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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12442
03/08/05 02:02 AM
03/08/05 02:02 AM
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Then doesn't God in a sense destroy the unrepentant sinner in the same way God in a sense hardened Pharoah's heart and in the same sense Pharoah hardened his own heart?
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12443
03/08/05 02:18 AM
03/08/05 02:18 AM
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New Member (Starting to Post)
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 5
Tennessee
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I guess I have little and big holes all burned into me by the consuming fire of God! Quite amazing it is that I am even able to talk to Him or listen to Him anymore!
I am glad that Heaven cares more for me then it does for my sin! When I feel the presence of the Spirit I KNOW the sin will be taken care of in its time!
That is all I need!
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12444
03/08/05 03:34 AM
03/08/05 03:34 AM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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quote:
Then doesn't God in a sense destroy the unrepentant sinner in the same way God in a sense hardened Pharoah's heart and in the same sense Pharoah hardened his own heart?
Yes, I think so. The same sun which bakes the clay melts the ice. God is who He is, which is self-sacrificing love. That love melts the hearts of those who choose to respond to it, but is a consuming fire to those who rebel against it.
Here's a couple of analogies. God's love can be compared to radiation treatments against the cancer of sin. Taken in small doses, it cures. Taken all at once, it's too much. Many times the Spirit of Prophesy tells us of how God shrouded His glory so as not to destroy human beings. At the final judgement, God's glory will not be shrouded. It will be too much.
Here's one example:
quote:
Had He appeared with the glory that was His with the Father before the world was, we could not have endured the light of His presence. That we might behold it and not be destroyed, the manifestation of His glory was shrouded. His divinity was veiled with humanity,--the invisible glory in the visible human form. (DA 23)
Another analogy is looking at the sun glaring off snow in the winter -- it's so bright it can blind you.
A third analogy is from the Chronicals or Narnia. Aslan, who is a lion (representing Christ) is asked by children accompanying him why he doesn't help a bitter old man who has secluded himself in a cabin. Aslan replies that there's nothing he can do -- not matter what he says, all the old man hears is a lion roaring.
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12445
03/08/05 11:01 AM
03/08/05 11:01 AM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Tom,
I think you are missing my point. Still using your analogy with cancer. Cancer is curable up to a certain stage. If it advances too much, it becomes incurable. At this point, the only way to stop its advance is the death of the person (no matter the way the person dies). Only the person's death can put an end to the cancer.
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12446
03/08/05 10:01 PM
03/08/05 10:01 PM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Sure, and it's the cancer that causes the death.
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12447
03/10/05 02:43 PM
03/10/05 02:43 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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In a sense. What really causes the death is the overexposure to radiation. We should remember, however, that this overexposure is not accidental but intentional.
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12448
03/10/05 05:05 PM
03/10/05 05:05 PM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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quote:
Cancer is curable up to a certain stage. If it advances too much, it becomes incurable. At this point, the only way to stop its advance is the death of the person (no matter the way the person dies). Only the person's death can put an end to the cancer.
What's this have to do with radiation?
You said the only way to end the cancer is for the person to be put to death. I said, that's true, and it's the cancer that causes the death, to which you replied, it's actually the radiation that causes death. ![[Confused]](images/icons/confused.gif)
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12450
03/12/05 04:27 AM
03/12/05 04:27 AM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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I remembered that, but your comment wasn't in reference to that. You said the cancer could only be removed by the death of the patient, to which I said the cancer caused that death.
Anyway, we're getting away from the main idea a bit, which is that every person is destined to come face to face with God. To those who have submitted to the radiation treatments (God reveals His love to us a bit at a time so it heals us), this face to face encounter is life, but to those who have refused the treatment the encounter is death.
God certainly deserves no blame for this. It's not His fault that sin is destroyed by love. He's done all He could to prevent the tragedy.
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Re: Can Sin be Destroyed By Destroying Sinners?
#12451
03/29/05 09:18 AM
03/29/05 09:18 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2024
Senior Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 630
New York
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quote:
Originally posted by Daryl Fawcett:
Then doesn't God in a sense destroy the unrepentant sinner in the same way God in a sense hardened Pharoah's heart and in the same sense Pharoah hardened his own heart?
Yes indeed Daryl. This is why the "God does not kill" people are wrong, and one reason why it is incorrect to try to equate views such as mine or Graham Maxwells with the "God does not kill" view.
The issue is NOT over whether or not God distroys the unrepentant sinner, but HOW God distroys the unrepentant sinner. Heaven and Hell are not geographical terms, but the pressence of God in all his love and beauty, or in other words God's glory. Being with HIM is heaven and eternal life to some and hell and eternal death to others, not because God treats them differently, but because they respond differently. God does no more and no less than deciding to no longer remains invisable to us, but personally comes out of hiding, in love,to be intamitely and personally with us, his beloved, no matter how we as individuals respond to this act.
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