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Re: I have some questions
[Re: James Saptenno]
#123915
03/08/10 05:14 PM
03/08/10 05:14 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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BTW, I have a serious question and need your advice.
In northern part of the world like Canada, sunset is very late at night and emerge very early in the morning. Some times there is only 2 hours dark night, is that correct?
Then, how are you keeping your Sabbath day? Still 24 hours? if so, what is your time started and finished> or, just as according the sunset and sunrise? This mean, some time you will have only 2 hours Sabath, and maybe in Arctic area, no Sabbath at all? Most Sabbath-keepers in regions like that observe the Sabbath from 6pm to 6pm.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123935
03/09/10 12:04 AM
03/09/10 12:04 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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T:The books of heaven faithfully record the character of each one.
MM:I'm not sure how this answers my questions. Here they are again. Please explain to me how it answers each one. Thank you.
1. Do you believe "every sin" (see quotes above) we commit is recorded in the books in heaven? The "books" at the time Revelation was written would have been scrolls, which is what John saw. I'm not sure what EGW saw, probably books such as she was familiar with. We now know of more sophisticated technologies. I'm sure the life records of each one are somehow recorded by God, and this is what will be used in judgment as the case of each one is studied. 2. Or, do you believe certain sins are not recorded . . .
3. that they do not require repentance . . .
4. that they do not require writing pardon next to them in the books in heaven? I don't think any of this matters. Heaven faithfully records the life history and character of each one. The record is not the important thing, except as it faithfully reflects reality. This is the point I've been stressing. The point is if we have any cherished sins, that will ruin our characters. Look what she said in context, and I'll believe you'll see that this was the point.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#123950
03/09/10 06:48 PM
03/09/10 06:48 PM
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SDA
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Tom, you still haven't answered the four questions above. Please do so. I understand you believe character, not sins recorded, is what matters. I agree. However, Ellen repeatedly wrote that "every sin" is recorded in the books in heaven. You seem to disagree.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123959
03/10/10 03:38 AM
03/10/10 03:38 AM
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
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MM.
BTW, in your comments you quoted a lot of EGW quotes.
Do you believe that her writings is always correct and in harmony with the apostles, always biblical?
In His love Without a doubt! What about you? Do you believe Jesus spoke through her like He did the apostles? Or, do you think when explaining salvation truths she at times weaved in her own uninspired opinions thus compromising the truth? I think, I have read some comments that she some times changes her mind or her view, i.e.: about justification, about Christ' humanity, etc. Thus, when she wrote some thing and later she change her mind, how could we believe that all what she said or wrote is in accordance with the truth, and the will of God? Is biblical? Compare to the bible writers, their writing is canon, I believe 100% correct of about each topic,for it is directly influenced by the Spirit, but EGW, I believe some times wrote her own view, which is not under the Spirit influence. In His love
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123960
03/10/10 03:40 AM
03/10/10 03:40 AM
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OP
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
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BTW, I have a serious question and need your advice.
In northern part of the world like Canada, sunset is very late at night and emerge very early in the morning. Some times there is only 2 hours dark night, is that correct?
Then, how are you keeping your Sabbath day? Still 24 hours? if so, what is your time started and finished> or, just as according the sunset and sunrise? This mean, some time you will have only 2 hours Sabath, and maybe in Arctic area, no Sabbath at all? Most Sabbath-keepers in regions like that observe the Sabbath from 6pm to 6pm. Tks, I already though about it. In His love
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: James Saptenno]
#123971
03/10/10 04:26 PM
03/10/10 04:26 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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J: Do you believe that her writings is always correct and in harmony with the apostles, always biblical?
M: Without a doubt! What about you? Do you believe Jesus spoke through her like He did the apostles? Or, do you think when explaining salvation truths she at times weaved in her own uninspired opinions thus compromising the truth?
J: I think, I have read some comments that she some times changes her mind or her view, i.e.: about justification, about Christ' humanity, etc. Thus, when she wrote some thing and later she change her mind, how could we believe that all what she said or wrote is in accordance with the truth, and the will of God? Is biblical? Compare to the bible writers, their writing is canon, I believe 100% correct of about each topic,for it is directly influenced by the Spirit, but EGW, I believe some times wrote her own view, which is not under the Spirit influence. It would help if you posted a few of her salvation statements you believe are erroneous and uninspired. I have never read anything she wrote of a salvation nature that is wrong or uninspired. It makes me wonder if you're misreading what she wrote like people who misread what James wrote in the Bible about justification. For example, do you believe James was inspired when he wrote, "Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only"? As you know, Paul wrote something that seems to contradict what James wrote - "A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith." So, which salvation statement is right? Or, are they both right? Could it be that people who believe one is right and the other is wrong are misreading what is written? Likewise, is it possible people do the same thing with Ellen White's salvation statements?
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123994
03/10/10 09:27 PM
03/10/10 09:27 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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I explained your question at length. I don't disagree with what Ellen White wrote. I explained what I think this means. Each person's character is faithfully recorded by some means that can be reviewed for judgment purposes. This is what I understand her to say. To say that there is some sin recorded which doesn't have "pardon" written against it means that there is a flaw in character that would prevent the person being judged from being happy in heaven. This person is against God and the principles of His government. This is person is among those described in GC 542. Could those whose lives have been spent in rebellion against God be suddenly transported to heaven and witness the high, the holy state of perfection that ever exists there,-- every soul filled with love, every countenance beaming with joy, enrapturing music in melodious strains rising in honor of God and the Lamb, and ceaseless streams of light flowing upon the redeemed from the face of Him who sitteth upon the throne,--could those whose hearts are filled with hatred of God, of truth and holiness, mingle with the heavenly throng and join their songs of praise? Could they endure the glory of God and the Lamb? No, no; years of probation were granted them, that they might form characters for heaven; but they have never trained the mind to love purity; they have never learned the language of heaven, and now it is too late. A life of rebellion against God has unfitted them for heaven. Its purity, holiness, and peace would be torture to them; the glory of God would be a consuming fire. They would long to flee from that holy place. They would welcome destruction, that they might be hidden from the face of Him who died to redeem them.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#124018
03/12/10 02:58 AM
03/12/10 02:58 AM
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SDA
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Posts: 22,256
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Tom, thank you for the dialog.
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