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Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177419
10/14/15 09:58 PM
10/14/15 09:58 PM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,211
Midland
Originally Posted By: ProdigalOne
Since, the vast majority of forum members, and SDA Church members, believe that the false claim of Sunday sacredness vs the divinely ordained holy Sabbath will be the focal point and ultimate test of faithfulness to God, in the final battle between Christ and Satan. Yes, I believe it merits further discussion.

Originally Posted By: Elle
There is some truth in this statement : "Jones teaches that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday as part of the New Covenant" But it is not all the truth.

Sometimes,
hopes are dashed.

Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177423
10/15/15 03:10 AM
10/15/15 03:10 AM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: Elle
There is some truth in this statement : "Jones teaches that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday as part of the New Covenant" But it is not all the truth. I don't think this discussion is the place to talk about it, but would be glad to expand on it in another discussion.

The Sabbath was changed to Sunday? I think what you really meant to say was that the first day of the week became Monday. Sunday would therefore be the seventh day. In Islam, the first day of the week is Saturday. For the Jews, Sunday. Paul says, "One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." (Rom. 14:5)

///

Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: kland] #177440
10/15/15 11:47 AM
10/15/15 11:47 AM
ProdigalOne  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,043
Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: ProdigalOne
Since, the vast majority of forum members, and SDA Church members, believe that the false claim of Sunday sacredness vs the divinely ordained holy Sabbath will be the focal point and ultimate test of faithfulness to God, in the final battle between Christ and Satan. Yes, I believe it merits further discussion.

Originally Posted By: Elle
There is some truth in this statement : "Jones teaches that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday as part of the New Covenant" But it is not all the truth.

Sometimes,
hopes are dashed.



Alas, so it would seem...


Elle, if you would like to discuss this further, perhaps let everyone know how you came to believe what you believe, maybe we should start another thread?


"...I will not forget you.
Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."

Isaiah 49:15-16
Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: ProdigalOne] #177443
10/15/15 01:18 PM
10/15/15 01:18 PM
E
Elle  Offline OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
Originally Posted By: ProdigalOne
Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: ProdigalOne
Since, the vast majority of forum members, and SDA Church members, believe that the false claim of Sunday sacredness vs the divinely ordained holy Sabbath will be the focal point and ultimate test of faithfulness to God, in the final battle between Christ and Satan. Yes, I believe it merits further discussion.

Originally Posted By: Elle
There is some truth in this statement : "Jones teaches that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday as part of the New Covenant" But it is not all the truth.

Sometimes,
hopes are dashed.



Alas, so it would seem...


Elle, if you would like to discuss this further, perhaps let everyone know how you came to believe what you believe, maybe we should start another thread?


Yes start another thread. You start it, as a study, the way you want it. For sure, I will share from the Bible whatever you or another haven't brought forth yet concerning all the Sabbaths. Also, we need to look at all the 8th day laws that is also found in scriptures. The 8th days laws are as important as the Sabbaths for all is part of His plan. We are to live by ALL the words that proceeds from the Lord's mouth and not by some that we have cherry picked.

What I see from scriptures is there is a place and purpose for both the Sabbath laws(weekly, 7 Feasts Sabbath days, Yearly Sabbath, the Jubilee Sabbath) and the 8th days laws(circumcision, presenting the priesthood, wave sheaf, Pentecost, etc...) Anyone who ignores any of the Sabbath laws or any of the 8th days laws .. are missing important pieces of the puzzle and will come short in their understanding and application of it in their life(=sin or =lawlessness).

Also we need to provide a link of the new discussion here so that people can follow it if they want to.


Blessings
Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177450
10/15/15 05:01 PM
10/15/15 05:01 PM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,211
Midland
8th? I thought we were talking about the Sabbath being changed to Sunday.

But if you are going to talk about other things and separate and divide and rearrange things, don't forget 1st day laws. Neither forget 2nd day laws, and 3rd day laws, and 4th day laws, and 5th day laws, and 6th day laws, and 9th day laws (which is really the 10th day in the case).

Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177458
10/15/15 08:46 PM
10/15/15 08:46 PM
ProdigalOne  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,043
Alberta, Canada

I have started another thread for this discussion in the Bible Study forum.
Here is the link:

http://www.maritime-sda-online.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=177457


"...I will not forget you.
Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."

Isaiah 49:15-16
Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: James Peterson] #177461
10/15/15 09:15 PM
10/15/15 09:15 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,153
Brazil
Quote:
The Sabbath was changed to Sunday? I think what you really meant to say was that the first day of the week became Monday. Sunday would therefore be the seventh day. In Islam, the first day of the week is Saturday. For the Jews, Sunday.

This is not correct at all. In Islam, and for all peoples who have a seven-day week, the first day of the week is Sunday, and the seventh is Saturday.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_calendar

Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Rosangela] #177463
10/15/15 10:06 PM
10/15/15 10:06 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
NON-SDA
Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: Rosangela
This is not correct at all. In Islam, and for all peoples who have a seven-day week, the first day of the week is Sunday, and the seventh is Saturday. Islamic Calendar

Many local people believe as you do, unaware of the practice of international diplomacy and commerce.
  • "The ISO week date system is a leap week calendar system that is part of the ISO 8601 date and time standard. The system is used (mainly) in government and business for fiscal years, as well as in timekeeping. The system specifies a week year atop the Gregorian calendar by defining a notation for ordinal weeks of the year."
    ...
  • "The ISO week calendar relies on the Gregorian calendar, which it augments, to define the new year day (Monday of week 01). As a result, leap weeks are spread across the 400-year cycle in a complex, seemingly random pattern. There is no simple algorithm to determine whether a year has 53 weeks without tabular lookup. Most calendar reform proposals using leap week calendars are simpler in this regard, although they may choose a different leap cycle."
    ...
  • "Not all parts of the world consider the week to begin with Monday. For example, in some Muslim countries, the normal work week begins on Saturday, while in Israel it begins on Sunday. In the US, although the work week is usually defined to start on Monday, the week itself is often considered to start on Sunday."
-- Source: ISO

///

Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177483
10/17/15 12:13 AM
10/17/15 12:13 AM
E
Elle  Offline OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
The Keshe Foundation
by Stephen Jones

"...
Today the Keshe Foundation is set to offer FREE ENERGY to the world.

http://www.keshefoundation.org/

It was founded by Dr. Mehran Tavakoli Kesh, an Iranian scientist who has discovered a simple way to use energy through plasma, rather than electricity itself as a source of energy. One simple devise can be used to power a home, another for a car, and even whole cities. He says that the device is so simple that a child could make it.

He is giving this to the world today, October 16, 2015, at a peace conference in Rome. Simultaneously, he is having his associates give one to the leaders of many nations, including China, Russia, and the USA. He is also giving 1000 units to individual poor people in various countries, including the Philippines—where it appears that he is manufacturing those units.

Further, he is freely publishing the blueprints for all to make these devices, so that it cannot be suppressed by the powers that be (or were).

The meeting in Rome today invites the ambassadors of all nations to attend and to sign his Peace Treaty in exchange for free energy. However, whether they sign this or not, the free energy is being given to the world today. Will the Keshe Foundation actually succeed in doing this? Well, they have taken extraordinary steps to ensure that no power can stop its publication. He says that if anything happens to him, others have instructions to carry on with the plan. In fact, on the link above, it appears that these blueprints have already been posted at the bottom of the page.

Here is a link that was posted on September 24, 2015, telling of this plan to release free energy devices on October 16. It is long, but I think the first 48 minutes will give you everything you need to know. In it he says, “The course of mankind has changed.” The Keshe Foundation plans to produce 1 million units by November or December and teach many others to manufacture these units as quickly as possible.

youtu.be/BM8wuqPmVBg

He says that this free energy device will cause chaos and collapse of all industries that rely upon the sale of conventional energy—whether oil, gas, electricity, coal, or nuclear energy—because they will no longer be needed. Pollution problems will end quickly.

Excerpts are as follows, in his own slightly flawed English:

Quote:
“In the next twelve months, we will see the collapse of major organizations and connected pharmaceuticals and oil industries—without a shadow of a doubt. All these monopolies of health, monopolies of energy has finished. And the beauty of it is the Keshe Foundation with thousands of supporters around the world, more or less in every nation, will do it for your nation. You don’t need us. We do not ask to send any money to Keshe Foundation; we do not ask to sign any non-disclosure agreements or secrecy agreements. We do not even sign copyright agreements.

“Governments have no control… It will bring absolute chaos for governments, for what they have set up to control. Because with this blue box, they have lost full control. There is no control. There is no possibility to change the course of humanity, because hundreds of thousands already know how to build it.

“You will be shocked when you open the inside of it. It is so simple… There is no moving parts.”


A century ago the free energy discoveries of Nicola Tesla were suppressed in order to protect the interests of JP Morgan and other Babylonian oligarchs, who had gained control of the people largely through the control of energy. It appears that as of today, this suppression is being ended by another brilliant scientist, this time from Iran.

Economic Chaos

If the plans of Dr. Keshe succeed today, there is little doubt that his free energy device will cause chaos and collapse in energy stocks. The only real question is how long it will take. If the news media were to publicize the conference today, then I would expect to see the collapse occur immediately. But the mainstream news media probably will not report this until they are forced by internet publicity to do so.

...
Regardless of when this market collapse occurs, we should be prepared as much as possible. Those who hold shares of stock in energy will probably suffer the most, but a collapse in that area will affect banking stocks and most other areas as well. For the average person who owns nothing in the stock market, they will lose the least, and when they are able to obtain their own free energy device, they will be the greatest beneficiaries in this transition.

Under Babylon’s system of expensive energy (to support its oligarchs), the earth strains to feed its population. Babylon calls it overpopulation, but the truth is that the problem has been caused by their monopolistic control of energy that makes production too expensive for many people to buy food. In the Kingdom of God that is coming, the earth will be able to support many times the current population with no problem at all.

It appears that in the coming year we will enter the chaos of change as the world adjusts to the new reality brought to us by a Persian.

Sudden Destruction

Paul wrote in 1 Thessalonians 5:2, 3,

2 For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. 3 While they are saying, “Peace and Safety!” then destruction will come upon them suddenly like birth pangs upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

It is interesting that the release of the free energy devices is set in the context of a peace conference in Rome. The Keshe Foundation home page advertises “Free Energy in exchange for world peace.”

http://www.keshefoundation.org/

Most of us have been accustomed to thinking of Paul’s statement in negative terms. Men have taught that the Antichrist will come and make a peace treaty with Israel in the middle of the “Great Tribulation,” after which will come “destruction.” But if the events today fulfill this prophecy (at least on one level), then it could be said that the Keshe Foundation is offering world peace by giving the world a free energy device, which will then bring chaos and collapse to the Babylonian world system.

Further, if this proves to be the case, then today would mark the start of the “birth pangs” of the Age to come, which no one can escape. Paul goes on to tell the believers in verses 4-7,

4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day should overtake you like a thief; 5 For you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night nor of darkness; 6 so then let us not sleep as others do, but let us be alert and sober. 7 For those who sleep do their sleeping at night, and those who get drunk get drunk at night.

The “rapture” doctrine teaches that the “thief” is Christ coming to snatch Christians off the earth. But in biblical times, the metaphor referred to a band of thieves who would ride into town while men were sleeping and plunder it with destruction. (Note the story: Ali Baba and the Forty Thieves.) So Paul did not treat this thief as a burglar quietly stealing something while men sleep, but rather as an Ali Baba who comes suddenly with great noise and destruction.

If we may apply these verses to the acts of the Kesh Foundation, we may find comfort from Paul. If we understand what is going on and are watchful, alert, and sober, not being drunk on the wine of Babylon, then God will take care of us no matter what the situation is around us. Paul continues in 1 Thessalonians 5:8-11,

8 8 But since we are of the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 who died for us, that whether we are awake or sleep, we may live together with Him. 11 Therefore encourage one another, and build up one another, just as you also are doing.

Always keep in mind that the chaos of Babylon’s collapse is not designed to destroy God’s people, but to set them free. This was true in Daniel’s day, when the original city of Babylon fell; it is the same today when Mystery Babylon collapses.

So be encouraged.

- See more at: http://www.gods-kingdom-ministries.net/d...h.v1Jf3OAx.dpuf


Blessings
Re: A new Global Economic Restructure in 2012 [Re: Elle] #177486
10/17/15 01:30 AM
10/17/15 01:30 AM
E
Elle  Offline OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
My comment: Last week I read somewhere that China approved the TPP trade alliance that Obama was pushing secretly -- as long as they(TPP) respect international trading laws. I can't find that article anymore. However, I thought that was very fair of China to have done so by supporting any nations to form their own trading partners.

To refresh your memory about what the TPP partnership consist, here's a portion of post#159622 on page 25 that describes it :
Quote:
Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) is a deal that currently Obama is trying to make with a handfull of International corporation to set the corporation the ability to create a new set of rules regulating 12 countries(US, Canada, Australia, Japan, S.Korea, etc...).

It is not a free trade deal, but the reality it is a giant monster give away deal that gives the corporation the ability to sue the countries for regulation they do not like. It would allow the corporation monopoly to expand.

In brief the TPP would sacrifice whatever counrties sovereignty left, internet freedom, and public health all in the name in helping private corporation.

This deal is being set almost entirely in secret. Notice that the media doesn't say much about this as they want this to go through without the people knowing and resisting it.


Even though the TPP doesn't have "pure motives"...they need to be allowed to show their intention. However, if they abuse international trading laws, then I suspect that China and other countries will reprimend the TPP.

The article below gives an opinion what could be the TPP true intention....whatever it may be ... I do not believe it will work. I do think the author of the article is correct in believing that mass protests will arise within the TPP countries once the people learn what their government has done. (That is if these 12 countries government can succeed to pass the TPP agreement as it is still not passed in the US.) I think the people will reject it as it was rejected by the people of Malaysia.

The Secretive Trans-Pacific Partnership: Washington’s Strategy to Isolate China

By Timothy Alexander Guzman
Global Research, October 15, 2015
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-secreti...e-china/5482252
Quote:
“When more than 95 percent of our potential customers live outside our borders, we can’t let countries like China write the rules of the global economy” - U.S. President Barack H. Obama

The secretive Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) is an agreement that serves numerous purposes; one of them is to contain China’s rising economic power in the Asia-Pacific region. The Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) who normally advises Washington’s insiders on foreign policy matters produced a report titled ‘Revising U.S. Grand Strategy Toward China’ written by Robert D. Blackwill and Ashley J. Tellis which clearly states that “China represents and will remain the most significant competitor to the United States for decades to come” and that “the likelihood of a long-term strategic rivalry between Beijing and Washington is high.” Blackwill and Tellis recommend that the U.S. Congress “Deliver on the Trans-Pacific Partnership, … as a geoeconomic answer to growing Chinese economic power and geopolitical coercion in Asia.” It is a clear message to China. The main-stream media is also on board with the TPP agreement, for example The Washington Post published an article titled ‘The Trans-Pacific Partnership is a trade deal worth celebrating’, and why is the TPP worth celebrating? “By knitting the U.S. and Japanese economies together in their first free-trade deal — and binding both of them closer to rising Asian nations — the TPP would create a counterweight to China in East Asia”. Time magazine also had a headline that said it all ‘Pacific Trade Deal Is Good for the U.S. and Obama’s Legacy’ which makes its case that a “U.S. presence” will protect its partners from any perceived threats from China:

But Asia is an exception, because deeper involvement there can create economic opportunities (like TPP), and because China’s neighbors are eager for a lasting U.S. presence to protect them from over-dependence for growth and security on China

China was left out of the deal intentionally (not to say that China would benefit from the deal in any way), the reason is that the U.S. wants an alliance of nations than can counter China’s rise to an economic powerhouse. The TPP is meant to isolate China while the U.S. expands its presence in the Pacific (Part of the Pentagon’s ‘Full Spectrum Dominance’) turning its partners in the TPP trade deal into cheap labor colonies without rights that will serve U.S. interests.

Can China counter the TPP?

RT news reported that China can unite to counter the TPP with Europe which accounts for “€1 billion in trade daily, while bilateral trade in goods reached €428.1 billion in 2013.” According to the RT news report:

This raises questions, whether China and other countries are ready to unite to counter-balance the Pacific Rim pact. “China and Europe may finally look at each other and find some commonalities that they were unaware of before,” said Alicia Garcia Herrero, chief Asia-Pacific economist at Natixis, in a report quoted by CNBC. “China expressed interest to the EU commencing negotiations on a bilateral FTA [free trade agreement] when President Xi Jinping visited the EU in March 2014. At the time, the EU recognized this to be a desirable long-term objective rather than something that would be negotiated in the near future,” CNBC quotes Rajiv Biswas, Asia-Pacific chief economist at HIS as saying

RT news also reported that “another way for China to oppose TPP is boosting its BRICS participation. Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa comprise about 30 percent of world’s GDP at the moment in PPP terms and are projected to increase to as much as 45 percent by 2030.” Which rightly so, allows China to bypass the TPP trade zone.

Malaysia’s Internal Opposition to the TPP

There are already disagreements within countries such as Malaysia where former Prime Minister; Dr. Mahathir Mohamad had recently said that the TPP is a “very bad” agreement. According to The Malaysian Insider (www.themalaysianinsider.com) “Anti-TPP lobbyists said the agreement has removed the country’s control over policymaking and put the government at risk of being sued if it favoured public interests over foreign investors.” This means that if an environmental accident occurred and people were injured or killed, the Malaysian government cannot sue the corporations or governments involved. Dr. Mohamad explains “Let’s say a few countries are into mining and it pollutes the environment and we stop it, they (the companies) can sue governments for loss of future profits” the report said.

The TPP is a corporate takeover that will ease rules that normally protects working-class people and labor unions. The TPP will offshore jobs from the U.S. and Canada to low-wage nations like Malaysia, Mexico, Peru and Vietnam.

The agreement also eliminates health, safety and environmental regulations and favors corporations such as Monsanto over food safety issues. The TPP will empower pharmaceutical corporations that will expand its monopolistic control over its manufacturing practices which will eventually increase the price of medicine. The TPP also threatens internet privacy and the list goes on. However, as bad as the TPP is, China is the big enchilada. It is important to remember that the U.S. holds the largest debt in world history while China is the creditor nation that buys U.S. debt (although it has been dumping U.S. dollars at unprecedented levels) regardless, Washington still pushes this ludicrous deal that only makes matters worse in terms of diplomacy. The TPP serves multiple purposes; one of them is to expand an economic war that will repel China’s influence in the region. All countries that signed on to the TPP should keep in mind what Russian President Vladimir Putin once said “Washington doesn’t want partners. Washington wants vassals.”

More information on the TPP will surface in the months to come, but so far the available information we do have has one specific goal, and that is to contain China at the expense of less developed nations. The TPP is about the U.S. dominating the Asia-Pacific through trade agreements accompanied by its political and military presence to ensure that the multi-national corporations continue to make profits while pushing the Chinese dragon into the corner. My opinion is that the TPP will fail. The Malaysian people are one of the first to oppose this agreement. My prediction is that all of the governments that signed on to the agreement will face mass protests within their own borders, and that will be a positive step towards defeating the TPP once and for all.


Blessings
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