HOME CHAT ROOM #1 CHAT ROOM #2 Forum Topics Within The Last 7 Days REGISTER ENTER FORUMS BIBLE SCHOOL CONTACT US

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine Christian Family Fellowship Forums
(formerly Maritime SDA OnLine)
Consisting mainly of both members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church
Welcomes and invites other members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church to join us!

Click Here To Read Legal Notice & Disclaimer
Suggested a One Time Yearly $20 or Higher Donation Accepted Here to Help Cover the Yearly Expenses of Operating & Upgrading. We need at least $20 X 10 yearly donors.
Donations accepted: Here
ShoutChat Box
Newest Members
MrAbdullaQodiriy, ByronS, TruthinTypes, LoveGodsWord, Freth
1316 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums118
Topics9,061
Posts193,406
Members1,316
Most Online5,850
Feb 29th, 2020
Seventh-day Adventist Church In Canada Links
Seventh-day Adventist Church in Canada

Newfoundland & Labrador Mission

Maritime Conference

Quebec Conference

Ontario Conference

Manitoba-Saskatchewan Conference

Alberta Conference

British Columbia Conference

7 Top Posters(30 Days)
Daryl 13
Karen Y 13
Kevin H 11
Rick H 10
February
S M T W T F S
1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8 9 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28
Member Spotlight
Kevin H
Kevin H
New York
Posts: 550
Joined: November 2004
Show All Member Profiles 
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Live Space Station Tracking
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
Last 7 Pictures From Photo Gallery Forums
He hath set an harvest for thee
Rivers Of Living Water
He Leads Us To Green Pastures
Remember What God Has Done
Remember The Sabbath
"...whiter than snow..."
A Beautiful Spring Day
Who's Online
7 registered members (dedication, ProdigalOne, Kevin H, Karen Y, bill54, 2 invisible), 971 guests, and 10 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... #139429
02/04/12 01:49 AM
02/04/12 01:49 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
or is it a mixture of poor translation to the Greek word that best fit the Hebrew text, and has led to some false doctrines such as immortality of the soul.

Hell has been taught from the Bible as a underworld where Satan and his minions wait for the wicked to inflict everlasting torment, but does the Bible actually teach that.

So lets look at what scripture actually teaches as what happens for both good and bad after death, where the saints ultimate go, and also how and where is the ultimate destruction of the wicked. Scripture tells us it will be a consuming fire, but because of the Greek words used in translating from the Hebrew text it has become confused with Greek myths and the false teaching of immortality. Christians have picked up these false ideas and pagan beliefs which teach that a part of, or essence of, or spirit being of an individual, which carries with it and confers personal identity, survives the death of the body of this world and this lifetime, by natural or supernatural means. This is at odds and in contrast to the scriptural teaching that the dead go to the grave and know nothing and at the end, a eternal oblivion awaits for the wicked and a eternal life for the saints.

Last edited by Rick H; 02/04/12 02:13 AM.
Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139431
02/04/12 01:51 AM
02/04/12 01:51 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
If we study our Greek history, we know the Greeks had come up with myths that all the dead dwell below the earth in the realm of Hades and Persephone;, good and bad alike, leading a shadowy and cheerless existence. The Greek god Hades was the king of the underworld, a place where souls live after death. The Greek god Hermes, the messenger of the gods, would take the dead soul of a person to the underworld (sometimes called Hades or the House of Hades). Hermes would leave the soul on the banks of the River Styx, the river between life and death. Charon, also known as the ferry-man, would take the soul across the river to Hades, if the soul had gold: Upon burial, the family of the dead soul would put coins under the deceased's tongue. Once crossed, the soul would be judged by Aeacus, Rhadamanthus and King Minos. The soul would be sent to Elysium, Tartarus, Asphodel Fields, or the Fields of Punishment.

From the sixth century BC onwards the Greeks developed pagan ideas for the dead, and of reincarnation and even transmigration of souls. These ideas are particularly associated with the pagan Greek Religious Mysteries or Eleusinian mysteries , where initiation in this life into its ‘mysteries’ are the prerequisites for getting to paradise in the next life. So when the Hebrew text was translated, you see where the Greek words used came loaded with ideas not in line with the original Hebrew, but since at the time, Greek was used as basically English is used today to communicate between people across the world, it was translated into these Greek words, and we have to go back to what the original Hebrew scribes words they wrote to understand their meaning.

Last edited by Rick H; 02/04/12 01:52 AM.
Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139432
02/04/12 01:53 AM
02/04/12 01:53 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
So lets first look at the translation of the words closely to see their original meaning:

· Hades was the Greek work used in some places for the Hebrew term, Sheol or grave as "the place of the dead". Thus, it is used in reference to both the righteous and the wicked, since both wind up there eventually.
· Gehenna refers to the "Valley of Hinnon", which was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem. It was a place where people burned their garbage and thus there was always a fire burning there. Bodies of those deemed to have died in sin without hope of salvation were thrown there to be destroyed. Gehenna is used in the New Testament as a metaphor for the final place of punishment for the wicked after the resurrection.
· Tartaro (the verb "throw to Tartarus") occurs only once in the New Testament in II Peter 2:4, and basically means the abyss or oblivion.
· The Hebrew word Abaddon, meaning to perish or "destruction", is sometimes used and basically means the same as the abyss or oblivion.

In most translations they often translate Gehenna as "Hell" which was the Greek closest to the meaning. Young's Literal Translation is a notable exception, simply using "Gehenna".

As you can see, Hades is the Greek word used for the Hebrew word Sheol in Greek translations of the Hebrew Bible. While earlier translations most often translated Hades as "hell", as does the King James Version, modern translations use the transliteration "Hades", or render the word as allusions "to the grave", "among the dead", "place of the dead" and many other like statements in other verses. In Latin, Hades began to incorrectly be translated as Purgatorium (Purgatory in English use) after about 1200 A.D., but no modern English translations put Hades as Purgatory. In the King James Bible, the Old Testament term Sheol is translated as "Hell" 31 times. However, Sheol was translated as "the grave" 31 other times.[54] Sheol is also translated as "the pit" three times.Modern translations, however, no longer translate Sheol as "Hell" at all, instead rendering it "the grave," "the pit," or "death."

Scripture tells us that the dead are awaiting resurrection at the last judgment, when Christ comes and also when each person will receive his reward (Matt 8:11-12; II Cor 5:10; Rev 20:12), and a time of surprises for some when individuals who have proclaimed their fidelity to Jesus who will discover that in fact, they have no relation to him at all and are part of those lost with the wicked, while others who have made no claims for themselves but like the thief on the cross had faith, will find their lives rewarded with eternal life along with the other saints. (Matt 7:21-23; Luke 13:25-30).

In the Hebrew text it teaches that when people die they go to sheol, the grave (Gen. 37:35), Gehenna which is the consuming by fire of the wicked (Matt 5:22-29; 10:28; 18:9; 23:33; Mark 9:43, 45, 47; Luke 12:5; James 3:6). Which when the grave or the eternal oblivion of the wicked was translated into Greek, the word Hades was sometimes used, which is a term for the realm of the dead. (Matt 11:23; Luke 10:15; Rev 1:18; 6:8; 20:13-14). Nevertheless the meaning depending on context was the grave, death, or the end of the wicked in which they are ultimately destroyed in the specific way in which scripture shows at the end, which is a consuming fire which destroys them for eternity ("The lake of fire" Rev 20:15)

So we see where the grave or death or eventual destruction of the wicked, was translated using Greek words that since they had no exact ones to use, became a mix of mistranslation, pagan influence, and Greek myth associated with the word, but its original meaning was simple death or the destruction of the wicked at the end. “Hades” was simply the word closest in meaning to the Hebrew “Sheol”. The new versions now leave the word 'Sheol' untranslated, which is better than the Greek words used in others which cause confusion if the necessary basic Hebrew to Greek word translation used at the time is not understood.

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139433
02/04/12 01:57 AM
02/04/12 01:57 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
If we read the Hebrew text, we see the prophets who wrote the Bible did not know the word "Hell"; they used the Hebrew Sheol, which meant the grave, and also descriptions which with the translation to Greek, three different Greek words are used that are translated as “Hell. As I show in the previous post, it’s important to know this, for they each mean something different. They are “Tartarus,”“Gehenna,” and “Hades.” Tartarus is used only once in the New Testament, in 2 Peter 2:4.

The Scripture says,
God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell [Tartarus], and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment (2 Peter 2:4).

This verse says that “the angels that sinned”(which would include Lucifer, too) have already been cast down “to hell” by God Himself. Yet they aren’t burning right now, obviously, and they certainly aren’t suffering somewhere far beneath the earth. Tartarus means “dark abyss” or “place of restraint.” It isn’t a place of punishment either. Look carefully. 2 Peter 2:4 says Satan’s angels are “reserved unto judgment,” which means their punishment is yet future. For Satan and his evil angels, the fire hasn’t started yet. So Tartarus seems more of God holding back these evil angels in a way that does not allow them freedom to do their evil work, but it is not presented as a burning place of eternal fire, but for angels used to going thru and fro, any restraint is devastating for them.

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139434
02/04/12 02:01 AM
02/04/12 02:01 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
Next lets look at the word:“Gehenna.” Most every Bible scholar agrees this word is derived from the name of the narrow, rocky valley of Hinnom just south of Jerusalem where trash, filth, and the bodies of dead animals were burned up in Bible days. Here is a quote from Bible Facts" by Jenny Roberts “..Gehenna meant "the valley of Hinnom", and was originally a particular valley outside Jerusalem, where children were sacrificed to the god Moloch (2 Kings 23:10; 2 Chron. 28:3;Jer. 32:35). In later Jewish literature Gehenna came to be associated with a place of torment and unquenchable fire that was to be the punishment for sinners. It was thought by many that lesser sinners might eventually be delivered from the fires of Gehenna, but by New Testament times punishment for sinners was deemed to be eternal...."

Jesus Christ spoke about Gehenna and it means a place where the wicked will be burned, and the lake of fire still fits. In Matthew 5:22, 29 & 30 Jesus warned about “the danger of hell [Gehenna] fire”(Matthew 5:22)and we can see Gehenna definitely suggests real flames. The key question is when will this fire burn, Christ shows us when the fire will burn:

“As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. 41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 13:40-42)

Peter taught the same thing when he wrote:
But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. 2 Peter 3:7

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139435
02/04/12 02:02 AM
02/04/12 02:02 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
Now lets look closer at the word Sheol", which is a Hebrew word used for the abode of the dead. It is thought of as a place situated below the ground (Ezek. 31:15), a place of darkness, silence and forgetfulness (Job 10:21). Although the dead in sheol are apparently cut off from God (Ps. 88:3-5), he is not absent (Ps. 139:8), and is able to deliver souls from sheol (Ps. 16:10). It is sometimes translated as "hell"; however, it is not seen as a place of eternal punishment, and its use in the New Testament (e.g. Matt. 16:18; Acts 2:27) suggests a meaning relating simply to the power of death.”......"Bible Facts" by Jenny Roberts

Sheol (pronounced "Sheh-ole"), in Hebrew שאול (Sh'ol), is the "abode of the dead", the "underworld", or "pit". Sheol is the common destination of both the righteous and the unrighteous dead, as recounted in Ecclesiastes and Job, and also is shown by the many scriptures showing man returning to dust.

Genesis 3:19
In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. upward, and the spirit of the animal, which goes down to the earth?"

Psalm 104:29
Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.

Ecclesiastes 12:7
Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
They are dead, in the grave, sleeping the unconscious state of the dead, knowing nothing.

Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Similarly Psalms 146:2-4 (NKJV) states: "Do not put your trust in princes, Nor in a son of man, in whom there is no help. His spirit departs, he returns to his earth; In that very day his plans perish."

In the book of Job it is stated: "But man dies and is laid away; indeed he breathes his last and where is he?... So man lies down and does not rise. Till the heavens are no more, they will not awake nor be roused from their sleep... If a man dies, shall he live again?" (Job 14:10,12,14a NKJV)

Now Christ himself tells us that dead will be raised, but it will be at the judgment at the end of the world, and there is the resurrection of the just, but the wicked will also be brought up after that to face their judgment at the lake of fire.

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139436
02/04/12 02:07 AM
02/04/12 02:07 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
Now the Jews did not teach of a place with a concept of ‘Hell’ as a place where Satan was in charge with demons running around with pitchforks. After the translation from Hebrew to Greek, it got seen as the Greek place of mythology of eternal torment with demons in charger where sinners were punished forever, so you can see how todays idea of Hell evolved.

So lets look at what seems to come nearest to this concept which is “Hades.” This Greek word is also translated “Hell” in many English Bibles, such as the King James Version. In Revelation 6:8, the King James Version refers to “Death, and Hell [Hades].” It does this same in Revelation 20:14. Yet some English Bibles leave the word “Hades” itself, such as the New International Version, which translates Revelation 6:8 and 20:14 as “Death, and Hades.” Now here’s a key point: in Revelation 20:14 “Hades”(“Hell”) is eventually “cast into the lake of fire.” Thus “Hades” itself is not a fiery place, but is cast into “the lake of fire.”

Here is Revelation 20:14 in both the KJV and NIV:
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire”(Revelation 20:14, King James Version)

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:14, New International Version)

In King James Version, there is a marginal reference beside the word “Hell”(Hades) listed in Revelation 20:13 and 14. It says “Hell” literally means “the grave.” Thus Revelation 20:14 could properly be translated,“death and the grave were cast into the lake of fire.” This makes sense.

To make it simple,“Hades” literally means “the grave.” This is easy to prove from 1 Corinthians 15:55, which in the King James Version states,
O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?(1 Corinthians 15:55)

If you look in any Strong’s Concordance, you’ll discover that the original Greek word here translated “grave” is “Hades.” By looking at the context, it’s obvious that “Hades” means “the grave” because it is God’s saints who rise out of “Hades” when Jesus Christ returns. See for yourself:
Behold, I shew you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up on victory. O death, where is your sting? O grave [Hades] where is your victory? (1 Corinthians 15:51-55, King James Version,)
“O grave [Hades] where is your victory?” the redeemed triumphantly shout. Thus “Hades” here cannot mean a place of burning, for who can imagine God’s people writhing in flames as they await the resurrection?
Additional proof that “Hades” means “the grave” is the fact that “Hades” was the place Jesus Christ’s body rested in immediately after His death. In Acts 2:31, the King James Version declares,
His [or Christ’s] soul was not left in hell [or Hades] neither his flesh did see corruption (Acts 2:31,KJV ).

The New International Version translates Acts 2:31 as,
"He was not abandoned to the grave, nor did his body see decay "(Acts 2:31, NIV)

Thus Christ’s “body”(NIV) or “flesh”(KJV) was not allowed to see “corruption”(KJV) or “decay”(NIV) because it remained in the grave only a short time before He rose.

So the meaning of the three Greek words translated “Hell” in our English Bibles:
“Tartarus” means “a place of darkness or restraint”(2 Peter 2:4). Satan abides there now.

“Hades” means “the grave”(Acts 2:31; 1 Corinthians 15:55; Revelation 20:14). Jesus Christ’s body rested there, and His saints rest there now awaiting the resurrection.

“Gehenna” means a place of fire, brimstone, and punishment (Matthew 5:22, 29, 30, also Matthew 13:40-42, 2 Peter 3:7, 10-12). These flames are yet future, at the end of the world.

In its description of this final fire, and the doom of the wicked or lost, the Bible declares:
Whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:15).

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139437
02/04/12 02:15 AM
02/04/12 02:15 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
Now the bad part is that the idea of the Greek concept of Hell was then combined with other pagan myths of immortality of the soul, and we got even more pagan beliefs corrupting the church such as Purgatory and Limbo.

Purgatory as a doctrine teaches that a Christian's soul must burn in purgatory after death until all of their sins have been purged. To speed up the purging process, money could be paid to a priest so he could pray and have special masses for an earlier release, and much money was made with this doctrine. Purgatory is given as a way that no matter how sinful or unbelieving, when you die, you go to Purgatory and get things sorted out and finally get to heaven, so no acceptance of Christ is needed, you can buy your way in. But is it in the Bible, if you look it doesn’t show, so where did it come from. It comes as no surprise to see it is a corrupt pagan doctrine, which was allowed into the church.

This pagan idea began creeping into the church around the end of the sixth century, and it has no scriptural support. In fact, Jesus warned us about this pagan practice in Matthew 23:14 when He spoke of those who devoured widows houses and made long prayers for a pretence. Psalm 49:6-7 tells us that a person couldn't redeem a loved one, even if such a place did exist: "They that trust in their wealth, and boast themselves in the multitude of their riches; None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:"
Peter addresses this issue in Acts 8:20 when he says, "Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money." God's word is clearly against the doctrine of purgatory.

The Greeks, as in some measure the Egyptians before them, created myths of the afterlife which spread throughout the Hellenistic world, and even into words which were used when the Hebrew text was translated into the Greek. Scripture clearly rejects the Greek notion of the immortality of the soul disembodied from the here and now as spirit beings, and early Christians affirmed the resurrection of the body just as Lazuras was resurrected by Christ. So there is no place for a underworld depicted in Greek myths or place of cleansing by fire such as purgotary where spirit beings are left till they are ready to be reunited with God, it comes from other origins which we shall see.

Purgatory as a transitional condition has from many sources, a origin from the pagan belief of caring for the dead and praying for them, and to the belief that prayer for the dead contributed to their afterlife purification. Pagan tradition created this place of purgatory which leaves hope after death for the wicked, who, at the time of their death, are unrepentant and cling to their love of sin.

In Egypt, substantially the same doctrine of purgatory was taught as in modern times and its priests created grand funerals and masses for the dead, along with celebration of prayer and other services for the soul of the dead. The priest who officiated at the burial service was selected from the grade of Pontiffs who wore the leopard skin; but various other rites were performed by one of the minor priests to the mummies, previous to their being lowered into the pit of the tomb after that ceremony. They practiced elaborate ceremonies to prepare the pharaohs for their next life, constructing massive pyramids and other elaborate tombs filled with luxuries the deceased were supposed to need in the hereafter. The famous Book of the Dead, a collection of ancient Egyptian funerary and ritual texts, describes in great detail how to meet the challenges of the afterlife. The pagan Egyptian belief was when the body died, parts of its soul known as ka (body double) and the ba (personality) would go to the Kingdom of the Dead. While the soul dwelt in the Fields of Aaru, Osiris demanded work as restitution for the protection he provided. Statues were placed in the tombs to serve as substitutes for the deceased.

The Egyptian belief in the immortality of the soul existed centuries before Judaism, Hellenism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, and Islam. According to Herodotus, eventually the Greeks adopted from the Egyptians the belief in the immortality of the soul. He wrote: “The Egyptians also were the first who asserted the doctrine that the soul of man is immortal . . . This opinion, some among the Greeks have at different periods of time adopted as their own.” The Greek philosopher Socrates (470-399 B. C.) traveled to Egypt to consult the Egyptians on their teachings on the immortality of the soul.Upon his return to Greece, he imparted this teaching to his most famous pupil, Plato.......

In Greece the doctrine of a purgatory was spread through the Greek mystery religions and even was spoken by one of its major philosophers. Plato, speaking of the future judgment of the dead, holds out the hope of final deliverance for all, but maintains that, of "those who are judged," some must first "proceed to a subterranean place of judgment, where they shall sustain the punishment they have deserved." The ancient Greeks sacrificed on the thirteenth day (after death) to Mercury as the conductor of the dead, they also had sacrifice which, according to Plato, "was offered for the living and the dead, and was supposed to free them from all the evils to which the wicked are liable when they have left this world.

In ancient Rome, the pagan priests also picked up and spread purgatory to the pagans, but as a belief in the early church it was not immediately picked up. From earliest times Greek religious beliefs were a strong influence in Italy, and the Graeco-Roman world was essentially one in its religious and philosophic views of the afterlife.There was no mention of the doctrine during the first two centuries of the church, it has no basis in scripture, the apostles did not teach it, nor did Christ.

In all pagan religions you will find a similar description of a place after death where everyone can be absolved of their sin, not in any way connected to what the Bible says. In the pagan purgatory, fire, water, wind, were represented as combining to purge away the stain of sin, and has its roots in the Babylonian belief of Tammuz or Zoroaster, the great God of the ancient fire-worshippers. The doctrine of purgatory is purely pagan, and in no way from scripture as those who die in Christ no purgatory is or can be needed as it teaches that Christs blood cleanseth true believers from all sin, not purgatory. Scripture does not tell us of at death being put through altered spiritual states of immortality till we are cleansed by purgatory fires and then go to eternal life or heaven, but clearly teaches that immortality is not an innate human possession, but a conditional gift of eternal life given to believers at the resurrection.

Now some people point to Jesus' enunciation of the unpardonable sin as proof for Purgatory. Let us quickly review this Scripture.
"And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come." [Matthew 12:32] This reference to two worlds is held to be proof of Purgatory in the Bible, but that has nothing about purgartory. The expression "either in this world or in the world to come" does not imply that some sins are forgiven after death; however, it is a strong way of stating the truth that the unrepentant sinner will never be forgiven, as we see from the parallel passages of this Scripture (Luke 12:10, especially Mark 3:29)..

The doctrine of Purgatory is not only without Biblical proof, but it is against the clear and consistent teaching of Scripture. the Bible nowhere speaks of a temporary place of punishment after death for believers; however, it does clearly state that when the believer dies, he rests in the grave and becomes dust, a place that no living loved one can effect in any way.
"Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours ..." [Revelation 14:13]

Others point to Matthew 5:25-26 as the basis for Purgatory. Let us review that Scripture:
"Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison. Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, until thou hast paid the uttermost farthing." Matthew 5:25-26. This "prison" thus implied in this Scripture is supposed to be Purgatory. The implication in this Scripture is also that, eventually, the prisoner will pay his final bill and be set free. This implication is held to be consistent with the teaching of Purgatory, that it is not eternal, and eventually, everyone will get out of it, and go on to Heaven, perfectly purified. But it was a literal prison the verse refers to not purgatory by any stretch of the imagination, or whatever the pagan mystery religions tried to come up with.

In fact, neither the word nor the concept of sin-purifying fire is found in Scripture or worse paying to cleanse a dead person of sin as a way to heaven. Scripture leaves absolutely no possibility for sin to be purged away by anything other than the blood of Jesus Christ. The apostle John wrote with irrefutable clarity, "The blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin" and "all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:7, 9). John did not say "some" sins or "most" sins, but all sin. The Roman church was confronted with this in the 16th century when the Reformers protested its practice of buying and selling of God's grace through indulgences. Backed into a corner, the Council of Trent tried to tie it to the apocryphal books not part of the canon of Scripture. These were a collection of uninspired books by writers influenced by the Greek belief in the immortality of the soul, prayer for the dead, and denial of the resurrection, who put these teachings what in what was known as the Apocrypha. The council ignored the fact that the Jewish scribes never recognized the apocryphal books as inspired or part of the Hebrew Scriptures and it was rejected outright in 90 A.D. at the Council of Jamnia (Jabneh). Clearly they saw the danger as it was obviously pagan myths and beliefs mixed into these apocryphal books and they clearly saw that God did not inspire the writers of the Apocrypha. This is why the Apocrypha was never included in the original canon of 66 books.

Re: Hell and Hades, the origins and does the Bible teach them.... [Re: Rick H] #139438
02/04/12 02:17 AM
02/04/12 02:17 AM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
2500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,806
Florida, USA
Now lets look at the doctrine or belief of ‘Limbo’ which now the Catholic church is saying it never accepted, but still incorporated the theory in its ordinary beliefs. The term ‘Limbo’ was picked up as the part of the underworld (Hades) where the patriarchs of the Old Testament were believed to be kept until Christ's soul descended into it by his death. The Catechism of the Catholic Church describes Christ's descent into "hell" as meaning primarily that "the crucified one sojourned in the realm of the dead prior to his resurrection. This was the first meaning given for Christ experiencing death for the wages of sin, in the Catholic veiw it was Christ's descent into hell: that Jesus, like all men, experienced death and in his soul joined the others in the realm of the dead. It also was applied later, to the The ‘Limbo of Infants’ (Latin limbus infantium or limbus puerorum) is a hypothesis about the permanent status of the unbaptized who die in infancy, too young to have committed personal sins, but not having been freed from what Catholics hold as original sin. Since at least the time of Augustine, those consider sprinkling of infants or baby baptism to be necessary for the salvation of those to whom it can be administered, have debated the fate of unbaptized innocents, and the theory of the ‘Limbo of Infants’ is one of the ideas as a proposed solution. Again both are not scriptural as the term ‘Limbo’ is not refered to and does not appear in the Bible, just more Greek myths of pagan influence and mans tradition or ideas being picked up and mixed in. It is interesting to note that ‘Limbo’ is not an official doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church or any other, they will tell you they never sanctioned it, but every good Catholic knows it was taught.


Moderator  dedication, Rick H 

Sabbath School Lesson Study Material Link
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
Most Recent Posts From Selected Public Forums
Why Bible Believers Should Oppose Vaccines
by dedication. 01/31/23 06:11 PM
Seven Trumpets reconsidered
by dedication. 01/31/23 03:32 AM
Secondary or Dual fulfillment of Prophecy
by Kevin H. 01/30/23 08:17 PM
The King of the North
by dedication. 01/30/23 05:44 PM
1st Quarter 2023 Managing for the Master
by dedication. 01/30/23 12:49 PM
Characteristics of true revival and reformation
by dedication. 01/27/23 07:38 PM
Angels with an URGENT MESSAGE
by dedication. 01/27/23 12:00 AM
Where Do You Obtain Health Supplements?
by dedication. 01/26/23 04:33 AM
What is spiritual blindness?
by dedication. 01/22/23 04:13 PM
Who are the twenty four elders of Revelation?
by Kevin H. 01/20/23 10:52 PM
Who is the beast of Rev. 11:7 ?
by dedication. 01/13/23 04:57 AM
Hurricane Fiona in Eastern Canada
by dedication. 01/02/23 08:23 PM
4th Quarter 2022 Future Hope
by Daryl. 01/02/23 10:00 AM
Most Recent Posts From Selected Private Forums of MSDAOL
The Fifth Column in the church.
by ProdigalOne. 01/31/23 01:33 PM
While You Were Asleep
by ProdigalOne. 01/25/23 05:12 AM
A campaign against the church
by dedication. 01/24/23 04:59 PM
Pope Francis Is in Control
by Wendell Slattery. 01/07/23 04:25 AM
Forum Announcements
Visitors by Country Since February 11, 2013
Flag Counter
Google Maritime SDA OnLine Public Forums Site Search & Google Translation Service
Google
 
Web www.maritime-sda-online.com

Copyright 2000-Present
Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine).

LEGAL NOTICE:
The views expressed in this forum are those of individuals
and do not necessarily represent those of Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine,
as well as the Seventh-day Adventist Church
from the local church level to the General Conference level.

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine) is also a self-supporting ministry
and is not part of, or affiliated with, or endorsed by
The General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists headquartered in Silver Spring, Maryland
or any of its subsidiaries.

"And He saith unto them, follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men." Matt. 4:19
MARITIME 2ND ADVENT BELIEVERS ONLINE (FORMERLY MARITIME SDA ONLINE) CONSISTING MAINLY OF BOTH MEMBERS & FRIENDS
OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH,
INVITES OTHER MEMBERS & FRIENDS OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD WHO WISHES TO JOIN US!
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1