Seven Present Truth Questions for Laodiceans

1. Who is Laodicea?

2. Whom does the angel represent?

3. What is meant by being wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked?

4. What is it to be "lukewarm"?

5. Why does God prefer one either cold or hot rather than lukewarm?

6. What is the eyesalve?

7. Should Laodicea fail to repent, how would her shame be uncovered?

Let us address the first three questions now.

The Revelation, chapters 2 and 3, describes the condition of each of the seven churches the last of which is the Laodicean. These churches, admittedly, portray the Christian church in seven different periods; the seventh, Laodicea, depicting her in the period just before the "harvest," the last in which the "wheat and tares" are comingled, and the one in which she is to experience the separation of the bad from among the good (Matt. 13 :30, 47-49).

Since in her every section, the church must be true to her name (it alone being her identification), we shall therefore consider the question:

Who is Laodicea?

Laodicea may be infallibly recognized amidst the many "isms" of Christendom by the work she is doing--declaring the judgment. Indeed, this mark of identification is pointed out by the very name Laodicea, compounded of the two Greek words lao and dekei, the one meaning "people," also "speak," the other meaning "judgment," the two in one meaning the people declaring judgment.

The church therefore, which declares, "Fear God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come" (Rev. 14:7), is evidently the one called Laodicea. And it is almost as well known outside Seventh-day Adventist circles as within, that the Seventh-day Adventist church is endeavoring to carry the judgment message of Revelation 14:7, and is therefore unchallenged in her claim to the title, Laodicea.

Since, therefore, the Seventh-day Adventist church is the only one proclaiming the judgment, and since each of the seven messages is addressed to the angel of the respective churches, the message to Laodicea is accordingly addressed

To the Seventh-day Adventist Angel.

According to Revelation 1:20, the "candlesticks" symbolize the churches, and the "stars" the angels (leaders) who have charge over the churches. Being the attendants of the churches, the angels are thus seen to be the ministry, whose responsibility is to have the lamps trimmed, filled with oil, and burning brightly, so that the church may give light to all about her.

Accordingly, as the Laodicean angel, him to whom the condemnatory message is sent, is symbolical of the ministry in Laodicea, he should consequently be the more anxious to discover where the trouble lies, for he is, says the Lord,

Wretched, Miserable, Poor, Blind, and Naked.

With a ministry wretched, miserable, poor blind, and naked, what church (candlestick) could possibly stay lighted? And with her light thus gone out or but flickering dimly, how could she lighten the world as God has set her to do?

(Is this not SO TRUE? With a leadership that allows our hospitals to perform abortion upon demand, gay and lesbian churches, shunning of dress reform, diet reform, etc, and many more un-Biblical ways, to exist among His church!)

Through the eyes of the True Witness, therefore, the tragedy of Laodicea is starkly seen--"sleeping preachers preaching to a sleeping people" (Testimonies, Vol. 2, p. 337) while a sin-benighted world plunges on hell-bent in its darkness! O what a piteous plight! And yet it is so utterly overlooked!

With both ministry and laity in such a pitiful state of darkness, it is clear to be seen that though the Laodicean church is the last in the order of the seven churches, God cannot through her lighten the world and prepare His people for the Kingdom when she is in darkness and unprepared herself. Hence the necessity of a new order, a new ministry, as predicted in Testimonies, Vol. 5, p. 80, and in Zephaniah 3:11, 12. (We can add PK, p.725)

Then it will come to pass that "only those who have withstood temptation in the strength of the Mighty One, will be permitted to act a part in proclaiming it [the Third Angel's Message] when it shall have swelled into the Loud Cry."--The Review and Herald, No. 19, 1908.

In the light of these facts, the prophetic message to the angel of the Laodiceans must obviously be brought and proclaimed by someone other than the angel himself. But this, of course, is the very thing that neither the ministry nor the laity expect or wish to happen. For the sake of the faithful, nevertheless, it is happening.


So since God's Word says that the ministry of the Laodicean church is wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked, and that neither they nor the laity are aware of the fact, it lends heavy emphasis to the statements: "Sleeping preachers preaching to a sleeping people!" (Testimonies, Vol. 2. p. 337); "the message of the True Witness finds the people of God in a sad deception, yet honest in that deception."--Testimonies, Vol. 3, p. 253.

Although they are in this horrible predicament, one which should make them tremble and fear, and give anything to get out of, yet they continue--

Lukewarm--Neither Cold Nor Hot. (Answerer, no. 1, p.10-14)

(Next week we'll look at the other four questions)

All Christians need to look seriously at the Laodicean Message.

HISTORICAL POINT OF INTEREST:

The seventh-day Sabbath was still observed more or less sacredly by the mass of Gentile Christians for centuries after the death of Christ, until by the machinations of the Roman Catholic Church, it was treated with indignity and contempt. Finally, all who observed it were placed under a curse by the Catholic Council of Laodicea, AD. 364. {1904 GIB, CHS 190.2}
The Council of Laodicea, A.D. 364, decreed the observance of Sunday, and anathematized the keeping of the Sabbath. Then the Council of Orleans, A.D. 538, Sunday labor in the country was prohibited.

WHO IS LAODICEA

We know something that happens during the Laodicea age -- in the last church age the seventh-day Sabbath again becomes a prominent issue. And soon, in the near future, Sunday will again be imposed upon the people.

So who is Laodicea?

To say it is exclusively and only the Seventh-day Adventist Church is putting blinders on. All the church ages in Revelation two and three describe Christianity throughout the last 2000 years, none zero in on one small segment while excluding the large majority of Christianity-- thus the seventh church concerns CHRISTIANITY as well.

The SDA pioneers in the early years understood this. They looked at those who refused to accept Christ’s sanctifying work in the heavenly sanctuary, and those who refused to accept God’s Ten Commandments as God’s law complete with the seventh-day Sabbath, as those who represented “Laodicea”.

But through the Spirit of Prophecy, they were told to stop thinking they were special, they too were infected with the Laodicean problem, and that they needed the message to Laodicea just as badly as the rest of Christendom. In fact, the more light one receives while remaining in the complacent self-righteous state, the more serious the condition.
So yes, the Laodicean condition in the SDA church is a very serious problem!

The problem with Laodicea is that the gospel is not being embraced. Laodiceans don’t seem to recognize their desperate need of a Savior. They are complacent in their self-righteousness.

Many non-Adventist Christians see Laodicea as aptly describing the condition of Christianity in the world today. The type of church actually dominating on earth today which often calls itself the seeker friendly church has books filling Christian bookstores with self-help Laodicean type eye salve. They believe they are going to bring light for blind eyes and bring in a kingdom on earth using eye salve made by human ideas. Laodicea says she can see (with help from her world famous eye salve) but she is spiritually blind.
Laodicean teachers give a gospel to Christianity that is devoid of the true power of Christ. The power that can actually truly change lives. They believe not only in their own righteousness, but also in future riches and prosperity of an earthly kingdom, and that their lukewarm Christian teaching, which contains no true salvation message, is going to convert the world to Christ.

The message to the Laodiceans is an urgent call to forsake self-righteousness, self complacency, that senses no recognized need for a Savior, to open their eyes to their great need, and come to Christ.

The sanctifying message of the sanctuary and Christ our High Priest, as well as the restoration of all of God’s ten commandments went out to the world
It was not a matter of accepting any human person – it was a matter of accepting the Biblical Sabbath which is a sign of Christ’s sanctifying power (Ez. 20:12) and acknowledging our need for a Savior and depending totally upon Him.


A non-Adventist has this to say about “Laodicea”.
Now be assured, this writer is NOT talking about the Shepherd Rod group, here, but what struck me is that he recognized a movement in the world that believes in a “kingdom” prior to Christ's coming, which kind of reminded me of a SR teaching.

Also some of things mentioned are also sweeping into the Adventist Church.


But back to the actual message to Laodicea --

Laodicea –Adventists and other Christians, -- need Christ and His righteousness, with HIM, and with HIM alone will they have the faith, the righteousness, the discernment to overcome.

Only as they are anchored in Christ and His truth will they stand through the judgment and be counted as citizens of the heavenly kingdom.

Without HIM they are blind, poor, naked and wretched.
They leave Christ outside, sadly knocking as they go about thinking they have it all together, believing in their own righteousness.

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Jesus said He is going to "spew SDA out of his mouth" (Messages to the Church, THE Revelation of Jesus Christ). Isn't that enough present truth to make your heart quake?

///

Only if you believe the shepherd rod interpretation. (presented by GL&L)


However, the Revelation itself does not say that. It does not narrow the prophecy down to one denomination.

Laodicea is the "church age" in existence during the pre-advent judgment.
This judgment that distinguishes between true and mere "professing" Christians includes everyone who professes to be a follower of Christ.


There are two paths open in the message to Laodicea. Everyone has a choice.

Those who are comfortable in the lukewarm condition are the ones who need to "quake".

Those who heed the invitation in the message to Laodicea will "sit with Christ upon His throne" -- the greatest honor and promise given in the messages to the seven churches.

Finishing our 7 question study ---

When one finds himself in a climate which is neither cold nor hot, but lukewarm, a temperature desired and sought by all, there he basks as a pauper become a prince! So it is with the Laodiceans, as represented in prophecy, though their supposed riches are nothing but a death trap!

To rescue one from such a terrible deception is a task which calls for the utmost wisdom not only because the victim is blindly inured to the perilous condition he is in, while his rescuers are endeavoring to save him from perishing, but also because he considers them as his enemies false prophets, instead of as his friends and deliverers, messengers from God!


From the life line, the saving message which they pleadingly hold forth to him, he recoils. And consequently by his attitude against them, he shouts: Away, away, I am rich and increased with goods: I have need of nothing; I have all the truth.

"I am satisfied with my position. I have set my stakes, and I will not be moved away from my position whatever may come."--Testimonies on Sabbath-School Work, p. 65; Counsels on Sabbath School Work, p. 28.

In protesting that they are not wretched (not unhappy), not miserable (not troubled), not poor (not in need of truth), not blind (not benighted or illiterate), not naked (not without the righteousness of Christ), the Laodiceans are contradicting the True Witness, rejecting His counsel, and discrediting His remedy--

The Eyesalve.

As only the "salve" will heal them from their deadly Laodicean malady, hence if they fail to avail themselves of the cure (by searching for truth as for hidden treasure) and to apply it (to repent), they will be spued out. O, Brother, Sister, will you not call for the "salve"? or will you continue in your wretchedness, miserableness, poverty, blindness, and nakedness, and thus compel Him to spue you out and to


Uncover Your Shame?

That your shame, Brethren, might not appear to all, God has long forborne to expose to the world the sins which you have cherished and kept under cover. Not forever, though, will He forbear.

So for your soul's sake, argue no longer that you have all the Truth; cease adding sin to sin; repent, and return to Him; He will just as gladly accept you and make a feast for you as did the father in the parable welcome back his prodigal son and make a feast for him

Be not like the Jew. But open your heart; cast out its pride, its prejudice, and its self-conceit; let these not deprive you of eternal life at such a late hour as this. If you repeat the mistake of the Jews, your shame and your loss will be as much greater than theirs as are your light and your opportunities and privileges. Yea, beyond comparison!

So do not fail, we plead with you, to end your long Laodicean sickness and poverty, and no longer imagine that you are

Rich, Increased With Goods.

Never do you even so much as intimate that you have all the buildings, all the institutions, all the money, all the workers, all the converts you need! Your only boast is of having no need of more truth!

This attitude, therefore, the Lord says, is the way in which you are saying, "I am rich and increased with goods, and have need of nothing." It is the source of your trouble, and the thing which He expects you to confess and to repent of.

The angel's (the ministry's) mistaken claim of being rich and increased with goods and in need of nothing, does not make him a liar, but rather shows him to be a victim of ignorance and delusion.

But his thinking that he has and knows all the Truth, makes his condition even more perilous than a liar's, for a liar knows that he is lying. O awake, Brother, Sister, awake! awake!

Do As Did Nathaniel.

Come and see!

See what? Laodiceans, rich and increased with goods, and in need of nothing, with the excuse that the need to take care of the material things of life (Luke 14:15-19) forbids their accepting the invitation?

Indeed not!

See the Laodiceans from the streets and lanes--"the poor, and the maimed and the halt, and the blind" (Luke 14:21), gladly availing themselves of the remedy!

But, alas, not all who come, remain, for "when any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side."

Be not like him, but make the effort required to understand the Truth. And others, "when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word," are offended. These are they "that received the seed into stony places."

Neither be like them; be rooted in the Truth. "But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty." Matt. 13:19-23.

Though the "bad" along with the "good" are still coming (for we are yet in the period in which the wheat and the tares, the good and the bad fish commingle), you need not be of the tares or of the "bad fish."

Be of the wheat, do as the "good": lay aside your own thoughts and ways, then take the Lord's, for He says: "...My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways...For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts." Isa. 55:8, 9.

And finally, never be like a Pharisee who can see the mote in his brother's eye, but cannot see the beam in his own (Matt. 7:3). For after all "Who art thou?" asks the Lord. Art thou thyself not a Laodicean? How "judgest" thou "another man's
servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand." Rom. 14:4.

Never mind the other fellow, Brethren; you have barely enough time to look after yourself. And moreover, do not measure the Truth with the rod of man, but with the Rod of God: "Hear ye the Rod, and [Him] Who hath appointed it" (Mic. 6:9), urges the Lord.

Will you not take His counsel? If you will, then without further delay, send your name and address for Present Truth literature--the feast which, though worth everything, will cost you nothing. And besides being the only cure for your Laodiceanism, it will thrill and satisfy your hungry soul with something truly rich and extraordinary !

Then all of us together "shall have spiritual eyesight to discern the inner courts of the celestial temple. We shall catch the themes of song and thanksgiving of the heavenly choir round about the throne.

When Zion shall arise and shine, her light will be most penetrating and precious songs of praise and thanksgiving will be heard in the assemblies of the saints....As we apply the golden eye-salve, we shall see the glories beyond.

Faith will cut through the heavy shadow of Satan, and we shall see our Advocate offering up the incense of His own merits in our behalf. When we see this as it is, as the Lord desires us to see it we shall be filled with a sense of the immensity and diversity of the love of God."--Testimonies, Vol. 6, p. 368.
(Answerer, vol.1 p. 14-20)

Interesting --
Houteff's whole "answer" to those supposed "present truth questions" totally misses the mark.

In his rendition (as posted by GL&L) of the message to Laodicea it's all about calling the Adventist church "Laodicea" because they recognized his message as error, and thus refuse to accept it.

It's all about him and his supposed message of "the kingdom".
Yes, it is mixed in with EGW phrases, and bits of Bible texts, using words that we can agree with, woven to give it a pious ring, but still if you look closely, underneath it all -- it's all about him and his version of the kingdom message.

There is really nothing substantial there of the true message to Laodicea.

That in itself should be a clear indication of whether his message is truth or error.


Interesting -- we need to ask Houteff
"Who art thou?" asks the Lord. Art thou thyself not a Laodicean? How "judgest" thou "another man's servant?



What we need to do however, is TEST the message --
What I see above is NOT the message to Laodicea which we need.


What is the Laodicean message?

First, what is the Laodicean condition?

It pictures a people who pride themselves in their possession of spiritual knowledge and advantages, but instead of submitting to God's cleansing power their hearts are full of rebellion, ingratitude, and forgetfulness of God. Their religion consists of hollow formalism, and hypocritical insincerity, in which there is no real connection with Christ.
They are very dogmatic about having the "assurance of salvation", and "the truth" but fail to exhibit the fruits of righteousness.

Paul also writes of Christianity in the last days as:
"For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,...lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: 1 Tim 3:3-5


In plain words --
Laodicea has a serious SPIRITUAL disease that has a sophisticated religious exterior, but internally is devoid of Christ's righteousness.

So what is the solution?
It's NOT some new theories about a literal temporal earthly kingdom.
It's NOT a re-interpretation of Rev. 13 beast's heads as the reformers (including EGW as the seventh head).
It's not a message that Sunday laws are not to be a test for Adventists.
All those "Houteff teachings" are NOT the answer or the solution.

So what is the solution?
Is it to repent that we didn't accept Houteff's messages?

Or is to repent of our sins and turn to Christ with a contrite heart concerning our self centered interests, our self satisfaction, and failures to make Christ first in our lives?

My friend -- it is the latter --

Buy of Christ that precious gold -- the faith OF Jesus can be ours, but only as we are connected to Him.

Buy of Christ that white remnant -- the righteousness He alone can give us. Then righteousness will be in every action we perform; our greatest desire will be to do the will of God; and thus the righteousness of the law of God will be fulfilled in us, as we walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

This message isn't just for a special few -- it is the gospel message that is to go to the whole world!

The Revelator pictures Christ standing outside of the heart's door. Laodiceans believe in Christ, but they keep Him just outside of their lives.

The message urges us to throw open that door, and let Him in, make Him first, last and everything in our lives, Lord of all.

Does a person who is Laodicean know that he/she is Laodicean?

Excellent point and question.

Honestly they really don't. The Lord says, "..and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor , blind and naked-" (Rev. 3:17)

We are all thinking-"it's the other guy".

When in reality it is ALL who call themselves SDA yet do not believe they need more truth. There is a message from the Lord that is held in contempt we must kneel in prayer whole heartedly and ask for His help.

"God means that testing truth shall be brought to the front and become a subject of examination and discussion, even if it is through the contempt place upon it. (Testimonies, vol. 5, p.453)

"What greater deception can come upon human minds than a confidence that they are right when they are all wrong! The message of the True Witness finds the people of God in a sad deception, yet honest in that deception. They know not that their condition is deplorable in the sight of God.

While those addressed are flattering themselves that they are in an exalted spiritual condition, the message of the True Witness breaks their security by the startling denunciation of their true condition of spiritual blindness, poverty, and wretchedness. The testimony, so cutting and severe, cannot be a mistake, for it is the True Witness who speaks, and His testimony must be correct." (Testimonies, vol. 3, p.253)

“But we see that the God of heaven sometimes commissions men to teach that which is regarded as contrary to the established doctrines.

Because those who were once the depositories of truth became unfaithful to their sacred trust, the Lord chose others who would receive the bright beams of the Sun of Righteousness, and would advocate truths that were not in accordance with the ideas of the religious leaders.

And then these leaders in the blindness of their minds, give full sway to what is supposed to be righteous indignation against the ones who have set aside cherished fables.

They act like men who have lost their reason. They do not consider the possibility that they themselves have not rightly understood the Word. They will not open their eyes to discern the fact that they have misinterpreted and misapplied the Scriptures, and have built up false theories, calling them fundamental doctrines of the faith.”-(Testimonies to Ministers, pp. 69, 70)

So it would appear that although Christ found a harlot, miserable, blind and naked, He has pity and compassion upon her.

So much empathy, that He wishes to redeem her, to marry her.
Reform is wrought by His goodness, longsuffering & mercy.

As Son of the Living God, He cannot present to His Father a miserable bride, one lacking discernment (blind) or dressed as a harlot, dissolute & unfaithful. No never! Christ's entire life mission has been to find, redeem and marry a virtuous woman. Anything else is failure and a victory for Satan.
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The hardest person to reach is one who thinks they have no need. This can affect people on many different levels of experience, from the "once saved it doesn't matter what I do" concept, to the strict conservative who looks to all his religious based accomplishments for security.

The Laodicean Message is not a picture of God disgusted and ready to spit out His people, but rather it is a loud wake-up call. People NEED a Savior or they will loose out on eternal life! The message is an urgent call to church members to realize their great need of a Savior. Not just a theoretical Savior, but a personal Savior Who can give them everything they need for salvation if they just let Him fully into their lives.

John 16:8-14 tells us that Jesus sends the Holy Spirit, to convict people of sin, lead them into truth, and to Jesus.

Are people listening and responding?
That is a question for each individual to answer in their hearts before God.

gordonb1 --"So it would appear that although Christ found a harlot, miserable, blind and naked, He has pity and compassion upon her."

That is true to a certain extent. However when we read the verse (3:16) we see His solemn promise. So while He has compassion , He has limits set. Those warnings, we see, are not to the world, but to the Laodiceans, for being "lukewarm."

gordonb1- "As Son of the Living God, He cannot present to His Father a miserable bride, one lacking discernment (blind) or dressed as a harlot, dissolute & unfaithful. No never! Christ's entire life mission has been to find, redeem and marry a virtuous woman. Anything else is failure and a victory for Satan."

Excellent. Very well said. Thanks.

The message to the Laodiceans offered hope to those who heed the message and a stern warning to those who do not.

The lesser light did not mix words when giving the Laodicean message. She applied it to Seventh-day Adventists long before there was a SR:

One couldn't ask for a simpler explanation.

This debunks the 'once saved, always saved' theology.
(At denominational level: 'Once favoured, always favoured.')

All that remains to be known:

What is great light, and how does one walk in that light?
________________________

"What is great light, and how does one walk in that light?"

We know that "angels" bring messages.Light is certainly the truth in those messages. Spirit of prophecy declares a future message to the church--

"Several have written to me, inquiring if the message of justification by faith is the third angel’s message, and I have answered, “It is the third angel’s message in verity.” The prophet declares, “And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.”

Brightness, glory, and power are to be connected with the third angel’s message, and conviction will follow wherever it is preached in demonstration of the Spirit. How will any of our brethren know when this light shall come to the people of God? As yet, we certainly have not seen the light that answers to this description.

God has light for his people, and all who will accept it will see the sinfulness of remaining in a lukewarm condition; they will heed the counsel of the True Witness when he says, “Be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.” (Review and Herald, April 1, 1890)

"We are to throw aside our narrow, selfish plans, remembering that we have a work of the largest magnitude and highest importance. In doing this work we are sounding the first, second, and third angel's messages, and are thus being prepared for the coming of that other angel from heaven who is to lighten the earth with his glory." (Test. for the Church, vol. 6, p.406)

There is a message that will be almost "entirely dis-regarded", from the True Witness to the Laodiceans

"I asked the meaning of the shaking I had seen. I was shown that it would be caused by the straight testimony called forth by the counsel of the true Witness to the Laodiceans. It will have its effect upon the heart of the receiver of the testimony, and it will lead him to exalt the standard and pour forth the straight truth. This straight testimony some will not bear. They will rise up against it, and this will cause a shaking among God's people.

I saw that the testimony of the true Witness has not been half heeded. The solemn testimony upon which the destiny of the church hangs, has been lightly esteemed, if not entirely disregarded. This testimony must work deep repentance, and all that truly receive it, will obey it, and be purified. (Early Writings, p.270)

"Those who cannot impartially examine the evidences of a position that differs from theirs, are not fit to teach in any department of God's work." (RH, Feb.18, 1890)


"We need never expect that when the Lord has light for His people, Satan will stand calmly by and make no
effort to prevent them from receiving it. He will work upon minds to excite distrust and jealousy and
unbelief. Let us beware that we do not refuse the light God sends, because it does not come in a way to
please us. Let not God's blessing be turned away from us because we know not the time of our
visitation.

If there are any who do not see and accept the light themselves, let them not stand in the way
of others. Let it not be said of this highly favoured people, as of the Jews when the good news of the
kingdom was preached to them: "Ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye
hindered." {5 Test. p.728}

This unwanted and lightly "esteemed" message (Light) is what causes the "shaking" among God's people. This light will be unbearable for many.

Remember as Laodiceans, we "know not" that we are deceived.Our only remedy is to fall on the rock of Jesus and be "broken". Admit we need more truth. Admit that we have a message that is truth and is the "lightly esteemed" message.

One great clue about the last message is that we know it will be for revival and reformation.

"The message of the fall of Babylon, as given by the second angel, is repeated, with the additional mention of the corruptions which have been entering the churches since 1844. The work of this angel comes in at the right time to join in the last great work of the third angel's message as it swells to a loud cry. And the people of God are thus prepared to stand in the hour of temptation, which they are soon to meet. I saw a great light resting upon them, and they united to fearlessly proclaim the third angel's message." (EW, p.277)

Is Laodicea to give the third angel's message?

How can a church that is poor, wretched, miserable, blind, and naked do that? (at least Christ does not say they are deaf on top of all their problems)

What are the sins that have crept into the church since 1844?

What does that have to do with the peculiar people who have taken their church mainstream protestant?

When is the "right time" for the last angel (messenger) to come? Are we there yet? What does the last angel's message have to do with the other three?

Hello brother,

on your questions--

"Is Laodicea to give the third angel's message?"

Certainly not. The Loud Cry is coming very shortly and Inspiration tells us the following.

"Only those who have withstood temptation in the strength of the mighty one will be permitted to act a part in proclaiming it (3rd angel message) when it shall have swelled into the Loud Cry." (R & H, Nov. 19, 1908)

Laodiceans are very shortly to be "sprued out".

"Those who have rendered supreme homage to "science falsely so called" will not be the leaders then. Those who have trusted to intellect, genius, or talent will not then
stand at the head of rank and file. They did not keep pace with the light. Those who have proved themselves unfaithful will not then be entrusted with the flock.

In the last solemn work few great men will be engaged. They are self-sufficient, independent of God, and He cannot use them. The Lord has faithful servants, who in the shaking, testing time will be disclosed to view. There are precious ones now hidden who have not bowed the knee to Baal." (Test. for the Church vol. 5, p.81-82)

"How can a church that is poor, wretched, miserable, blind, and naked do that?"

Right, there is No way.

"What are the sins that have crept into the church since 1844?"

Many. Here's just a partial list.

1. Lack of reverence in the house of God: Isa. 56:7; Volume 5, pages 492-500.
2. Following the fashions of the world: Isa. 3:16; Volume 1, pages 269, 270; Volume 4, page 632; Volume 3, page 379; Volume 5, page 78; Volume 1, pages 189-191; Volume 1, pages 135, 136; Volume 4, page 631.

3. Spending money for that which is not bread (health reform): Isa. 55:2; Volume 5, page 197; Isa. 56:12. (Many references can be given from the testimonies on this subject, but space will not permit them here.)

4. Use of tithe--school teachers (those who teach the Scriptures)are not paid by the tithe as they should have been): Volume 6, page 215.

5. The house of God is made into a house of merchandise by buying and selling denominational publications of all sorts: Isa. 58:3; Isa. 56:7; Volume 1, pages 471, 472; Volume 8, page 250.

6. High prices in our institutions while they should be below current expenses: Volume 8, page 142; Isa. 56:12; Isa. 58.

7. Disbelief in the Spirit of Prophecy: If not acknowledged by words, it is admitted by works.

8. Failed to inform church members of Elijah's message: Mal. 4:5; Testimonies to Ministers, page 475; Volume 4, pages 402, 403.

9. Abraham obeyed God in all that He commanded, and was very careful even to the smallest particulars; thus it was counted to him for righteousness, but we have not done so. See Gen. 26:5; Gen. 15:6.

10. The promise of the land (heavenly Canaan) is to Abraham's seed. Jesus said, "If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. [If ye are not the children of Abraham] Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do." See John 8:39-44. (By doing the works of Abraham), "Then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." Gal. 3:29

11. Insisting that we have all the truth and have need of nothing.

12. Turning down Scriptural claims without investigation as to its light.

Volume 5 page 211: "The abominations for which the faithful ones were sighing and crying were all that could be discerned by finite eyes, but by far the worst sins, those which provoked the jealousy of the pure and holy God, were unrevealed."

"What does that have to do with the peculiar people who have taken their church mainstream protestant?"

Please reword this question.

"When is the "right time" for the last angel (messenger) to come? Are we there yet? What does the last angel's message have to do with the other three?"

Th right time is when the church is free from sinners in the midst. There are tremendous Scriptures and Inspired statements pointing to a church purification (which we have posted time and again).

One of the reasons we "know" that we are not proclaiming the Loud cry right now is because of the "Achans" in our midst.

"If the presence of one Achan was sufficient to weaken the whole camp of Israel, can we be surprised at the little success which attends our efforts when every church and almost every family has its Achan?" (Testimonies, vol. 5, p. 157)

We are not there yet for sure. How can we be when everyone is still permitted to speak their so-called message from the Lord, to the world, yet still be non-overcomers?(smokers, drinkers, careless Sabbath keeping,etc) ONLY overcomers will be permitted. And who permits them ? The Lord through the "closing working for the church" the sealing of the servants (144,000)(Testimonies, vol. 3, p.266). These are those who will be found overcoming.

One question we as honest seeking "truth seekers" have to ask ourselves -- How can the Lord use the current SDA leadership when they openly back things like abortions upon demand, gay churches, and other abominations? He MUST take the reins into His own hands if there is ever to be a faithful true powerful church to finish the work. And His word says there will be--

"Clad in the armor of Christ's righteousness, the church is to enter upon her final conflict. "Fair as the moon, clear as the sun, and terrible as an army with banners," she is to go forth into all the world, conquering and to conquer." (Prophets and Kings, p.725)

In speaking of the time when Ezekiel 9 and Rev. 7 sealings shall intersect we read-- "This sealing of the servants of God is the same that was shown to Ezekiel in vision. John also had been a witness of this most startling revelation" (Test. to Ministers, p.445)

This is why Inspiration told us to strive with "ALL power God has given us" to be part of ONE GROUP --144,000 (R & H, March 9, 1905)

Ex 21:22 "If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman’s husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine."

That is not an eye for an eye or a life for a life.

Does God view everything as we do?

"Does God view everything as we do?"

As we should know, He points out something that shows us the difference--

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." (Isaiah 55:9)

That being said, all those who "know" Him (ie. truly keep His Commandments 1 John 2:3-4) are frequently "supping" with Him and as such can see things as He sees them. Because we see that "Sup" occurs as He "comes into us"(Rev. 3:20).

Further, we also know that we shall "know of the doctrine" if we --do His will. (John 7:17) This shows we have the Truth detector in our midst and can view things properly.