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Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183185
04/08/17 11:02 PM
04/08/17 11:02 PM
T
The Wanderer  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 545
Central Alberta
Originally Posted By: Green Cochoa
Quail eggs, chicken eggs, duck eggs, ants' eggs (usually of the red fire ant variety)--these are some of the "egg" products locals consume regularly. Only the first two in the list would I recommend....
I do know that a few years ago I lived on a small acreage and we had ducks. Mostly for pets. But I remember trying the duck eggs a few times, and feeling ill after eating them. They are quite different from "regular" eggs.


"The worst foes of my spiritual life have never been hostile circumstance."

"There is always a little bit of light" (Micah 7:8)
https://www.lightintheclouds.net/word

Sincerely, IN Christ; and THROUGH The Spirit


- The Wanderer
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183193
04/09/17 02:14 AM
04/09/17 02:14 AM
dedication  Offline
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Canada
Don't chickens --who aren't kept in cages -- eat just about anything?
insects, grubs, snails, seeds, fallen fruit and berries, even mice and worms, grasshoppers and fly larvae (out of the cow pies). Chickens gladly and voraciously tear at the flesh and guts of a freshly shot groundhog, opossum or raccoon.
Of course they also eat some grain and herbs and grass.

However, chickens are scavengers and omnivores.

And these are the chickens considered the ones making healthy eggs.

Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: dedication] #183194
04/09/17 02:50 AM
04/09/17 02:50 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
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The Orient
Originally Posted By: dedication
Don't chickens --who aren't kept in cages -- eat just about anything?
insects, grubs, snails, seeds, fallen fruit and berries, even mice and worms, grasshoppers and fly larvae (out of the cow pies). Chickens gladly and voraciously tear at the flesh and guts of a freshly shot groundhog, opossum or raccoon.
Of course they also eat some grain and herbs and grass.

However, chickens are scavengers and omnivores.

And these are the chickens considered the ones making healthy eggs.


You may be taking that a bit too far in your list there (I have witnessed chickens leaving a carcase entirely untouched), but birds do have a very low pH stomach acid that enables chickens to digest even the shell of that snail they consume, and get the calcium from it for making their own egg shell. The acid would kill any parasite rather well. Of course, God, who made the list we see in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14, knew all this. From the tone of your post, you seem to be questioning His wisdom in declaring chickens clean.

If chickens were so filthy as you imply, why would God give instructions through Mrs. White that sick people should eat raw eggs in order to regain strength?


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183197
04/09/17 04:25 AM
04/09/17 04:25 AM
APL  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
The diet reform should be progressive. As disease in animals increases, the use of milk and eggs will become more and more unsafe. An effort should be made to supply their place with other things that are healthful and inexpensive. The people everywhere should be taught how to cook without milk and eggs, so far as possible, and yet have their food wholesome and palatable. {MH 320.2}


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183198
04/09/17 05:09 AM
04/09/17 05:09 AM
dedication  Offline
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Canada
Several years ago we bought a house on the outskirts of a town. Unbeknownst to us the nice treed area next to the house hid an egg raising farm about half a mile away.

Whenever the wind blew toward our place it brought a strong most unpleasant smell with it. Sorry -- but that killed any relish for eggs that I might have had prior. There is nothing healthy concerning how chickens are raised these days.

Yes, people have asked me why are chickens, who eat all kinds of unclean things, considered "clean" while rabbits, who eat clover and grasses, hay and grains considered unclean, even though they even chew their cud.

That discussion usually centers on "what if during the time of trouble we flee to mountains" or "what if we are lost in the woods" -- lots of rabbits in the bushes, they'd be a good source of nourishment.

I really don't know why one is "clean" the other "unclean" -- I don't eat either. But if people think they need meat, better to stick with those scripture allows.

However all the meat, and animal produced foods were not part of the original diet God gave to mankind.
They are all "exceptions" allowed due to sinful conditions -- none are part of the ideal diet.

Nor would I look to EGW's example as the "ideal", for she had a tough time giving up meat herself. It was about 30 years from the time she was given the health vision, till she made a total and complete break from meat. Though she was learning to eat and cook without it all those years, she had numerous lapses.

It's true that in some cases an egg is "medicine" to help correct a dietary deficiency, and give a nutritionally dense boost to the system.
The Bible even recommends a little wine for the stomach --
Many make the same case that alcoholic drink is good using that text in the same way as people use EGW's statement to someone sick, to promote eggs.
Yet scripture warns that wine is a mocker and we should not partake of it. Just as EGW tells us we need to learn to cook well balanced meals without eggs and milk.

Health reform is progressive --
We should be encouraging people forward to the ideal,
No- not condemning them if they eat an occasional egg or two --
But encouraging them to learn to cook without animal foods.

Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: APL] #183199
04/09/17 05:15 AM
04/09/17 05:15 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: APL
The diet reform should be progressive. As disease in animals increases, the use of milk and eggs will become more and more unsafe. An effort should be made to supply their place with other things that are healthful and inexpensive. The people everywhere should be taught how to cook without milk and eggs, so far as possible, and yet have their food wholesome and palatable. {MH 320.2}


Originally Posted By: Ellen White
. . . and yet I say that milk and eggs should be included in your diet. These things cannot at present be dispensed with, and the doctrine of dispensing with them should not be taught. {CD 204.2}

You are in danger of taking too radical a view of health reform, and of prescribing for yourself a diet that will not sustain you. . . . {CD 204.3}

I do hope that you will heed the words I have spoken to you. It has been presented to me that you will not be able to exert the most successful influence in health reform unless in some things you become more liberal to yourself and to others. The time will come when milk cannot be used as freely as it is now used; but the present time is not the time to discard it. And eggs contain properties which are remedial agencies in counteracting poisons. . . . we should not consider it a denial of principle to use eggs of hens which are well cared for and suitably fed. . . . {CD 204.4}


According to Mrs. White, teaching people to cook without milk and eggs, and prescribing a vegan diet, were poles apart. It is important that we give people knowledge. It is also important that we give them freedom of conscience without pressure.

Don't worry about it, APL. God will take care of the matter in His own time. When it is time to give up the milk and eggs, He'll tell us. Meanwhile, "let your moderation be known unto all men."


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183201
04/09/17 03:23 PM
04/09/17 03:23 PM
APL  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Green - I do not tell people what to eat. I let the evidence speak for itself. Could it be that God has revealed evidence to people other than yourself? Did EGW tell us that EVERYONE should eat eggs? Did she even say that the majority should eat them? Some people do take extremes and do not learn how to eat properly, these people do give health reform health deform.

Consider the following:
Dr. Rand, educate yourself to discard all flesh meat. Soon butter will never be recommended, and milk will be entirely discarded; for disease in animals is increasing in proportion to the increase of wickedness among men. Soon there will be no safety in using eggs, milk, cream, or butter. {Lt14-1901}

God will give His people ability and tact to prepare wholesome food without these things. Let our people in Australia discard all unwholesome recipes and learn how to live healthfully in accordance with the directions God has given. Let them impart this knowledge as they would Bible instruction. Let them preserve the health and increase the strength by avoiding the large amount of cooking which has filled the world with chronic invalids. We are coming to the time when recipes for cooking will not be needed, for God’s people will learn that the food God gave Adam in his sinless state is the best for keeping the body in a sinless state.
{Lt14-1901}

Has God given anyone the ability to live without eggs, milk and butter? I know many that do and are very healthy. It may not work for you. I do not tell you what to eat. I do teach all how to do without them. Then leave them free to choose. That is how God works. God never forces people, He only draws. We see the devil working within the church now to force the conscience. Many disturbing things within the leadership of the church is now resorting to the use of force. Sad, how the rejection of the SOP is getting stronger.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: APL] #183203
04/09/17 05:23 PM
04/09/17 05:23 PM
T
The Wanderer  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 545
Central Alberta
Originally Posted By: APL
Sad, how the rejection of the SOP is getting stronger.


I am not sure if you were directing this part of your post to Green, but I would say that he is the last one here that i would accuse of this. I have learned much from his knowledge of the Bible and the writings of EGW

I am of the opinion when it comes to the food thing, we should not be so hasty in labelling others as "rejecting the testimonies," for it is really just a difference in understandings and knowledge bases. And of course, not everyone, everywhere can do the same when it comes to diet.

A given person cannot truly "reject the testimonies" until they have a 100% understanding from them on a given subject. I would suggest that that has not happened, atleast here in this topic with any of the participants.


"The worst foes of my spiritual life have never been hostile circumstance."

"There is always a little bit of light" (Micah 7:8)
https://www.lightintheclouds.net/word

Sincerely, IN Christ; and THROUGH The Spirit


- The Wanderer
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: APL] #183206
04/09/17 05:55 PM
04/09/17 05:55 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: APL
Green - I do not tell people what to eat. . . .


Really? In the "Rejection of the Testimonies Foretold" thread, you said this:

Originally Posted By: APL
BINGO! Do you call EGW narrow minded when she put together MH is 1905? Why do you think so many prior writings were left out of The Ministry of Healing? Does she have the same unbalanced view when she wrote that it should be a rule to dispense with butter all together? Is she unbalanced in her view that ALL should be taught to cook without milk and eggs? You can eat what ever you want. But I will teach others to dispense with all animal products as far as possible and that is indeed following what the Spirit of Prophecy teaches us to do.


The only problem is. . . that is NOT what the Spirit of Prophecy teaches us to do. It teaches us that "the doctrine of dispensing with them [milk and eggs] should not be taught."


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: Healthy, Healthful Eggs for Health! [Re: Green Cochoa] #183212
04/10/17 01:37 AM
04/10/17 01:37 AM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
OK - I will rephrase to what I meant - I will teach other HOW to dispense with all animal products. Again, all individuals are free to choose. Diet reform as with the accepting the truth about God has to be a choice of the individual. No one can force the will of another.

Wanderer, it is true I not put much faith in much of green's theology. Though in my previous comment, the rejection of the SOP was directed more at the top leadership of SDA inc.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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