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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: asygo] #127667
09/21/10 12:31 PM
09/21/10 12:31 PM
Rosangela  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Quote:
I want something stronger to "prove" that Rom 14 is talking about food offered to idols, as opposed to food in general.

What reason could there be for food in general to cause offense? As I see it, there must be some reason for the offense. Some suggest the OT food laws (but then "wine" does not fit). And the only other possible alternative I see (which, to me, is by far the most probable because it was a common problem those days for Christians living in pagan cities) is food offered to idols.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Rosangela] #127676
09/21/10 08:37 PM
09/21/10 08:37 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Dedicating clean foods to pagan gods before selling it at market in no way made it unfit for consumption. That was Paul's point.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Daryl] #127682
09/22/10 02:29 PM
09/22/10 02:29 PM
Daryl  Offline
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I don't think anybody answered my question, therefore, I am asking it again.

What is the practical definition of a weak brother?

Originally Posted By: Daryl F
Sunday's is about The Weak Brother.

http://www.ssnet.org/qrtrly/eng/10c/less13.html#sun

What is the practical definition of a weak brother?


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Daryl] #127683
09/22/10 03:29 PM
09/22/10 03:29 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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In the context of Romans 14 a weaker brother is someone who hasn't accepted the truth regarding clean foods dedicated to pagan idols.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Mountain Man] #127692
09/22/10 07:21 PM
09/22/10 07:21 PM
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vastergotland  Offline
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Posts: 3,965
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And who would the weak brother be in other contexts?


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: vastergotland] #127696
09/22/10 10:11 PM
09/22/10 10:11 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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It would include people who refuse to be vegetarian when their circumstances make it perfectly possible.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Daryl] #127698
09/23/10 01:54 AM
09/23/10 01:54 AM
Rosangela  Offline
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Brazil
Quote:
I don't think anybody answered my question, therefore, I am asking it again.
What is the practical definition of a weak brother?

I've tried to define the weak brother in my post #127641. The weak brother seems to be the brother who is easily offended by the behavior of other brethren, and can easily stumble or fall (abandon the faith) because of that. He is also an overscrupulous Christian, although a sincere one.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Mountain Man] #127699
09/23/10 02:00 AM
09/23/10 02:00 AM
Rosangela  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Quote:
It would include people who refuse to be vegetarian when their circumstances make it perfectly possible.

Hey Mike, this answer seems to be in disagreement with the passage in question:

Romans 14:2 For one believes he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables.

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Rosangela] #127700
09/23/10 02:18 AM
09/23/10 02:18 AM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Some interesting comments which present additional evidence that Rom. 14 is probably speaking of food sacrificed to idols:

Quote:
But is food offered to an idol unclean? The common teaching of the Jews in that day was a resounding 'yes'! According to the Encyclopedia Judaica under the heading "Purity" it says:

"In the case of idolatrous offerings the law is even stricter [than the impurity of the idol itself] and Judah b. Bava says that it conveys impurity by overshadowing, as does a corpse"


Quote:
Roma 14:21 [It] [is] good neither to eat meat nor drink wine nor [do] [anything] by which your brother stumbles or is offended or is made weak.

Now here is a very important verse. This is where Paul actually clarifies that he is talking about meat offered to idols. It is hidden from our eyes by translation but it is nonetheless there! Let's look at the Greek word that is translated "meat" here...

BDB/Thayers # 2907 2907 kreas {kreh'-as} perhaps a primary word;; n n AV - flesh 2; 2 1) (the) flesh (of a sacrificed animal)

In fact it is this same word that is used in

1Cor 8:13 (NKJV) Therefore, if food makes my brother stumble, I will never again eat meat, lest I make my brother stumble.

This is the only 2 places in the New Testament that it is used. In both cases the context was concerning meat offered to idols! Notice that even though it was obvious from reading the first and second verses of this chapter that he was talking about meat, this is the first time that the food that is spoken of here in Romans is classified as 'meat'. So this certainly clarifies things.


http://www.eliyah.com/romans14.html

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Re: Lesson #13 - All the Rest Is COMMENTARY [Re: Rosangela] #127701
09/23/10 02:31 AM
09/23/10 02:31 AM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Another interesting comment:

Quote:
The third thing to say about the weak brother’s abstinence from meat and wine is that it is not because he believes this behavior is the way he gets justified or the way he secures his acceptance with God. This weak brother is not like the Judaizers in Galatia who thought that circumcision was essential to securing acceptance with God (Galatians 5:1-3). We know this because Paul was furious with this false gospel in Galatians (Galatians 1:6-9), but he gives no criticism of these weak brothers like that. They are not legalists. They do not think their abstinence earns God’s acceptance or contributes to their justification.


http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/resources/how-to-welcome-a-weak-brother

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