Re: Weeds, plants out of place?

Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/15/07 06:26 AM

Not growing a garden?

Anyone growing some weeds?
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/15/07 07:07 PM

We have a flower garden, if it can be called that, with weeds growing in it. \:\)

By the way, speaking of weeds, what is the best way of getting rid of weeds on a more permanent scale?
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/20/07 10:04 AM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
We have a flower garden, if it can be called that, with weeds growing in it. \:\)

By the way, speaking of weeds, what is the best way of getting rid of weeds on a more permanent scale?

Daryl do you have "Outlaw Weeds" in Canada?

As I get older pulling weeds becomes more challenging. Some plants such as blackberries are difficult to control with out applying an herbicide.

I would consider the lasagna method that I gave a link to earlier.

Some growers apply steaming hot water to weeds to kill them.

We use a strap hoe as well as our digits to extract the unwanted plants, seems like we always miss some though.

 Quote:
Legislation to outlaw the movement of specified noxious weeds has been enacted by the U.S. federal government, most states and numerous counties. Under the Federal Noxious Weed Act of 1974 , the Secretary of Agriculture has the authority to prohibit the importation and interstate transportation and sale of species that the Secretary has deemed noxious through actions such as inspection and quarantine. The Secretary is allowed to seize, treat, destroy and dispose of items that have been contaminated with a noxious weed.

Weed police to combat SA 'aliens' Similar laws also exist in many other countries in all parts of the world. In at least one country, the jacaranda tree has become the subject of state control for political reasons. Recently, the local government of Pretoria has sent out weed inspectors to impose $900 fines on those who fail to rip out jacaranda seedlings, although large adult trees will be allowed to remain. Pretoria is a squat, uniform city with streets on a grid pattern, but it is spectacularly beautiful in spring when the streets are purple with petals from jacaranda trees. It is known as the "city of jacarandas," but that is another aspect that may eventually be expunged, because the trees are not a native African species. The government is also planning to change the name of Pretoria to a more pre-colonial name. Are there any politically incorrect trees in your town? Poetry and Inspiration to Groom Your Garden

The politics of plants is an interesting subject, in it's self.
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/20/07 11:15 PM

Outlaw weeds?

What do they look like?
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/21/07 10:29 AM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
Outlaw weeds?

What do they look like?


My definition of "Outlaw Weeds," is just a generic term for plants that are on a "government hit list" to exterminate them.

"Legislation to outlaw the movement of specified noxious weeds."

"Under the Federal Noxious Weed Act of 1974 , the Secretary of Agriculture has the authority to prohibit the importation and interstate transportation and sale of species that the Secretary has deemed noxious through actions such as inspection and quarantine. The Secretary is allowed to seize, treat, destroy and dispose of items that have been contaminated with a noxious weed."

"The local government of Pretoria has sent out weed inspectors to impose $900 fines on those who fail to rip out jacaranda seedlings, although large adult trees will be allowed to remain." Outlaw Weeds

I suppose it would be any plant on your governments (federal, state, local) that is controlled in some way.

A List of noxious weeds in Nova Scotia
1 Class Number One weeds--capable of spreading from the source to cultivated or pasture lands

Abutilon theophrasti (velvetleaf)
Anthriscus sylvestris (wild chervil)
Asclepias syriaca (milkweed)
Convolvulus arvensis (field bindweed)
Cyperus esculentus (yellow nutsedge)
Euphorbia esula (leafy spurge)
Lychnis alba (white cockle)
Senecio jacobaea (tansy ragwort)
Stachys palustris (woundwort)

2 Class Number Two weeds--capable of inflicting economic loss or ill health on people within the Province

Datura spp. (thorn-apple)

On the other hand California has over 160 plants listed in these categories:

A Noxious weed and noxious weed seed: eradication, containment, rejection, or other holding action at the state-county level. Quarantine interceptions to be rejected or treated at any point in the state.

B Noxious weed and noxious weed seed: eradication, containment, control or other holding action at the discretion of the commissioner

C Noxious weed and noxious weed seed: state-endorsed holding action and eradication only when found in a nursery; action to retard spread outside of nurseries at the discretion of the commissioner; reject only when found in a cropseed for planting or at the discretion of the commissioner. Designated noxious weeds in the CA Code of Regulations.

Q Noxious weed and noxious weed seed: temporary "A" action outside of nurseries at the state-county level pending determination of a permanent rating.

In the U. S. you can't transport certain plants into a state. Until recently the State of California had inspection stations where certain fruits were not allowed into the state.

Of course Cannabis is illegal in most countries ( I believe, there is some type of U. N. treaties regarding it). At one time Cannabis was a required plant to grow. Cannabis is starting to make a legal come back for Hemp: A New Crop with New Uses for North America*

Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/24/07 08:14 AM

I have heard weeds described as any plant that is out of place.

Wheat or oats growing in the flower bed or roses in the grain field would be considered weeds.
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/24/07 11:39 PM

What about the yellow blossomed dandelion? Not certain of spelling.

Isn't it also considered to be a weed?
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/25/07 10:16 AM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
What about the yellow blossomed dandelion? Not certain of spelling.

Isn't it also considered to be a weed?

I'm sure that lawn enthusiast and greens keepers would say so.

However, I had a now deceased uncle who grew dandelion in his garden and my aunt canned the greens. Other known uses of the plant; flowers can be used to make wine; leaves are edible and good for digestion; roots sometimes used as coffee substitute.

Ounce for ounce, they have more calcium than milk and as much iron as spinach, they also have beta-carotene, vits B, C, & E, fiber, magnesium, & potassium.

It is listed in many herbals, eg. Botanical.com and sold as seed. The Cook's Garden are examples.

So is dandelion a weed? Depends who you talk to.

I don't have a lawn on our 20 acres, so if they want to grow, I let them grow in many places.

I thought that those French improved Greens Dandelion looked pretty good.

I may have to get some seed for next years garden.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/26/07 05:22 PM

When it comes to weeds, I would say there are weeds and then there are noxious weeds. One that falls into the later category is that of the Puncture Vine Tribulus terrestris sometimes called goatshead.

Apparently the plant has some good qualities as it has been used in European and Chinese folk medicine.

But if you or your pet have stepped on the seed pod or ran over it with a bicycle tire, you would definitely consider it more than just a pesky plant.

I see that even this plant is now becoming popular among "athletes and body builders due to the belief that it raises testosterone levels." Apparently it is being touted, "to be effective in increasing energy levels and muscle mass, and in improving sexual performance." viable herbal solutions

Could it be said, that what is 'one man's weed, may be another man's treasure"? ;\)
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 07/27/07 09:40 AM

I happen to not a new product in the market today on the self with the soy, almond, oat, and rice milk and that was "Hemp milk. Another use for cannabis.
Posted By: crater

Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/09/07 08:35 AM

I have moved the discussion on weeds from The gardening forum to it's own forum.
Posted By: Daryl

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/09/07 10:03 PM

Dandelion greens before they blossom are good for eating.

I have eaten some, however, I am not as crazy about them as my wife is. \:\)

Once they have blossomed, for some strange reason, the dandelion greens are then no longer good for eating, so I have been told.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/11/07 07:03 AM

 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
Dandelion greens before they blossom are good for eating.

I have eaten some, however, I am not as crazy about them as my wife is. \:\)

Once they have blossomed, for some strange reason, the dandelion greens are then no longer good for eating, so I have been told.

I believe that dandelions, and chicory are members of the sunflower family as is lettuce.

I believe that when these plants bolt or go to seed, they become bitter and not as tasty.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/11/07 07:12 AM

Why do we have weeds, thistles, and thorns?

"Not one noxious plant was placed in the Lord's great garden, but after Adam and Eve sinned, poisonous herbs sprang up."

Ellen gives some more insight:

 Quote:
The Curse on All Creation.--All nature is confused; for God forbade the earth to carry out the purpose He had originally designed for it. Let there be no peace to the wicked, saith the Lord. The curse of God is upon all creation. Every year it makes itself more decidedly felt (MS 76a, 1901). {1BC 1085.5}

The first curse was pronounced upon the posterity of Adam and upon the earth, because of disobedience. The second curse came upon the ground after Cain slew his brother Abel. The third most dreadful curse from God, came upon the earth at the Flood (4SG 121). {1BC 1085.6}

The land has felt the curse, more and more heavily. Before the Flood, the first leaf which fell, and was discovered upon the ground, caused those who feared God great sorrow. They mourned over it as we mourn over the loss of a dead friend. In the decaying leaf they could see an evidence of the curse, and of the decay of nature (Ibid., 155). {1BC 1085.7}

(Rom. 8:22).--The sin of man has brought the sure result,--decay, deformity, and death. Today the whole world is tainted, corrupted, stricken with mortal disease. The earth groaneth under the continual transgression of the inhabitants thereof (Letter 22, Feb. 13, 1900). {1BC 1085.8}

The Lord's curse is upon the earth, upon man, upon beast, upon the fish in the sea, and as transgression becomes almost universal the curse will be permitted to become as broad and as deep as the transgression (Letter 59, 1898). {1BC 1085.9}

Tokens of God's Continued Love.--After the transgression of Adam, God might have destroyed every opening bud and blooming flower, or He might have taken away their fragrance, so grateful to the senses. In the earth seared and marred by the curse, in the briers, the thistles, the thorns, the tares, we may read the law of condemnation; but in the delicate color and perfume of the flowers, we may learn that God still loves us, that His mercy is not wholly withdrawn from the earth (RH Nov. 8, 1898). {1BC 1085.10}

God said to Adam, and to all the descendants of Adam, In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread; for from henceforth the earth must be worked under the drawback of transgression. Thorns and briars shall it produce (MS 84, 1897).
1086 {1BC 1085.11}

There is no place upon earth where the track of the serpent is not seen and his venomous sting felt. The whole earth is defiled under the inhabitants thereof. The curse is increasing as transgression increases (Letter 22, Feb. 13, 1900). {1BC 1086.1}

Amalgamation Brought Noxious Plants.--Not one noxious plant was placed in the Lord's great garden, but after Adam and Eve sinned, poisonous herbs sprang up. In the parable of the sower the question was asked the Master, "Didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? how then hath it tares?" The Master answered, "An enemy hath done this." All tares are sown by the evil one. Every noxious herb is of his sowing, and by his ingenious methods of amalgamation he has corrupted the earth with tares (MS 65, 1899) [published in F. D. Nichol, Ellen G. White and Her Critics]. {1BC 1086.2}
Posted By: Redfog

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/12/07 03:02 AM

In these parts we have a noxious weed known as the star thistle or spotted nap weed. The farmers hate it, but of course there are those of us who make our living with honey bees who love it. It produces a nice light mild tasting honey. One mans weed is another mans way of making a living.

BTW if my bees stray off the property where I have them and get nectar from someone else's field does that make me a thief? \:\)

Redfog
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/12/07 11:09 AM

We have Yellow Starthistle growing where we live too. I understand it is a Mediterranean native that was introduced by bee keepers. It seems to like disturbed soils. They introduced an insect (I think it is a thrip) to help control it. We have it growing in a few places on our land. I haven't heard of any other use for it, then as a honey plant.

Redfog, as far as your bees making you a thief, you could look at it another way. The neighbors are getting "free" pollination.
Posted By: Redfog

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/12/07 04:15 PM

Free pollination of a plant they don't want to grow there \:\) The star thistle (really spotted knapweed) we have has a pink flower. It tends to grow on sandy poor soils that are not that good for crops but when it gets into hay fields it mucks up the hay.

A lot of the neighbors near our 65 summer yards (we have about 1800 hives) thank us for having the bees there as it helps out their gardens. Only occasionally do we get complaints about them. My father was a avid, maybe fanatical, gardener and we always made sure there was a hive or two near his garden. He passed away now and we sure do miss his garden produce. It's hard for bee keepers to grow gardens because of the timing.

Redfog
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/12/07 06:30 PM

So is the "star thistle" that you are refering to lacks the stiff sharp spines of the yellow starthistle? \:\)

San Francisco Magazine awarded Star thistle honey as “One of the 125 Best Things to Eat in the San Francisco Bay Area.”
Posted By: Redfog

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/12/07 10:17 PM

They look somewhat similar but there are no spines on the knapweed. For several pictures go to:

http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=spotted+knapweed&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2

I looked at some of your yellow star thistle and see the spines. Apparently both plants are great for bees but bad for cattle.

Redfog
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/13/07 04:58 PM

Actually the knapweed doesn't look to bad. The flowers are pretty.

I see that the color is close to that of some alfalfa flowers, so it could blend into the hay fairly easily. I have gotten hay with the yellow star thistle in it before. I didn't like it but then I don't have horses.

From what I have read, apparently both plants are especially toxic to horses.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/15/07 05:11 PM

 Originally Posted By: crater
Why do we have weeds, thistles, and thorns?

"Not one noxious plant was placed in the Lord's great garden, but after Adam and Eve sinned, poisonous herbs sprang up."

Ellen gives some more insight:

 Quote:
The Curse on All Creation.--All nature is confused; for God forbade the earth to carry out the purpose He had originally designed for it. Let there be no peace to the wicked, saith the Lord. The curse of God is upon all creation. Every year it makes itself more decidedly felt (MS 76a, 1901). {1BC 1085.5}

The first curse was pronounced upon the posterity of Adam and upon the earth, because of disobedience. The second curse came upon the ground after Cain slew his brother Abel. The third most dreadful curse from God, came upon the earth at the Flood (4SG 121). {1BC 1085.6}

The land has felt the curse, more and more heavily. Before the Flood, the first leaf which fell, and was discovered upon the ground, caused those who feared God great sorrow. They mourned over it as we mourn over the loss of a dead friend. In the decaying leaf they could see an evidence of the curse, and of the decay of nature (Ibid., 155). {1BC 1085.7}

(Rom. 8:22).--The sin of man has brought the sure result,--decay, deformity, and death. Today the whole world is tainted, corrupted, stricken with mortal disease. The earth groaneth under the continual transgression of the inhabitants thereof (Letter 22, Feb. 13, 1900). {1BC 1085.8}

The Lord's curse is upon the earth, upon man, upon beast, upon the fish in the sea, and as transgression becomes almost universal the curse will be permitted to become as broad and as deep as the transgression (Letter 59, 1898). {1BC 1085.9}

Tokens of God's Continued Love.--After the transgression of Adam, God might have destroyed every opening bud and blooming flower, or He might have taken away their fragrance, so grateful to the senses. In the earth seared and marred by the curse, in the briers, the thistles, the thorns, the tares, we may read the law of condemnation; but in the delicate color and perfume of the flowers, we may learn that God still loves us, that His mercy is not wholly withdrawn from the earth (RH Nov. 8, 1898). {1BC 1085.10}

God said to Adam, and to all the descendants of Adam, In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread; for from henceforth the earth must be worked under the drawback of transgression. Thorns and briars shall it produce (MS 84, 1897).
1086 {1BC 1085.11}

There is no place upon earth where the track of the serpent is not seen and his venomous sting felt. The whole earth is defiled under the inhabitants thereof. The curse is increasing as transgression increases (Letter 22, Feb. 13, 1900). {1BC 1086.1}

Amalgamation Brought Noxious Plants.--Not one noxious plant was placed in the Lord's great garden, but after Adam and Eve sinned, poisonous herbs sprang up. In the parable of the sower the question was asked the Master, "Didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? how then hath it tares?" The Master answered, "An enemy hath done this." All tares are sown by the evil one. Every noxious herb is of his sowing, and by his ingenious methods of amalgamation he has corrupted the earth with tares (MS 65, 1899) [published in F. D. Nichol, Ellen G. White and Her Critics]. {1BC 1086.2}
I have to say that I wonder which plants are the "tares are sown by the evil one; every noxious herb is of his sowing, and by his ingenious methods of amalgamation he has corrupted the earth with tares"?

Did the adversary get involved with genetic breeding of plants to cause the thorns, the spines, and stickers on plants. Did they originally not have these items? \:\)
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 08/29/07 09:51 AM

I came across some more on the "weed" dandelion; Dandelion is known to stop the promotion of oncogenes. (When damaged or turned on, an oncogene initiates cancer). Dr. Michael Tierra L.AC., O.M.D. had the following to say on the "weed".

 Quote:
A Botanical Approach to the Treatment of Cancer The greens with a bitter flavor such as dandelion and chicory more powerfully stimulate detoxification, especially from the liver. They are also potassium rich foods. They can be served steamed or lightly sautéed with a little olive or sesame oil.

Dandelion (Herba Taraxaci or Chinese, Pu Gong Ying) The whole herb is used. It Clears heat, is sweet, bitter, mild and cold with no toxicity. It is especially effective for curing female breast abscess. It goes to the Liver and Spleen. It contains taraxasterol, choline, inulin and pectin.

Interestingly Chang Minyi states that "the drug (herb) has been processed into an extract or pills and is widely used for treating various sorts of cancer." This statement seems very unsubstantiated by my experience.

The hot water extract inhibits sarcoma-180 in mice with an effective rate of 43.5%, whereas the hot water extract has no effect. The hot water extract contains a polyose substance that is anti-carcinogenic and promotes immunity.

According to Elucidation of the Materia Medica, The drug cures female breast cancer because breast abscess is distributed to the Liver channel which dominates all the body activities during menstruation." This seems to suggest that because dandelion activates liver function, it helps the liver neutralize estrogen which can activate certain cancer cells.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 09/05/07 05:02 PM

Any experience with Stinging Nettle, to share?
Posted By: Mountain Man

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 09/05/07 05:21 PM

Yeah, it is one of the most delicious wild edible plants. It is full of vitamins, minerals, and proteins. It can be a pain to gather, but once boiled for 59 seconds it is wonderfully tasty. It is best before the flowers bloom. It can also be eaten raw when the leaves are folded properly. Mud made from rich mineral soil and charcoal and applied to the itchy bumps that form when stung helps alleviate the problem.
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 09/07/07 08:37 AM

Mountain Man, thanks for sharing about; Stinging Nettle. I have located some growing near a mountain creek this past spring, as well as some Coltsfoot. I didn't collect any at the time. I did take photo's though.

I have purchase nettle at the health food store and combine it with some other herbs for a tea blend. As you said "It is full of vitamins, minerals, and protein". It is suppose to be very nourishing for hair, skin, and nails. The fresh juice apparently has some homeostatic, styptic, anti-hemorrhage properties. The other day I came across a fairly good little article; Nettles: The Sting—"Minor"; Healing Properties—"Major" by Ingri Cassel
Posted By: crater

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 10/09/07 11:08 PM

A weed that likes to grow in the garden setting is Lambs Quarters (Chenopodium album) also know as goose foot due to the shape of the leaves.

A few months ago my mother mentioned that Dr. Neil Needly had mentioned it was high in some nutrients but she couldn't remember what. Indian Spring Herbs website gives a list of some of the nutritional components of the plant as well as a quiche recipe, (vegetarian, but not Vegan). I found another site that has much more indebth Nutritional Data for Lambs quarters

Both the seeds and leaves are suppose to be eatable. I picked some leaves from the plants that came up in my garden, I used them in a stir fry with my favorite rice noodles and must say that I enjoyed the dish. \:\)

I have read that the seeds may be ground into flour during late fall.

Anyone have any experience eating the leaves or the seeds?

Medicinally: I have also read that a poultice from the leaf can be applied to burns.

For those prone to kidney stones and arthritis, apparently a constituent of this plant, as well as in rhubarb, spinach, and swiss chard to name a few, are high in Oxalic acid
Posted By: gordonb1

Re: Weeds, plants out of place? - 10/10/07 02:24 AM

Hello crater,


Yes, Have eaten lambsquarters frequently. It saved me time when working on a certain farm - less to prepare for lunch. Just grab a pita and a tomato, then pick some handfuls of the green plant at lunchtime. Don't recall cooking it. Cooking seems such a crime to inflict on healthy plants. I usually pick the tops as they are most tender.

Others have said that cooking greens rich in oxalic acid (beet greens, purslane, spinach, chard, etc.) will increase the amount or assimilation of oxalic acid. This would make sense to someone who advocates eating raw food as the Creator's first menu for man. I have yet to see the science on this though I have heard many opinions. I use nettle in tea blends.
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