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Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age #171164
01/08/15 06:50 AM
01/08/15 06:50 AM
dedication  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: Godsloveandlaw

But as soon as the water, in fulfillment of Noah's prediction, began to come down, -- in fact, even before it had any chance to descend to the lower places of the earth, -- this natural thermostatic system was quickly broken down, and the rain, as it fell on the earth, froze so suddenly in the polar regions that the animals while yet alive froze with it: they evidently had not time even to swallow their food, as is actually established by various archeological exhumations.
Sounds like you are saying the polar regions did not experience the flood.


It could have happened that way if the flood was caused by a sudden tilting of earth's axis. I think most of the frozen mammoths are in the far reaches of the northern hemisphere.
Prior to the flood, the earth's axis were straight and the water laden atmosphere kept the temperature pretty uniform all over the earth. But when the earth made it's sudden axis shift, the northern regions must have suddenly been in "winter" position (no sun) facilitating the quick freeze, as the atmospheric water all came crashing down.

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: Daryl] #171169
01/08/15 01:48 PM
01/08/15 01:48 PM
K
kland  Offline
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Are you saying that the flood did not cover the entire earth?

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: Daryl] #171185
01/09/15 03:58 AM
01/09/15 03:58 AM
dedication  Offline OP
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Are you asking me?

The Bible says the flood covered the entire earth -- and yes that includes the northern regions.
But I don't think the ice caps were there prior to the flood.

Water forms ice, if it freezes quickly anything in the water would also freeze as well would it not?
Would they have been frozen as they were engulfed by icy, muddy water?

Those things I really don't know, but it is interesting to wonder about it,

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: Daryl] #171193
01/09/15 03:48 PM
01/09/15 03:48 PM
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kland  Offline
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I think the animals being talked about with food in their mouths was not in frozen ice, but frozen snow. Not one big ice cube chunk.

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: Daryl] #171206
01/10/15 02:52 AM
01/10/15 02:52 AM
dedication  Offline OP
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That's why I asked "are you asking me"? I have no idea if GLL thinks the flood covered the whole earth or not.

However, scripture says it did -- so I believe it did.

And no -- not one big ice cube -- remember it "rained" down water. In this possible scenario, the earth tips on it's axis from an upright position, to it's present position, causing the flood waters to rain down from above, as well as gush up in various places from beneath. As the earth tipped on its axis the north would have experience instant winter. In the north, the rising water would have mixed with dirt, the mammoths, seeking higher ground, sank in the gooey cold mass and everything froze.
That's seems reasonable when I look at the pictures and descriptions of these mammoths being found in ICE that is full of dirt. And they remained frozen for 4000 years.


Remember they have been found with buttercups in their stomachs-- that doesn't sound like they were in snow.

But then maybe the ice age descended very quickly after the flood -- I don't think anyone knows for sure just how so many ended up being covered with dirty ice so fast that they froze and then remained frozen for thousands of years.



But how did we get on Mammoth elephants in a thread about JW's?????



Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: dedication] #171241
01/10/15 09:51 PM
01/10/15 09:51 PM
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Wendell Slattery  Offline
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I don't know how you ended up with mammoths in the JW topic, but let me add my 2 cents worth on the mammoths. I recall reading somewhere that they have even found food in the mouths of the mammoths. Clearly, they froze almost instantly. According to the same article where I read that, they said it has been calculated that the temperature had to have dropped 160 degrees Farenheit in just one second for that to happen. Nothing like that is known in the world today (fortunately) or we would be in very serious trouble!

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: Wendell Slattery] #171248
01/11/15 12:09 AM
01/11/15 12:09 AM
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Godsloveandlaw  Offline
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This subject evolved from brother Daryl's question--
"What was the Earth orbiting around prior to the creation of the Sun and the Moon?"

Brother Houteff explained as we already posted. Frankly it's pretty deep and I would like to some day study this more but for now I'll stick to more of what I know,lol.

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: dedication] #171285
01/12/15 04:03 PM
01/12/15 04:03 PM
K
kland  Offline
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Originally Posted By: dedication
As the earth tipped on its axis the north would have experience instant winter. In the north, the rising water would have mixed with dirt, the mammoths, seeking higher ground, sank in the gooey cold mass and everything froze.
How would the specific heat of water enter this idea?

Quote:
That's seems reasonable when I look at the pictures and descriptions of these mammoths being found in ICE that is full of dirt. And they remained frozen for 4000 years.


Remember they have been found with buttercups in their stomachs-- that doesn't sound like they were in snow.
Why would snow preclude buttercups in their mouths/stomachs?

Quote:
But then maybe the ice age descended very quickly after the flood -- I don't think anyone knows for sure just how so many ended up being covered with dirty ice so fast that they froze and then remained frozen for thousands of years.
I didn't realize I was suggesting something different here. But I guess it's based upon whether one thinks the flood preserved the mammoths or whether it was from the ice age afterward. I tend towards the ice age. I am of the opinion that the flood totally changed the topography of the planet. Mammoths in ice just couldn't be possible which is what I took GLL as suggesting.

I tried looking up mammoths, and I think it depends on which mammoth we are talking about. Some were found in snow, some in ice, some in crevasses some buried in mud.
Here's some interesting links:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fresh-mammoth-carcass-from-siberia-holds-many-secrets/
http://www.foxnews.com/science/2013/05/2...scientists-say/
http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/FrozenMammoths6.html
One theory in the last link suggested mud mixed with ice protected them from the flood.

An evolution site said some buttercups are native to the tundra. They didn't say it was the same species found in the mammoth's mouths, though. Grass and leaves were also found in their mouths, so I think the evolution site has some issues.


Quote:
But how did we get on Mammoth elephants in a thread about JW's?????
Why Mammoths? I think you brought them up, right? wink


An interesting thought about the earth tilting. Why couldn't it be tilted all the time? Wouldn't the upper water canopy equalize the temperatures? What would a flood tilting of the earth mean to the moon people?

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: dedication] #171343
01/15/15 04:23 AM
01/15/15 04:23 AM
dedication  Offline OP
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And so, now we have a thread where we can talk about Mammoths to hearts content -- if that's what we wish to do?

Re: Mammoths, Flood and Ice Age [Re: kland] #171344
01/15/15 05:44 AM
01/15/15 05:44 AM
dedication  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: dedication
As the earth tipped on its axis the north would have experience instant winter. In the north, the rising water would have mixed with dirt, the mammoths, seeking higher ground, sank in the gooey cold mass and everything froze.
How would the specific heat of water enter this idea?


Kland you have much more of a scientific mind than I have, so not sure how to answer that question.

But I would suppose it depended on where the water was coming from?
Of course if it were swirling in from the equator regions the water temperature would over ride the sudden drop in air temperature.
But since this probably happened near the beginning of the 40 days and nights, there wouldn't have been water swirling in from the equator regions -- there would be only a lot of half frozen rain pouring down?
And also different areas would have had different conditions.


Originally Posted By: Kland
Originally Posted By: Dedication
Remember they have been found with buttercups in their stomachs-- that doesn't sound like they were in snow.
Why would snow preclude buttercups in their mouths/stomachs?


I guess I assumed it would because where I live, there is snow and freezing cold temperatures and NO buttercups anywhere. Buttercups are rather delicate and decay rather quickly when things start getting cold.
Somehow my idea of a fast coming ice age, is still not instantly. The cold would have killed the vegetation and ice covered the ground sometime before the mammoths would have succumbed to it's deadly chill.

[quote] I am of the opinion that the flood totally changed the topography of the planet.[quote]

I would agree, yet some areas seem to have been changed far more than other areas depending on the breaking apart of the earth's crust and mountains being forced up, while other areas didn't break up and no mountains were created.

(My unscientific thoughts)

Though I do find the subject interesting -- often wonder just what it was like back then.

Originally Posted By: Kland
An interesting thought about the earth tilting. Why couldn't it be tilted all the time? Wouldn't the upper water canopy equalize the temperatures? What would a flood tilting of the earth mean to the moon people?


Moon people???? ROFL
Did the gravity shift between moon and earth depopulated the moon???

OK -- You probably had something quite different in mind.

I'm not sure how a sudden tilt of the earth would have affected the moon. A lot of theories out there -- even one where they said the moon was once closer to the earth, crashed into the earth then bounced off to its present location, and all this tilt and moon crashing was caused by an unknown planet that came circling rather close to earth. But all that is theory --

The earths tilt is not only associated with the seasons, but also with the variable length of day and night. Would day and night have been more regular in an "untilted" earth?


Even the "water canopy" is not really understood. Would it have hidden the stars from view? --

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