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Re: Value of Revelation's Historicist Trumpets [Re: dedication] #199352
01/06/26 06:08 PM
01/06/26 06:08 PM
Daryl  Offline

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John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Re: Value of Revelation's Historicist Trumpets [Re: dedication] #199361
01/12/26 04:29 PM
01/12/26 04:29 PM
dedication  Online Content OP
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The historicist method of interpreting the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation is at the very base of not only the Adventist prophetic understanding but at the root of Protestantism.

Yet what we see in the Christian world today is an attack against the Historicist interpretation and an undoing of Protestantism. There is a reason this is so.

500 or so years ago there was a very important reformation that allowed light to flood upon the world.
It was precisely about breaking free from a system that turned the living water of the gospel into worm wood and that had obstructed the light of truth from shining upon the world.
It was a return to scripture and the true gospel of salvation that was to go into all the world.
God had his ambassadors all over Europe --Luther, John Knox, Tyndale, and a little later also in America, a land of freedom where truth could be freely followed and obeyed , with powerful preachers like George Whitefield, John Wesley, and William Miller.

However, the system that had controlled the Christian world for centuries, locking away truth and promoting its worm wood polluted water for doctrines in the place of the gospel's water of life, was clearly portrayed and warned against, in those prophecies!
The historicist interpretation of prophesy clearly revealed to the world that this Roman ecclesiastical power was anti-christ sitting as if he were god over God's church.

Those reformers, though they didn't all agree on all their theological points, were united in several key points.

1. The Bible is God's Word of Truth! Not man's traditions and philosophies.
2. Christ is our only Savior, Mediator and Lord, who alone brings us salvation.
3. The pope is the anti-christ as revealed in prophecy.


That did not make the papacy happy.

With great energy and determination they set out to CHANGE the prophecies. The bible was now available to the people to read for themselves, so somehow, they must change those prophecies so they could not expose their identity as the anti-christ. They must get rid of the historicist method of interpretation. Their sacraments had to be embellished and preserved, their priesthood had to be elevated higher.

They organized "orders", the most aggressive being the Jesuits, to rewrite prophecy, and propagate their message, to persecute and reduce opposition, and influence with whatever method they could devise to destroy Protestantism and bring the world back into anti-christ's fold.


Today they have pretty much succeeded. The whole world is looking up to the papacy as the great spiritual leader. Government officials from the nations are bowing before him.

NOW THINK AGAIN OF THE TRUMPETS

Will this future interpretation of the trumpets point people to God?

Where will it lead people who lack the foundation and who hear this teaching that the trumpets are all future happenings of terrible, supernatural and disastrous trouble sent by an angry God to make people repent?

Where will they go to repent?
To what will their repentance, triggered by fear, lead?

Who is the angry one who brings this destruction and terrible time of trouble?
Are the trumpets outlining this future trouble, or is the trouble all part of the seventh culminating trumpet that defines the nations as being angry and destroying the earth, just before the second coming?

Who will be accused of causing the trouble?

Quote


""Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has but a short time." Revelation 12:12....
The wrath of Satan increases as his time grows short, and his work of deceit and destruction will reach its culmination in the time of trouble. [GC 624)

"destructive power ... will be exercised by evil angels when God permits. There are forces now ready, and only waiting the divine permission, to spread desolation everywhere. {GC 614.2}

" It will be urged that the few who stand in opposition to an institution of the church and a law of the state ought not to be tolerated"

Those who honor the law of God will be accused of bringing judgments upon the world, and they will be regarded as the cause of the fearful convulsions of nature and the strife and bloodshed among men that are filling the earth with woe. GC 615


So yes, Satan wants the nations to forget the historicist interpretation of prophecy, so he can use those prophecies (and the futurist interpretation of trumpets will suit him just fine) to corral people into his counterfeit system. Corral them into the very system (the system wounded in 1798 by but now healed and powerful) that those trumpets warned against.

It's the third angel's message -- no rest for those who look to this system for deliverance, though most of the world will go there.

In the last days, the pressure to repent and turn to the Catholic coalition will be tremendous. Repent of rebellion against the church supposedly containing the keys of salvation. Yes there will be a terrible time of trouble and with all the "chastisements" and disasters lashing across the land, (all of which are also predicted by Marian apparitions and others) will be used to urge people to repent of their rebellion against the "church". Will people know that the ones offering sanction and acceptance through their sacraments, are actually the anti-christ, not the real Christ at all?

The historicist understanding lets people know exactly what powers to fear and resist.
The counterfeit, with all deceivable power, will use fear and super natural signs and wonders to compel all into their "fold".

The time to seek truth, repent and surrender our lives fully to our Savior Jesus Christ is NOW. The trumpets have been sounding their warning, all through Christian history. For those who come to the last time of trouble unprepared it is too late.








Re: Value of Revelation's Historicist Trumpets [Re: dedication] #199368
01/14/26 11:33 PM
01/14/26 11:33 PM
dedication  Online Content OP
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Revelation 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

Revelation refers to "angel" or "angels" 43 times. (even more if one counts every time the activity of each is mentioned)
The Greek word is "angelos" meaning "messenger". There are millions of angels in God's heaven. Part of their work is to communicate God's wishes to humanity, and do His will in many ways, protecting, and helping as well as communicating.

Not all "angels" refer to actual angels. Their is One glorious Being referred to "as an angel" yet it is Jesus Christ, the eternal Son of God, He is captain over the whole host of angels. (Joshua 5:14,15) He is much more than what we understand as an "angel" He is our High Priest interceding at the altar of incense as the trumpets are sounding (Rev. 8:2-3) He stands on land and sea as the real owner of this earth (Rev. 10:1)

And who is the "angel" of Rev. 7:2 with the seal of God calling out to "hold the winds of strife" till the sealing work is done? Could it be the Holy Spirit (Eph, 1:13, 4:30)


In the above verse (8:13) there is debate amongst students who have studied Greek manuscripts as to whether it is "an angel" or whether it is a bird of prey (an eagle or a vulture). He announces that three more trumpets are about to sound showing more rejection of Christ's great offer of salvation. Woe, woe, woe -- and the the vultures begin to circle knowing rejection of Christ's gift of life and salvation, means there will be a lot of death. (Compare with Luke17:37)

The woes that come upon the human race is one of misery, pain, suffering, privation, sickness and death. These woes come as a result of their own choice. If the Eastern Church would have learned something from the nature of the Roman church, they would have realized that was not the way nor the truth. Had they thanked God for keeping the Mongols from attacking them when they were scattered after the 4th crusade had turned on them, with serious destruction of their capitol. Had they thanked God for another chance once they re-established the Byzantine Empire, had they returned to the true gospel, things could have been different. But like so many they did not connect the dots that waywardness and sin has serious consequences. They did not realize leaving God's blue print has consequences triggered by their own choice. People blame God and everyone else but do not see it's their choices

Re: Value of Revelation's Historicist Trumpets [Re: dedication] #199372
19 hours ago
19 hours ago
dedication  Online Content OP
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Let's look at all those angels once more.

Revelation 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

Yes, we will see that the trumpets are connected with the three angels' of Revelation 14.
Does the connection show the historicist interpretation is correct, or does it nullify it?
But let's start with angels in Revelation 14 and work backwards to the angels in the trumpets.

THE ANGEL with the "third angel's message" is announced as:
"And the third angel followed them." (Rev. 14:9)
This indicates that there were angels which came before, whom the third angel "followed."

Indeed the third angel followed "another angel" (the second in this sequence) (Rev. 14:8) The third angel followed, this "another angel", indicating neither were the first.

But now go back to Rev. 14:8, we call this angel the first, but the Bible reads:
Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven having the everlasting gospel....

"Another angel" means there was another angel before him as well, he was not the first of the angels that brought messages!

What angel went before him? Is there a messenger type angel earlier?
We search back and find no angels in chapters 13,12. In chapter 11:15 there is the trumpet angel, but trumpet angels have their own sequence.

In chapter ten we read: I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven...(Rev. 10:1) This is a special messenger-- Jesus Himself. But even He is still described as "another mighty angel".

It's not until we reach Revelation 8:13 that we reach the primal angel, and read: "And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the middle of heaven saying..."This is not "another angel, but, primarily, "an angel."

So we find the sequence:

Primary angel- every angel following him is "another angel"
The angel of Rev. 8:13 is not the same as the angel of Rev. 14:6. The angel of Rev. 14:6 "another angel".

Rev. 8:13 "And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe

"And I saw another mighty angel coming down from heaven." Rev. 10:1.

"And I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven ." Rev. 14:6.

"And there followed another angel." Verse 8.

"And the third angel followed them." Verse 9.

Revelation 14:15,17,18 has three more angels, each (another angel came) coming out of the temple.

The Primal (beginning of the sequence) angel appears between the fourth and fifth trumpet.

What has gone on before?
1. The gospel went out in power!
The first church fervently spreading the gospel, but loosing first love.
The first seal releases white horse of pure gospel going froth in spiritual conquest
The first trumpet the first great rejection of the gospel and its consequence of ruin.

2, The persecution ending in a league
The second suffering church
The second seal red -- persecution
The second trumpet -- a league made with the empire that had had persecuted them, that now groomed the papacy but ended up crashing like a great burning mountain.

3. The sliding/drifting into darkness
The third church infiltrated with doctrine of Balaam and Nicolaitans.
The third seal -- black horse and weigh scales, spiritual things are getting harder to find.
The third trumpet -- wormwood water, polluting the living water of life.

4. The gospel eclipsed in a large part of the world
The fourth church Jezebel
The fourth seal horse looking like death
The fourth trumpet darkness, the sun of righteousness eclipsed.

So what do we see at the end of the fourth trumpet? Even though the gospel went out with power, to a large extend at the end of the fourth, the gospel truth is covered in deceptive doctrines and darkness. The beast has been established. Truth is hidden in a large part of the Christian world.

This is when the Primal angel begins the sequence. In the middle of the trumpets.
Two more woes will come to break up the hold of error this beast power has upon the population and give them opportunity to repent. The woes are the result of the majority rejection of Christ and His truth. As more light shines, the more desperately the evil spirits attack, Light when it can't melt the heart, hardens it. Without the protection of Christ (because He is rejected) the people are vulnerable to Satan's malicious hatred against the human race.

When the sixth woe ends the Mighty Angel tells people the timelines have all ended, they think that means Jesus is coming, but He doesn't, thus their sweet Bible study turns bitter. But they must prophesy again. They are not give up in despondency. (Rev. 10:1,6,9-11)

Then the seventh trumpet sounds. The time to finish the Mystery of God.
I believe the Spirit of Prophecy which tells us in plain English -- the seventh trumpet began to sound in 1844, at the end of all the timelines. It includes all the endtime events.

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