Which would you agree with,
Discipline is not punishment
or
Punishment is not discipline?

Is the Investigative Judgment Biblical?
That is the theme of the thread.

I think both Kland and Mountain Man agree that some people will enjoy everlasting life, while others will reap everlasting death.

So who determines who will come up in the first resurrection and who will come up in the second resurrection?

I believe that is determined in Pre-Advent judgment.
In the pre-advent judgement, the Bridegroom (Christ) intercedes for His bride --
Every person He can, by His blood, redeem, cleanse and present before the Father and the heavenly angels, will be raised to partake of that marriage supper of the Lamb.


Rev. 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I (Jesus) will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
3:12 I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and [I will write upon him] my new name.
Rev. 19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.
19:9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed [are] they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb.
20:6 Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power,
The second resurrection occurs 1000 years later, but their names are not found in the book of life.
20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. (14) This is the second death.

God does things in a orderly way, and the process where He does the Judgment is no different.

that is incorrect.

revelation 20:4 specifically says, "I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years."

so then here are people who everyone knows:

1. had been beheaded, AND
2. had testified about Jesus, AND
3. had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received its mark

are sda planning on beheading each other in order to make the cut?

There is sufficient evidence in the study of Yom Kippur to lay this to rest.
But perhaps it is not evidence of truth that is wanted, but evidence to believe what folks want to believe.

******* STAFF EDIT *******

.....that specifically and unequivocally and plainly say who will be part of the first resurrection: viz-a-viz, those who had been beheaded rev. 20:4

sad!

Rev. 20:4 Gives the assurance to those who who faced martyrdom that they will be raised In the first resurrection. It's a promise that has enabled many persecuted ones to hold fast to their faith even at the cost of their earthly life.
However, the idea that they are the only ones raised is purely an assumption, other texts seem to indicate that all the "dead in Christ" will be raised in that first resurrection.
1 Thessalonians 4:16 gives a larger picture as the apostle Paul teaches, "For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first."
Who are these "dead in Christ"? I don't think they are ONLY the martyred ones?
The last part of verse 17 then notes, "so we will always be with the Lord." All believers will from that point forward be with Christ forever.

The Bible speaks of two resurrection:
The first is the resurrection of life at the beginning of the 1000 years.
The second is the resurrection of damnation at the end of the 1000 years.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Rev. 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that has part in the first resurrection: on such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. "
20:5 the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished



So yes, the decision as to who "is in Christ" and will be raised in the first resurrection is revealed in the heavenly court, surrounded by millions of angels, prior to the second coming. Christ presents their names before the Father (See Rev. 3:5)

There is a Investigative Judgment, or Pre-Advent Judgment, as distinct from the Final Judgment of the Second Death, which scripture shows begins before the Second Coming as the saints cannot simply go to heaven without a determination of their standing. Man is not immortal of self and doesnt go to heaven at death, and there is not any kind of judgment immediately after death. We see that it begins with the believers as the Bible speaks of an Investigative Judgment for the house of God, which is Christians.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time [is come] that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if [it] first [begin] at us, what shall the end [be] of them that obey not the gospel of God ?

We also see another text on where the Bible speaks about a Judgment Day......

Revelation 14:6-7
6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

We see the angel proclaim that the 'everlasting gospel' message contains, the judgment, and we see what Christ says..

Matthew 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

And we find much more..

1 Peter 1:17
And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

Revelation 22:12
And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

Now as Jesus will bring His reward with Him at His coming, the judgment of the church or saints needs only to take place shortly prior to the Second Coming. Now if you look the Investigative Judgment comes and we the saints will be judged before the Second Coming and then after the wicked, so its everyone. Lets take a look at scripture:

Daniel 7.9-10
I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened. (22) the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given in favor of the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

Matthew 12.36-37
But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.


Romans 14.10-12
We shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

2 Cor. 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to what he has done, whether it be good or bad.

So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God, so all believers must repent and be converted, not just say they are...

Acts 3.18-19
But those things, which God foretold by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he has so fulfilled. Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Acts 17:30-31
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commands all men every where to repent: Because he has appointed a day, So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that Man whom he has ordained; He has given assurance of this to all men, by raising him from the dead.

Romans 2:15-16
. . .Which show the work of the law written in their hearts,...In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Ecclesiastes 12:13-14
13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

The Bible clearly indicts that all will appear before the judgment throne of God, those who are judged worthy by the blood of the lamb, have His robe of righteousness, and will be taken to the heavenly kingdom at the Second Coming. The others will receive the judgment of condemnation, and receive their punishment in the lake of fire at the Second Death.

We see the judgement scene given in Daniel...
Daniel 7:9-10
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

Now the judgement begins in the house of God as we saw in 1 Peter..

1 Peter 4:17
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

But there will also be judgement on "them that obey not the gospel of God", which are not from the house of God. We see it in Revelation 20 after the 1000 years when the books are opened and all the universe can see that God is just, and God is vindicated in His justice..

Revelation 20:12
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

And we see that either our sins be covered by the blood of the lamb, or our names will be blotted out of the Lambs Book of Life.
Exodus 32:33
And the Lord said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

We see what Peter says.
Acts 3:19
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

We see where David acknowledged his sin and asked God to forgive him and to blot out his sins.
Psalm 51:4
1 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.
4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest

And not only blot out his sin, but to cleanse and create a new heart.
Psalm 51:9-10
9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities.
10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

So there are records which show what every person has done, and the names of the saved are put in the book of life, and Christ gives this promise..
Revelation 3:5
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

So we see that God is seeing the transgression and sins of His people and it comes up against what happens, we must face the judgement seat of Christs..
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

So everyone has a case pending in judgment, the saints and the wicked, whether living or dead.
Hebrews 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

And what is going to be brought up at the judgement..
Jeremiah 2:22
22 For though thou wash thee with nitre, and take thee much soap, yet thine iniquity is marked before me, saith the Lord God.

Malachi 3:16
16 Then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another: and the Lord hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the Lord, and that thought upon his name.

So what will be the standard used..
James 2:10-12
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

And what is the level to be reached..
Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So clearly, even one transgression on one point is as the same as being guilty of all, as the Law is based on the character of God, it is the Law of Love, for God and for your fellowman, and to break or transgress it leaves you with the wages of sin pending, so the church clearly must face Christ and His judgement before the Second Coming to decide this, and see if we are covered by the blood of the lamb.
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.