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Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: Colin] #132852
04/23/11 12:14 AM
04/23/11 12:14 AM
Rick H  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Colin
Originally Posted By: Rick H
Ok, then if you go in that direction, explain how Peter after accepting Christ and being 'Justified' aka "made righteous", cut off another mans ear, denied Christ, argued with Paul, didnt accept Gentiles till the vision. Peter was not instantly "made righteous", it was "counted unto him" by faith, and the process of "Sanctification" began.....is how it seems to read from scripture.

Peter confessed Christ as prompted by the Holy Spirit of the Father. We turn from the Spirit of Jesus when we sin, opting for the old covenant apart from God: doesn't change the reality of walking in the Spirit when we do. grin We have an advocate with the Father, and we are justified by the Spirit's presence whenever we repent and confess our sins.

The two covenants mean that each day we may and must choose between living with the Spirit or our own way, by our own will and strength - unsanctified will. Submitting to the Spirit is experiencing justification: what happens because of that submission is sanctification.


Ok, lets walk it through to see if we can come together on a understanding of the process...When sinners accept Christ and repent and confess, and usually they publically declare their acceptance of the pardon when they are baptized, they are Justified (Given Pardon) and their sins are remitted.
Mark 1:4
John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
re·mit·tedre·mit·ting
Definition of REMIT
2a : to release from the guilt or penalty of <remit sins>

Now as they go through their daily lives and fall into sin and temptation, they have to daily die to sin, and by faith their sins are covered by the righteousness of Christ. As we see in the following verse, we see the other side, as Jesus tells the Pharisees that they will die in their sin because of unbelief, they have no one to cover their sins with righteousness.

The Validity of Jesus’ Testimony
12 When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”
13 The Pharisees challenged him, “Here you are, appearing as your own witness; your testimony is not valid.”
14 Jesus answered, “Even if I testify on my own behalf, my testimony is valid, for I know where I came from and where I am going. But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going. 15 You judge by human standards; I pass judgment on no one. 16 But if I do judge, my decisions are right, because I am not alone. I stand with the Father, who sent me. 17 In your own Law it is written that the testimony of two men is valid. 18 I am one who testifies for myself; my other witness is the Father, who sent me.”
19 Then they asked him, “Where is your father?”
“You do not know me or my Father,” Jesus replied. “If you knew me, you would know my Father also.” 20 He spoke these words while teaching in the temple area near the place where the offerings were put. Yet no one seized him, because his time had not yet come.
21 Once more Jesus said to them, “I am going away, and you will look for me, and you will die in your sin. Where I go, you cannot come.”
22 This made the Jews ask, “Will he kill himself? Is that why he says, ‘Where I go, you cannot come’?”
23 But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am the one I claim to be,[a] you will indeed die in your sins.”

So those who are pardoned have to deal with the daily sin they come across or stumble or are snagged by evils snare. Those who believe are credited or covered by Christ righteousness for these, so righteousness is imputed to them, in the daily battle against Satans attacks.

im·put·edim·put·ing
Definition of IMPUTE
2: to credit to a person or a cause : attribute <our vices as well as our virtues have been imputed to bodily derangement


So the pardon is applied daily for the beliver. But now the believer has to die to sin and learn Christs righteousness, the Mind of Christ in them. They have to have their hearts and minds cleansed, so the Holy Spirit goes to do its work.

This is the imparted part of Christs righteousness, the sanctification which prepares us for eternal life with God.

Definition of IMPART
transitive verb
: to communicate the knowledge of : disclose <imparted my scheme to no one>
1 Corinthians 2:16
“For who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct him?” But we have the mind of Christ.

So we are pardoned for our sins, then Christs righteousness is imputted for our continuing battle with sin, and at the same time the knowledge of Christ righteousness is imparted, or brought into our mind and our passions/desires or heart are cleansed as sanctification happens within us.

Last edited by Rick H; 04/23/11 01:15 AM.
Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: Rick H] #144288
07/29/12 05:23 AM
07/29/12 05:23 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
It's good to come by time to time and enjoy the deep and heart lifting discussion here.

I agree with Rick H. explanation, but this seems against MM.

Imputed and imparted righteousness are simultaneous realities for those who experience genuine, thorough rebirth. Both the Thief and Paul (two extremes) were justified and sanctified the instant they experienced rebirth. Both were reborn with all the fruits of the Spirit, all the righteous. attributes of God's character. Not one was missing. The only difference between the two was the length of time each had to mature in the fruits of the Spirit after they experienced rebirth.

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: James Saptenno] #144311
07/30/12 05:51 AM
07/30/12 05:51 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
But isn't Imputed Righteousness of Christ alone through faith alone sufficient for us to be in heaven and eat the fruit of life?

If this is not sufficient, doesn't our effort to reach the goal of perfect sinless state in this sinful nature a "work" that adds to Christ finished work on the cross?

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: James Saptenno] #144312
07/30/12 07:24 AM
07/30/12 07:24 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Jakarta, Indonesia
if imparted righteousness achieved from a joint operation between the Spirit and our will, does this not negate Christ's finished work on the cross? I mean, don't we have something to boast? Is it pure faith without our works to add on it?

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: James Saptenno] #144314
07/30/12 01:58 PM
07/30/12 01:58 PM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
The thief on the cross was an excellent example of Christ' imputed righteousness that qualify a sinner believer for heaven. Sinner pardoned and earn the right for eternal life. Why do we search for some thing like perfect sinless character, which negates Christ work on the cross in order to be qualified for eternal life? Aren't we all like this thief on the cross, having nothing to offer except faith? And isn't for this reason Christ die for us? For we can do nothing but sinning? But he has forgiven us of all our sins, and our imperfection was clothed with His righteousness. This what happened with the thief on the cross. And if was qualified for heaven, why don't we?

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: James Saptenno] #144328
07/31/12 11:51 AM
07/31/12 11:51 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
The free gift of grace is God that justify the ungodly freely, and gives them eternal life. What a believer must present and acknowledge is his faith in Christ till the end.

The reward for laboring a life time in self sacrifice through a joint operation between the Spirit and our will, to achieve a sinless perfect character in order to be qualify for heaven, is not a free gift but a reward indeed. Does the bible support this view?

All I know that justification for eternal life is a free gift and not of works, based on faith, not a reward.

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: James Saptenno] #144340
08/01/12 08:43 PM
08/01/12 08:43 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
James, good points. We cannot earn salvation. But we can certainly prevent it.

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: Mountain Man] #144392
08/04/12 11:50 PM
08/04/12 11:50 PM
C
Colin  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
Justification by faith is our qualification for heaven.

Sanctification by faith is our fitness for heaven.

As RickH said, we receive them together, but the latter is a lifetime experience of character development rather than the instantaneous, perfect reality that the rebirth of justification is. Since sanctification is our preparation for heaven, it does not impinge on our qualification for heaven who is Christ alone.

Receiving the new mind of Christ, the rebirth of justification, is God and Christ indwelling us by their Spirit (Jn 14:23). Developing a Christlike character isn't a reward for us, but merely living out the truth of justification; thus, vindicating the truth of God in the great controversy. A Christlike character, perfectly righteous in God's own reckoning - not our own measurement, doesn't supplant our qualification in Jesus, who is in us by rebirth to qualify us, but is the ultimate proof that Jesus lives in us.

Imparted righteous is but the living experience of daily faith of a lifetime of the believer justification by faith in Jesus. Both are therefore essential to salvation.

Only the final generation will, in God's own good providence, experience perfect Christlikeness. The purpose is to end the great controversy in a full knowledge & practice of righteousness by faith. All saints of all time are qualified for heaven, but only the final generation will walk in to heaven without seeing death. Amen.

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: Colin] #144404
08/05/12 09:39 AM
08/05/12 09:39 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
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Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
Originally Posted By: Colin
Justification by faith is our qualification for heaven.

Sanctification by faith is our fitness for heaven.

As RickH said, we receive them together, but the latter is a lifetime experience of character development rather than the instantaneous, perfect reality that the rebirth of justification is. Since sanctification is our preparation for heaven, it does not impinge on our qualification for heaven who is Christ alone.

Receiving the new mind of Christ, the rebirth of justification, is God and Christ indwelling us by their Spirit (Jn 14:23). Developing a Christlike character isn't a reward for us, but merely living out the truth of justification; thus, vindicating the truth of God in the great controversy. A Christlike character, perfectly righteous in God's own reckoning - not our own measurement, doesn't supplant our qualification in Jesus, who is in us by rebirth to qualify us, but is the ultimate proof that Jesus lives in us.

Imparted righteous is but the living experience of daily faith of a lifetime of the believer justification by faith in Jesus. Both are therefore essential to salvation.

Only the final generation will, in God's own good providence, experience perfect Christlikeness. The purpose is to end the great controversy in a full knowledge & practice of righteousness by faith. All saints of all time are qualified for heaven, but only the final generation will walk in to heaven without seeing death. Amen.



The Bible said to me that justification by faith is a free gift and having that, a believer has eternal life, which means "qualified for heaven."

Thief on the cross that was saved by his faith in Christ at the last moment, has ever a sanctified life? No, never!!

He was a miserable man, evil man accustomed to evil works all his lifetime.

If he was treated so, why for you and me is not the same and will be treated differently? What is the base of this teaching, if there is, if any, a discrimination to what happened to the thief and what will happen to us?

Re: Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness? Or both? [Re: Colin] #144459
08/08/12 03:43 PM
08/08/12 03:43 PM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
Originally Posted By: Colin
Justification by faith is our qualification for heaven.

Sanctification by faith is our fitness for heaven.

As RickH said, we receive them together, but the latter is a lifetime experience of character development rather than the instantaneous, perfect reality that the rebirth of justification is. Since sanctification is our preparation for heaven, it does not impinge on our qualification for heaven who is Christ alone.

Receiving the new mind of Christ, the rebirth of justification, is God and Christ indwelling us by their Spirit (Jn 14:23). Developing a Christlike character isn't a reward for us, but merely living out the truth of justification; thus, vindicating the truth of God in the great controversy. A Christlike character, perfectly righteous in God's own reckoning - not our own measurement, doesn't supplant our qualification in Jesus, who is in us by rebirth to qualify us, but is the ultimate proof that Jesus lives in us.

Imparted righteous is but the living experience of daily faith of a lifetime of the believer justification by faith in Jesus. Both are therefore essential to salvation.

Only the final generation will, in God's own good providence, experience perfect Christlikeness. The purpose is to end the great controversy in a full knowledge & practice of righteousness by faith. All saints of all time are qualified for heaven, but only the final generation will walk in to heaven without seeing death. Amen.



Then only the final generation who can reach a perfect sinless character, but it is also after they had been justified by their faith, for after the door of probation is closed, how can they sin?

Revelation 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

Therefore, a perfect sinless character could never be a prerequisite for justification to enter heaven and live eternally, for those end time believers pre Christ 2nd coming, can stop sinning and continue living righteously in holiness because God has closed the door of probation, it is not because they had reach that state beforehand.

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