of the sins of the world, and a sense of his Father's wrath. The Father's glory and sustaining presence had been withdrawn from him, and despair pressed its crushing weight of darkness upon him, and forced from his pale and quivering lips the anguished cry. "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" {PH169 9.1}
"Jesus united with the Father in making the world. Amid the agonizing sufferings of the Son of God, blind and deluded men alone remain unfeeling. The chief priests and elders revile God's dear Son while in his expiring agonies. Yet inanimate nature groans in sympathy with her bleeding, dying Author. The earth trembles. The sun refuses to behold the scene. The heavens gather blackness. Angels have witnessed the sufferings of God's dear Son, until they can look no longer, and hide their faces from the horrid sight. Christ is dying! He is in despair! His Father's approving smile is removed, and angels are not permitted to lighten the gloom of the terrible hour. {PH169 9.2}
"Even doubts assailed the dying Son of God. He could not see through the portals of the tomb. Bright hope did not present to him his coming for from the tomb a conqueror and his Father's acceptance of his sacrifice. The sin of the world, with all its terribleness, was felt to the utmost by the Son of God. The displeasure of the Father for sin and its penalty which was death, were all that he could realize through this amazing darkness. He was tempted to fear that sin was so offensive in the sight of his Father, that he could not be reconciled to his Son. The fierce temptation that his own Father had forever left him caused that piercing cry from the cross. 'My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?' {PH169 10.1}
"Christ felt much as sinners will feel when the vials of God's wrath shall be poured out upon them. Black despair, like the pall of death, will gather about their guilty souls, and then they will realize to the fullest extent, the sinfulness of sin. Salvation has been purchased for them by the suffering and death of the Son of God. It might be theirs if they would accept it willingly, gladly, but none are compelled to yield obedience to the law of God. If they refuse the heavenly benefit, if they choose the pleasures and deceitfulness of sin, they can have their choice, and at the end receive their wages, which is the wrath of God and eternal death. {PH169 10.2}
"Faith and hope tremble in the expiring agonies of Christ, because God has removed the assurance he had heretofore given his beloved Son of his approbation and acceptance. The Redeemer of the world now relies upon the evidences which had hitherto strengthened him. That his Father accepted his labors, and was pleased with his work. In his dying agony, as he yields up his precious life, he has by faith alone to trust in Him whom it has ever been his joy to obey. He is not cheered with clear, bright rays of hope on the right hand nor on the left. All is enshrouded in oppressive gloom. Amid the awful darkness which is felt by sympathizing nature, the Redeemer drains the mysterious cup even to its dregs. Denied even bright hope and confidence in the triumph which will be his in the future, he cries with a loud voice, "Lord, into thy hands I commit my spirit." He is acquainted with the character of his Father, his justice, his mercy, and great love. In submission he drops into the hands of his Father. Amid the convulsions of nature are heard by the amazed spectators the dying words of the Man of Calvary." {PH169 10.3}
Posted By: Tom
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/08/05 07:58 AM
Christ took upon Him the sin of the world. He felt as if He were a sinner. It was our own sins that caused this to happen to Him. It was sin which caused Christ's suffering and death.
The only way which God could demonstrate that the wages of sin is death was to allow His Son to go through this torture. The agony which Christ suffered is the same agony which the wicked will experience. It was not that God was torturing His Son, but sin was.
If God had allowed Satan and his hosts to die, it would not have been clear to those watching that their death was the inevitable result of sin. That is, it would have appeared that God was executing them, which is exactly what Satan was accusing God of. Christ's death showed that Satan's accusations against God were false. After Christ's death it became safe for God to allow Satan and those who side with him to die withouth an "evil seed of doubt" to arise.
The Spirit of Prophesy tells us that believing in Christ involves more than people usually think. It involves three things:
1) Appreciating the cost of our salvation.
2) Recognizing that we individually are guilty of Christ's death.
3) Having an intelligent understanding that by faith in Christ we may overcome sin.
The cross provides all the evidence we need. It demonstrates that God is righteous, and innocent of all Satan's accusations. It clarifies the issues of the Great Controversy, and accomplishes the victory, showing that the principles of God's government are indeed love and truth. It makes clear the beauty of God's character, and that attractive lovliness leads us to follow Him, not out of fear, nor hope of reward, but out of admiration, appreciation and gratitude.
The only way which God could demonstrate that the wages of sin is death was to allow His Son to go through this torture. The agony which Christ suffered is the same agony which the wicked will experience. It was not that God was torturing His Son, but sin was.
If God had allowed Satan and his hosts to die, it would not have been clear to those watching that their death was the inevitable result of sin. That is, it would have appeared that God was executing them, which is exactly what Satan was accusing God of. Christ's death showed that Satan's accusations against God were false. After Christ's death it became safe for God to allow Satan and those who side with him to die withouth an "evil seed of doubt" to arise.
The Spirit of Prophesy tells us that believing in Christ involves more than people usually think. It involves three things:
1) Appreciating the cost of our salvation.
2) Recognizing that we individually are guilty of Christ's death.
3) Having an intelligent understanding that by faith in Christ we may overcome sin.
The cross provides all the evidence we need. It demonstrates that God is righteous, and innocent of all Satan's accusations. It clarifies the issues of the Great Controversy, and accomplishes the victory, showing that the principles of God's government are indeed love and truth. It makes clear the beauty of God's character, and that attractive lovliness leads us to follow Him, not out of fear, nor hope of reward, but out of admiration, appreciation and gratitude.
Posted By: Daryl
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/07/05 11:14 PM
I think the EGW quotes that Rosangela provided says it all.
One quote clearly states that Christ suffered "the penalty of man's transgressions of the Father's law."
Note what the penalty was in the other quote, also provided by Rosangela, "The displeasure of the Father for sin and its penalty which was death,...."
In other words, the penalty for sin is suffering and death; not suffering alone, but suffering and death as stated by EGW in Rosangela's post, "Salvation has been purchased for them by the suffering and death of the Son of God."
The words, "It is finished" covers His suffering and His death. Of course, He couldn't say "It is finished" after He died, thus the reason for saying it upon His death as clearly stated in John 19:30 which says, "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost."
One quote clearly states that Christ suffered "the penalty of man's transgressions of the Father's law."
Note what the penalty was in the other quote, also provided by Rosangela, "The displeasure of the Father for sin and its penalty which was death,...."
In other words, the penalty for sin is suffering and death; not suffering alone, but suffering and death as stated by EGW in Rosangela's post, "Salvation has been purchased for them by the suffering and death of the Son of God."
The words, "It is finished" covers His suffering and His death. Of course, He couldn't say "It is finished" after He died, thus the reason for saying it upon His death as clearly stated in John 19:30 which says, "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost."
Posted By: Tom
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/09/05 01:03 AM
When Jesus said, "It is finished" to what was He referring? That is, what was finished?
Posted By: Daryl
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/09/05 05:00 AM
quote:What are those dying words? "It is finished." Those words signify the completion of his sacrifice as the Lamb of God for you and for me.
Amid the convulsions of nature are heard by the amazed spectators the dying words of the Man of Calvary." {PH169 10.3}
Posted By: Tom
Re: "It Is Finished"?? - 03/09/05 08:14 AM
Just you and me?