Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY

Posted By: Daryl

Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/15/08 07:26 PM

Here is the link to the study and discussion material for this week's study topic:

http://ssnet.org/qrtrly/eng/08b/less12nkjv.html
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/15/08 07:30 PM

Let us begin by quoting the Memory Text.

Memory Text: "Now this is the main point of the things we are saying: We have such a High Priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens" (Hebrews 8:1, NKJV).
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 02:09 AM

From Sunday's section, in what ways did the ancient Tabernacle service point to Christ?
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 05:08 AM

It is not evident from this source alone that Jesus would some day make atonement for our sins on the cross.
Posted By: Colin

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 03:56 PM

Indeed his high priestly ministry just presupposes the foregoing Gospel history - you are referring to the memory text? The other thing is where does the phrase "atonement for our sins" come from: does Christ atone for us or our sins?

The sanctuary elements all point to Jesus' righteousness: the show bread, the lamp stand and incense altar (his Spirit..., not him in person), and the other things listed in the lesson.

I think Wednesday and Thursday's lessons are the sections which really need improving, having the questions that really need asking: Do those who know Jesus as Saviour and High Priest have a spiritual advantage over others who know him only as Saviour?

Well, is the lesson author's opinion adequate
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 05:52 PM

Colin,

From the wording and seemingly incompleteness of your last sentence, your post seems to be incomplete, whether purposely, or in error.
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 06:17 PM

Both the elements and the earthly sanctuary service itself all point to Christ.

In what way/s does the earthly sanctuary in both its services and elements point to Him?
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 10:13 PM

It is *not* obvious in the Pentateuch that the sacrificial system describes the atoning ministry of the Son of God. That is, Moses did not spell it out clearly. Nowhere does he say, "These things symbolize the atoning ministry of the Son of God. They point to His future work on behalf of penitent sinners." In fact, nowhere in the Bible is it plainly stated.
Posted By: jennes

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 10:42 PM

hi! mountain man please explain today lesson alittle more. how can i join u in a discussion on this week lesson.God bless
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 11:28 PM

MM,

Are you saying that there was no way for them to know what the sanctuary service and the elements of the sanctuary were all about?
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 11:30 PM

jennes,

to the Maritime forums.

Posting in places like this is the only way to discuss things like this amongst ourselves, therefore, keep on posting. \:\)
Posted By: Colin

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 11:37 PM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
Colin,

From the wording and seemingly incompleteness of your last sentence, your post seems to be incomplete, whether purposely, or in error.
Yes, this sentence
 Quote:
Well, is the lesson author's opinion adequate
...needs a "?" at the end.

Roy Adams' book on the sanctuary is reflected in this lesson, since he opts for much less than that our advantage as Adventists is to obtain Christ's ministry of imparting full Christlikeness to us. Adams' opinion is perhaps inadequate, especially as he disbelieves Christ could or would successfully attempt something like this - because Christ didn't take a humanity like ours...

Do we divide along the same lines of opinion for much the same reason?
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/17/08 11:45 PM

From Sunday's section we read the following:
 Quote:

Moses was told to build the tabernacle according to the pattern God had shown him on Mount Sinai (Exod. 25:9, 40). And while common sense would lead us away from the conclusion that every board and nail of the tabernacle (and later the temple) had theological significance, we should, nevertheless, take with all seriousness the teaching function of the Old Testament sanctuary system. Even so, we are not given a great deal of information on the meaning of the symbolisms; in fact, in most cases, none at all. Yet piecing together the little we find in the Old Testament with what we have in the New, we are able to arrive at a fairly good understanding of the overall meaning of certain fundamental aspects of the ancient—sanctuary system and service that point beyond themselves to a greater reality.

This would back up MM's post that there wasn't anything in the OT to point the services and elements of the sanctuary to Christ.

My question and concern is why wasn't there anything in the OT to point the services and elements to Christ?
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/18/08 01:54 AM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
MM,

Are you saying that there was no way for them to know what the sanctuary service and the elements of the sanctuary were all about?

It is not plainly stated in the Bible. Nowhere in the Bible does it say - "These things symbolize what the Son of God will do some day on the cross." The book of Hebrews gets close. No doubt, it was one of those verbal traditions that was handed down, but got lost along the way.
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/18/08 02:00 AM

Sister White was shown what Moses was shown just before he died. He never wrote it down though. Here is what she said:

And now a panoramic view of the Land of Promise was presented to him. Every part of the country was spread out before him, not faint and uncertain in the dim distance, but standing out clear, distinct, and beautiful to his delighted vision. In this scene it was presented, not as it then appeared, but as it would become, with God's blessing upon it, in the possession of Israel. He seemed to be looking upon a second Eden. There were mountains clothed with cedars of Lebanon, hills gray with olives and fragrant with the odor of the vine, wide green plains bright with flowers and rich in fruitfulness, here the palm trees of the tropics, there waving fields of wheat and barley, sunny valleys musical with the ripple of brooks and the song of birds, goodly cities and fair gardens, lakes rich in "the abundance of the seas," grazing flocks upon the hillsides, and even amid the rocks the wild bee's hoarded treasures. It was indeed such a land as Moses, inspired by the Spirit of God, had described to Israel: "Blessed of the Lord . . . for the precious things of heaven, for the dew, and for the deep that coucheth beneath, and for the precious fruits brought forth by the sun, . . . and for the chief things of the ancient mountains, . . . and for the precious things of the earth and fullness thereof." {PP 472.3}

Moses saw the chosen people established in Canaan, each of the tribes in its own possession. He had a view of their history after the settlement of the Promised Land; the long, sad story of their apostasy and its punishment was spread out before him. He saw them, because of their sins, dispersed among the heathen, the glory departed from Israel, her beautiful city in ruins, and her people captives in strange lands. He saw them restored to the land of their fathers, and at last brought under the dominion of Rome. {PP 475.1}

He was permitted to look down the stream of time and behold the first advent of our Saviour. He saw Jesus as a babe in Bethlehem. He heard the voices of the angelic host break forth in the glad song of praise to God and peace on earth. He beheld in the heavens the star guiding the Wise Men of the East to Jesus, and a great light flooded his mind as he called those prophetic words, "There shall come a Star out of Jacob, and a Scepter shall rise out of Israel." Numbers 24:17. He beheld Christ's humble life in Nazareth, His ministry of love and sympathy and healing, His rejection by a proud, unbelieving nation. Amazed he listened to their boastful exaltation of the law of God, while they despised and rejected Him by whom the law was given. He saw Jesus upon Olivet as with weeping He bade farewell to the city of His love. As Moses beheld the final rejection of that people so highly blessed of Heaven--that people for whom he had toiled and prayed and sacrificed, for whom he had been willing that his own name should be blotted from the book of life; as he listened to those fearful words, "Behold your house is left unto you desolate" (Matthew 23:38), his heart was wrung with anguish, and bitter tears fell from his eyes, in sympathy with the sorrow of the Son of God. {PP 475.2}

He followed the Saviour to Gethsemane, and beheld the agony in the garden, the betrayal, the mockery and scourging--the crucifixion. Moses saw that as he had lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of God must be lifted up, that whosoever would believe on Him "should not perish, but have eternal life." John 3:15. Grief, indignation, and horror filled the heart of Moses as he viewed the hypocrisy and satanic hatred manifested by the Jewish nation against their Redeemer, the mighty Angel who had gone before their fathers. He heard Christ's agonizing cry, "My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me?" Mark 15:34. He saw Him lying in Joseph's new tomb. The darkness of hopeless despair seemed to enshroud the world. But he looked again, and beheld Him coming forth a conqueror, and ascending to heaven escorted by adoring angels and leading a multitude of captives. He saw the shining gates open to receive Him, and the host of heaven with songs of triumph welcoming their Commander. And it was there revealed to him that he himself would be one who should attend the Saviour, and open to Him the everlasting gates. As he looked upon the scene, his countenance shone with a holy radiance. How small appeared the trials and sacrifices of his life when compared with those of the Son of God! how light in contrast with the "far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory"! 2 Corinthians 4:17. He rejoiced that he had been permitted, even in a small measure, to be a partaker in the sufferings of Christ. {PP 475.3}

Moses beheld the disciples of Jesus as they went forth to carry His gospel to the world. He saw that though the people of Israel "according to the flesh" had failed of the high destiny to which God had called them, in their unbelief had failed to become the light of the world, though they had despised God's mercy and forfeited their blessings as His chosen people--yet God had not cast off the seed of Abraham; the glorious purposes which He had undertaken to accomplish through Israel were to be fulfilled. All who through Christ should become the children of faith were to be counted as Abraham's seed; they were inheritors of the covenant promises; like Abraham, they were called to guard and to make known to the world the law of God and the gospel of His Son. Moses saw the light of the gospel shining out through the disciples of Jesus to them "which sat in darkness" (Matthew 4:16), and thousands from the lands of the Gentiles flocking to the brightness of its rising. And beholding, he rejoiced in the increase and prosperity of Israel. {PP 476.1}

And now another scene passed before him. He had been shown the work of Satan in leading the Jews to reject Christ, while they professed to honor His Father's law. He now saw the Christian world under a similar deception in professing to accept Christ while they rejected God's law. He had heard from the priests and elders the frenzied cry, "Away with Him!" "Crucify Him, crucify Him!" and now he heard from professedly Christian teachers the cry, "Away with the law!" He saw the Sabbath trodden under foot, and a spurious institution established in its place. Again Moses was filled with astonishment and horror. How could those who believed in Christ reject the law spoken by His own voice upon the sacred mount? How could any that feared God set aside the law which is the foundation of His government in heaven and earth? With joy Moses saw the law of God still honored and exalted by a faithful few. He saw the last great struggle of earthly powers to destroy those who keep God's law. He looked forward to the time when God shall arise to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity, and those who have feared His name shall be covered and hid in the day of His anger. He heard God's covenant of peace with those who have kept His law, as He utters His voice from His holy habitation and the heavens and the earth do shake. He saw the second coming of Christ in glory, the righteous dead raised to immortal life, and the living saints translated without seeing death, and together ascending with songs of gladness to the City of God. {PP 476.2}

Still another scene opens to his view--the earth freed from the curse, lovelier than the fair Land of Promise so lately spread out before him. There is no sin, and death cannot enter. There the nations of the saved find their eternal home. With joy unutterable Moses looks upon the scene--the fulfillment of a more glorious deliverance than his brightest hopes have ever pictured. Their earthly wanderings forever past, the Israel of God have at last entered the goodly land. {PP 477.1}

Again the vision faded, and his eyes rested upon the land of Canaan as it spread out in the distance. Then, like a tired warrior, he lay down to rest. "So Moses the servant of the Lord died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the Lord. And He buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Beth-peor: but no man knoweth of his sepulcher." Many who had been unwilling to heed the counsels of Moses while he was with them would have been in danger of committing idolatry over his dead body had they known the place of his burial. For this reason it was concealed from men. But angels of God buried the body of His faithful servant and watched over the lonely grave. {PP 477.2}
Posted By: Colin

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/18/08 02:06 PM

Yes, prophecy was dramatic, yet rathe general, but full of promise: the promise of the Saviour was hardly unknown. The temple service was used, abused and finally, after Babylonian captivity, overdone, over the history of the OT.

Yes, it was implied by the temple service, the written Word, and the verbal tradition accompanied these with its general understanding. They only had to understand that God saves in the Messiah's death - and they got lost in contemporary politics, but today we've got to understand that God caps saving us in Christ's death by preparing us to see him come and take us to heaven: the height of righteousness is God's plan for us, but we aren't fully persuaded of that promise, also getting lost in contemporary church politics - within and without our church.

Is this not the heart of this week's lesson, at the invitation but not the suggestion of the lesson author.
Posted By: Colin

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/18/08 02:48 PM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
From Sunday's section we read the following:
 Quote:

Moses was told to build the tabernacle according to the pattern God had shown him on Mount Sinai (Exod. 25:9, 40). And while common sense would lead us away from the conclusion that every board and nail of the tabernacle (and later the temple) had theological significance, we should, nevertheless, take with all seriousness the teaching function of the Old Testament sanctuary system. Even so, we are not given a great deal of information on the meaning of the symbolisms; in fact, in most cases, none at all. Yet piecing together the little we find in the Old Testament with what we have in the New, we are able to arrive at a fairly good understanding of the overall meaning of certain fundamental aspects of the ancient—sanctuary system and service that point beyond themselves to a greater reality.

This would back up MM's post that there wasn't anything in the OT to point the services and elements of the sanctuary to Christ.

My question and concern is why wasn't there anything in the OT to point the services and elements to Christ?
I don't accept this line from the lesson quarterly! Why was the sanctuary service held so sacred by the Israelite nation??? There was little mention of the fulfilment of the sanctuary service in the OT, but the point was hardly unknown!

I don't have my copy to hand, but ML Andreasen's "The Sanctuary Service" shows the symbolism was understood, as I recall. I've seen but did not buy Roy Adams' book by the same title, and this lesson excerpt illustrates Adams' view of the strength of the sanctuary service, expressed as a rather unclear teaching tool (which it isn't!) and its fulfilment in Jesus' heavenly ministry isn't to be as perfectly perfected as the earthly version...!

The annual day of atonement, a faith experience reliant on Jesus' sacrifice and intercession, was a day of perfection for Israel: a day of judgement and national consecration with several sacrifices offered - including a personal sacrifice for the high priest himself, culminating in the national offering the Lord's goat followed by the famous, dramatic banishing the of the scape goat illustrating the Devil's 1000 years stuck on the earth and final destruction: the people were atoned for as a nation as the sanctuary was atoned for, by removing the year's blood record of confessed sins posited on it, making the community perfect for a day, before God.

Jesus' heavenly ministry achieves the self-same result by his own blood, since he fulfils the service in the Bible...It's impossible, humanly speaking, but that's God's speciality isn't it!
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/18/08 05:29 PM

Colin, then it should be easy for the guy who has never heard the story of Jesus to start reading the Bible from the beginning and understand right away that the Son of God would die on the cross some day to save penitent sinners from sin and death. But, alas, it isn't so. That's why people like the Ethiopian eunuch required assistance in understanding it. It isn't clearly articulated in the Bible.
Posted By: Colin

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/19/08 03:49 AM

Yes, a thorough Bible study, but the OT has a good part of that...

Surely our study today, this week, is rather how much of an advantage we Adventists have with our sanctuary teaching & spiritual experience?
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/19/08 05:14 PM

Amen. We are leaps and bounds ahead of where we would be without all the hard work they invested. Thank you, Jesus.
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/20/08 04:56 PM

Yes, we have an unique message in relation to the sanctuary, both the eartly and the heavenly, in regards to forgiveness and judgment, however, we must be able to present that unique message from the Bible alone.

Can we, therefore, present and prove that unique message from the Bible alone?

If so, I would like to see that done, either here, or perhaps and better still, in a thread of its own.
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/25/08 08:09 PM

The Great Controversy is an excellent Bible study on the sanctuary truth.
Posted By: scott

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/29/08 04:43 PM

 Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
The Great Controversy is an excellent Bible study on the sanctuary truth.


Amen MM!

The difference between what SDAs believe about the judgment is that God has placed Himself on trial, according to the Great Controversy, rather than placing us on trial. We judge ourselves through our judgment of Him. Whom are we willing to worship? Will the real God please stand up?

The GC is unique in that the purpose of this war between good and evil is to vindicate God. The GC has a much clearer and fuller explanation of the Sanctuary than Evangelicals have. They teach that the purpose of the cross was for Jesus to save humanity by appeasing God’s wrath. The GC teaches that the purpose of Jesus was to vindicate God’s character of love. There is a big difference for those who can see it.

scott
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/30/08 07:38 PM

Thanx, Scott. Seems to me Jesus must also disprove Satan's alternate plan of salvation. That is, He must also demonstrate that all others truths and paths end in failure, that there truly is only one way that leads to peace and happiness, that there are not many other paths that ultimately lead to peace and happiness. Thus, Jesus must not only demonstrate God is right, He must also demonstrate Satan is wrong. Both are necessary to settle the great controversy in God's favor. So far, though, Jesus hasn't finished demonstrating either one conclusively.
Posted By: scott

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/30/08 08:03 PM

Hi MM,

Amen again!

I do believe that God was vindicated to the universe at the cross and Satan stood as the liar and murderer that he is. What was left was to convince the children of Adam and leave a legacy that would never allow sin to repeat itself.

I totally agree that Satan is a liar and this must be demonstrated. In 2 Thess. we see the man of sin sitting in the temple of God claiming to be God. This temple is the collective mind of Christ's church. We are the temple of the living God. Christ has freed us from sin's captivity, but somehow we haven't tapped into the power of the gospel.

I believe that is because most of God's church doesn't know Him as Jesus wanted us to. They are willing to worship a god of force and coercion such as the devil has made God out to be. And their false image of God doesn’t have the drawing power to get people to come close and enter a dynamic relationship with God and therefore experience victory.

In other words the false god that reigns in the heart of most Christians doesn’t stimulate us to trust. Simply because he is presented as untrustworthy! An example is the Baptist God who burns the lost for eternity. How could anyone trust a God of infinite injustice? (Of course the Baptists say that eternal torture is justified simply because God has the right to do it, not because it would be the right thing to do.) What could we possibly do in our short 80 years to deserve eternal punishment? How could someone believing in that God reconcile becoming his best friend? It would be like accepting a dinner invitation to Hitler’s house.

I believe God is looking for a people who are only willing to worship Jesus' version of God. People with Jesus' testimony and the law written in their hearts.

scott
Posted By: Tom

Re: Lesson #12 - The Efficacy of His Priestly MINISTRY - 06/30/08 09:15 PM

 Quote:
Thus, Jesus must not only demonstrate God is right, He must also demonstrate Satan is wrong. Both are necessary to settle the great controversy in God's favor. So far, though, Jesus hasn't finished demonstrating either one conclusively.


I disagree with this. Darryl asked for Scripture texts, so I'll include some, but a couple of SOP texts are in my brain that need to come out first.

 Quote:
Christ did not yield up His life till He had accomplished the work which He came to do, and with His parting breath He exclaimed, "It is finished." John 19:30. The battle had been won. His right hand and His holy arm had gotten Him the victory. As a Conqueror He planted His banner on the eternal heights. Was there not joy among the angels? All heaven triumphed in the Saviour's victory. Satan was defeated, and knew that his kingdom was lost.

To the angels and the unfallen worlds the cry, "It is finished," had a deep significance. It was for them as well as for us that the great work of redemption had been accomplished. They with us share the fruits of Christ's victory.

Not until the death of Christ was the character of Satan clearly revealed to the angels or to the unfallen worlds. (DA 758)


The last sentence, underlined, brings out that it wasn't until the death of Christ that the character of Satan was clearly revealed, which means that it was clearly revealed at that time. She goes into great detail as to how this happened throughout the chapter.

 Quote:
When the object of his mission was attained,--the revelation of God to the world,--the Son of God announced that his work was accomplished, and that the character of the Father was made manifest to men. (ST 1/20/90)


This brings out that Christ completed His work of revealing God. The rest of the article explains in detail how this was done.

So Christ actually did conclusively reveal both God's character and Satan's character.

In terms of Scripture, John 19:30 "It Is Finished" has this in mind. John in particular talks a great deal about this theme throughout the book. John 1:18 sets the stage:

 Quote:
No one has ever seen God. The only Son, who is truly God and is closest to the Father, has shown us what God is like.


John 17, Jesus' prayer, talks about this, especially verses 3-7, which was the inspiration for EGW's comments in ST 1/20/90 quoted above.

John 12 deals with this theme in regards to Satan:

 Quote:
Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all unto me.(John 12:31, 32)


The KJV has the word "men" added after "all," but the Greek doesn't have this. Jesus Christ was the answer for all creation, not just our race.
© 2024 Maritime 2nd Advent Christian Believers OnLine Forums Consisting Mainly of Both Members & Friends of the SDA (Seventh-day Adventist) Church