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Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: kland] #188604
02/27/19 11:44 AM
02/27/19 11:44 AM
His child  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Originally Posted By: kland
"Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!"

James and Nadi,

Was Jonah a false prophet? Jonah thought so. He thought it better to die rather than live and be called a false prophet. How did God respond?

Jonah 4:11 "And should I not pity Nineveh, that great city, in which are more than one hundred and twenty thousand persons who cannot discern between their right hand and their left-and much livestock?"


Jonah knew that he was not a false prophet. His message was God given, but he was bias against Nineveh. They deserved the wrath of God that God had sent Jonah to predict. Mercy had not been in Jonah's message.


"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: James Peterson] #188608
02/27/19 03:45 PM
02/27/19 03:45 PM
K
kland  Offline
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Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,425
Midland
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Originally Posted By: kland
"Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!"

James and Nadi,

Was Jonah a false prophet? Jonah thought so. He thought it better to die rather than live and be called a false prophet. How did God respond?

Jonah 4:11 "And should I not pity Nineveh, that great city, in which are more than one hundred and twenty thousand persons who cannot discern between their right hand and their left-and much livestock?"

Jonah was prophesying of something that was based on a condition. The people repented, and God had mercy. Whereas, Revelation deals with the definitive end of all things. God's anger is poured out unmixed in seven last plagues.
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?

Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: kland] #188609
02/27/19 05:18 PM
02/27/19 05:18 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: kland
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?

What evidence do you propose? Here is mine in refutation:

  • THREE TIMES, Jesus said that He was coming soon.
     
    1. Rev. 22:7, Behold, I am coming quickly! Blessed is he who keeps the words of the prophecy of this book.
    2. Rev. 22:12, And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work.
    3. Rev. 22:20, He who testifies to these things says, Surely I am coming quickly.
     
  • THOSE THREE TIMES were prefaced by the direct statement of John: Rev. 22:6, "The Lord God of the holy prophets sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place."

    That is one bookend. The other is at the beginning: Rev. 1:3, "Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near."
     
  • Once it is written, so be it. Twice repeated, it is sure. Thrice -- it shall be surely done! The thing is known. BUT FIVE TIMES?!!!!! What then?
     
  • "SOON", THEREFORE, IN THE CONTEXT OF REVELATION DOES NOT MEAN LIKE LIGHTNING OR A POSSIBILITY.
    Rather, it signifies just a little time until ..., not long before ..., nearly there ... for certain! 70AD


///

Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: kland] #188610
02/27/19 08:34 PM
02/27/19 08:34 PM
N
Nadi  Offline
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Active Member 2020
Full Member
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 288
Canada
Originally Posted By: kland
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?
IMO, people have nothing to do with the timing of the end.

1. As per Jesus' words, that day is known only to the Father.
2. Everything happens at its appointed time.
3. Therefore humans have nothing to do with it.


"Our vision is often more obstructed by what we think we know than by our lack of knowledge." K. Stendahl
Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: James Peterson] #188611
02/27/19 08:46 PM
02/27/19 08:46 PM
N
Nadi  Offline
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Active Member 2020
Full Member
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 288
Canada
While I agree that "soon" in Revelation indicates the nearness of the event rather than the speed, I disagree that the event referenced is the destruction of the temple in 70CE rather than the second coming. Jesus repeatedly stated "Behold, I come quickly." so the event referenced is his coming. I know of no evidence that Jesus returned in 70CE; certainly not in the manner described in Acts and other parts of the NT.


"Our vision is often more obstructed by what we think we know than by our lack of knowledge." K. Stendahl
Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: Nadi] #188612
02/28/19 12:00 AM
02/28/19 12:00 AM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: Nadi
While I agree that "soon" in Revelation indicates the nearness of the event rather than the speed, I disagree that the event referenced is the destruction of the temple in 70CE rather than the second coming. Jesus repeatedly stated "Behold, I come quickly." so the event referenced is his coming. I know of no evidence that Jesus returned in 70CE; certainly not in the manner described in Acts and other parts of the NT.

You would disagree because you are unfamiliar with apocalyptic language. God coming in judgment does NOT mean the end of the world, but the end of the world for those against whom He comes. Think of it like suicide. Why do people take their own lives? Their testimony before is one of terrible distress, a feeling of hopelessness, emptiness, utter loneliness, the end of all things for them.

Jesus described it this way:

"And a great multitude of the people followed Him, and women who also mourned and lamented Him. But Jesus, turning to them, said, "Daughters of Jerusalem, do not weep for Me, but weep for yourselves and for your children. For indeed the days are coming in which they will say, 'Blessed are the barren, wombs that never bore, and breasts which never nursed!' Then they will begin to say to the mountains, 'Fall on us!' and to the hills, 'Cover us!' For if they do these things in the green wood, what will be done in the dry?” Luke 23:27-31

I can show a great many other examples of such language in the Old Testament; but one will suffice. This is Jude speaking about the end of Sodom and Gomorrah, "... having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire." v.7

Who came to Canaan in THE LAST DAYS of those two cities?

///

Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: James Peterson] #188614
02/28/19 05:01 AM
02/28/19 05:01 AM
T
The Wanderer  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2022

Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 545
Central Alberta
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Originally Posted By: kland
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?

What evidence do you propose? Here is mine in refutation:

  • THREE TIMES, Jesus said that He was coming soon.
     
    1. Rev. 22:7, Behold, I am coming quickly! Blessed is he who keeps the words of the prophecy of this book.
    2. Rev. 22:12, And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work.
    3. Rev. 22:20, He who testifies to these things says, Surely I am coming quickly.
     
  • THOSE THREE TIMES were prefaced by the direct statement of John: Rev. 22:6, "The Lord God of the holy prophets sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place."

    That is one bookend. The other is at the beginning: Rev. 1:3, "Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near."
     
  • Once it is written, so be it. Twice repeated, it is sure. Thrice -- it shall be surely done! The thing is known. BUT FIVE TIMES?!!!!! What then?
     
  • "SOON", THEREFORE, IN THE CONTEXT OF REVELATION DOES NOT MEAN LIKE LIGHTNING OR A POSSIBILITY.
    Rather, it signifies just a little time until ..., not long before ..., nearly there ... for certain! 70AD


///
Good points from scripture! I would still question what they actually and literally mean. There is a quote that comes to mind: "the final movements will be rapid ones," (9T 11), and I think thats a point well-taken because of some of the very texts you have mentioned. Additionally, I would add this:
Quote:
For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.(Mat 24:27)
How fast is lightning? Well The return stroke (the current that causes the visible flash) moves upward at a speed of about 320,000,000 ft per second or about 220,000,000 miles per hour.


"The worst foes of my spiritual life have never been hostile circumstance."

"There is always a little bit of light" (Micah 7:8)
https://www.lightintheclouds.net/word

Sincerely, IN Christ; and THROUGH The Spirit


- The Wanderer
Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: The Wanderer] #188618
03/01/19 12:03 AM
03/01/19 12:03 AM
J
James Peterson  Offline
NON-SDA
Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: The Wanderer
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Originally Posted By: kland
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?

What evidence do you propose? Here is mine in refutation:

  • THREE TIMES, Jesus said that He was coming soon.
     
    1. Rev. 22:7, Behold, I am coming quickly! Blessed is he who keeps the words of the prophecy of this book.
    2. Rev. 22:12, And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work.
    3. Rev. 22:20, He who testifies to these things says, Surely I am coming quickly.
     
  • THOSE THREE TIMES were prefaced by the direct statement of John: Rev. 22:6, "The Lord God of the holy prophets sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place."

    That is one bookend. The other is at the beginning: Rev. 1:3, "Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near."
     
  • Once it is written, so be it. Twice repeated, it is sure. Thrice -- it shall be surely done! The thing is known. BUT FIVE TIMES?!!!!! What then?
     
  • "SOON", THEREFORE, IN THE CONTEXT OF REVELATION DOES NOT MEAN LIKE LIGHTNING OR A POSSIBILITY.
    Rather, it signifies just a little time until ..., not long before ..., nearly there ... for certain! 70AD


///
Good points from scripture! I would still question what they actually and literally mean. There is a quote that comes to mind: "the final movements will be rapid ones," (9T 11), and I think thats a point well-taken because of some of the very texts you have mentioned. Additionally, I would add this:
Quote:
For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.(Mat 24:27)
How fast is lightning? Well The return stroke (the current that causes the visible flash) moves upward at a speed of about 320,000,000 ft per second or about 220,000,000 miles per hour.

You're like the elephant that, unable to discern the priceless value of the delicate exhibit, tramples wildly through the china shop only to blow its own trumpet. If John THE PROPHET OF GOD says twice that the Revelation was near and shortly to be fulfilled in his day (and John DOES -- Rev. 1:3, 22:6), what relevance is your own talk about rapidity and speed?

"SOON", THEREFORE, IN THE CONTEXT OF REVELATION DOES NOT MEAN LIKE LIGHTNING OR A POSSIBILITY. Rather, it signifies just a little while until ..., not long before ..., nearly there ... for certain! 70AD

///

Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: James Peterson] #188626
03/01/19 03:59 PM
03/01/19 03:59 PM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,425
Midland
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Originally Posted By: kland
The point being, you don't think the timing of the end is not conditional upon people?

What evidence do you propose? Here is mine in refutation:

  • THREE TIMES, Jesus said that He was coming soon.
     
  • 1. Jon 1:2 "Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and cry out against it; for their wickedness has come up before Me."
  • 2. Jon 3:2 "Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and preach to it the message that I tell you."
  • 3. Jon 3:3 So Jonah arose and went to Nineveh, according to the word of the LORD. Now Nineveh was an exceedingly great city, a three-day journey in extent.
    4 And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day's walk. Then he cried out and said, "Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!"
  • and a three day journey crying out every day would include 2 more times!

    A prophecy.
    Not fulfilled when given.
    But fulfilled later.
    When they turned from their repentance.
    And mercy was no more.

  • Re: M-103 beginning of the end of free speech in Canada [Re: dedication] #188634
    03/02/19 07:49 AM
    03/02/19 07:49 AM
    His child  Offline
    SDA
    Active Member 2020
    Very Dedicated Member
    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posts: 1,673
    TN, USA
    FOOD FOR THOUGHT

    Yesterday morning before I went into the ministers' meeting my soul was greatly distressed. I can not tell you how hard the pressure was. It seemed to amount to an agony, and in the night season it was an agony. I did not know what to expect, or how long this thing was going to persevere. I stood before our people after I came from Minneapolis in the church. I told them what God had presented to me. I stood before them in this room, when the Committee was here. I told them that every one of them that laid that hardness into their hearts when they were at Minneapolis, and that pursued the course they did, they never would see a ray of light till they confessed it. It has not had any influence on Brother Smith, but he stood just as strong to push back. I have had to stand all the time to push, and when I have felt that I could not do it, then the words have come, "I am back of you to push with you." And the light that came to me night before last laid it all open again before me, just the influence that was at work, and just where it would lead. I want to tell you, brethren, whoever you are, I want to tell you, that you are just going over the very same ground that they went over in the days of Christ. You have had their experience; But God deliver us from having the come-out of it as they had. But notwithstanding you have heard my testimony, notwithstanding it was the testimony of the Spirit of God, you have braced yourselves,--a few of you, strong men of determined will,--to carry it out on your line, to fight it out on your line. May God have mercy upon your souls, because you need it. You have stood right in the way of God. The earth is to be lighted with his glory, and if you stand where you stand today, you might just as quick say that the Spirit of God was the spirit of the devil. You have said it now in your actions, in your attitudes, that it is the spirit of the devil. You have said it thus, and you will say it when the crisis will come. And while praying here on my knees, I have had the evidence that there would be a break. The Spirit of God has come upon me, the light of heaven has shown into my heart, and his comforting grace is upon me. My mind is just as clear as a sunbeam; I rejoice in God my Saviour today. I thank God that I have not been discouraged to death; I thank God that I have clung to the arm of infinite power to stand all but alone. The ones that ought to have stood with me, that God would have to stand with me to receive the blessings, have stood to hedge up my way in every step. I want to tell you, brethren, there are debaters among us. I warned them in Minneapolis never to put a minister in a Conference by the side of a debater. For the last twenty years the light has shown upon me in regard to debaters. They will turn light into darkness. That is just what Brother Matthew Larson will do. He has an education, but unless the Holy Ghost shall come upon him, he will never go through with this cause to its close. What is the matter? I am afraid of Brother Larson; I am afraid of Brother Larson. I will not converse with you unless you are with other men. You will take my words. You will put a false interpretation upon them, and you will make them mean this or that other than they shall. And those that stand criticizing, let me tell you, you are walking in the sparks of your own kindling, and you are right down in darkness. It is the word of God. God presented the case before me. I told it to Brother Morrison when we were in Des Moines. Said I: "If you don't come out as Elder Canright, it is because you will be a converted man; but every soul that is connected with you that you have educated and trained as a debater, you will wish that work was undone." Brethren, we are not here for this work. We are not here to study infidel authors, to open our minds to the suggestions of the devil. We are here to get ready for the judgment, and we are right on the borders of the eternal world. Here are many that are to go forth to their fields of labor to strengthen the things that are ready to die, or to be powers of darkness. Now what are you going to do in this matter? {1888 593.1}


    "Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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