Forums118
Topics9,199
Posts195,661
Members1,323
|
Most Online5,850 Feb 29th, 2020
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
|
|
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: Rosangela]
#151991
04/18/13 02:51 PM
04/18/13 02:51 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
Indeed. There can be inspired writings which are not part of the Scriptures (the Bible itself mentions several of them). That's the very basis on which EGW can be accepted as inspired. Yes. And Martin Luther, and Chuck Swindol, and Oswald Chambers, and Brennan Manning, and E.P. Saunders, and Krister Stendahl, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer, and, and, and. None of which is on the level of Scripture.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#151992
04/18/13 03:10 PM
04/18/13 03:10 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
We have evidently not sufficiently clarified the meaning of "inspired" or the nature, degree, and application of "inspiration."
My position with EGW is not that she is NOT inspired. She did have visions, and these visions are useful to the Christian. But she is most definitely NOT on the level of Scripture. She herself says this with her "lesser light/greater light" idea.
Paul writes in 1 Cor. 7:12 (a passage of Scripture) "To the rest I say this, (I, not the Lord)" Is the council that follows inspired not? Paul said it, not God. (His own words) Yet ALL scripture is "God-breathed."
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: JAK]
#151994
04/18/13 05:58 PM
04/18/13 05:58 PM
|
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
|
|
There are degrees of value, not of inspiration. How is this different from my Continuum? Inspired (but of no value)......................to...............Inspired and authoritative. JAK, why would God inspire something if it is of no value? I'm speaking of less value/more value. Of course a genealogy is not as important as a gospel narrative, but it has its importance (I've mentioned this before). The NT is of more importance than the OT, and the OT should be interpreted by the NT, and not the other way around. And so on. But everything that was inspired is important for our salvation and is authoritative.
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: JAK]
#151997
04/18/13 06:29 PM
04/18/13 06:29 PM
|
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
|
|
Indeed. There can be inspired writings which are not part of the Scriptures (the Bible itself mentions several of them). That's the very basis on which EGW can be accepted as inspired. Yes. And Martin Luther, and Chuck Swindol, and Oswald Chambers, and Brennan Manning, and E.P. Saunders, and Krister Stendahl, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer, and, and, and. None of which is on the level of Scripture. This is a common mistake. Martin Luther wasn't inspired, nor Chuck Swindoll, nor Oswald Chambers, nor any of the others you mentioned. People who are inspired are called prophets, and the people you mentioned aren't prophets.
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: JAK]
#151998
04/18/13 06:53 PM
04/18/13 06:53 PM
|
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
|
|
We have evidently not sufficiently clarified the meaning of "inspired" or the nature, degree, and application of "inspiration." You are right. We must begin by the beginning. From Wiki (art. "Biblical Inspiration"): Biblical inspiration is the doctrine in Christian theology that the authors and editors of the Bible were led or influenced by God with the result that their writings may be designated in some sense the word of God. Evangelicals view the Bible as a genuinely human product, but one whose creation was superintended by the Holy Spirit, preserving the authors' works from error [I would say, doctrinal error] without eliminating their specific concerns, situation, or style. This divine involvement, they say, allowed the biblical writers to communicate without corrupting God's own message both to the immediate recipients of the writings and to those who would come after. Three basic approaches to inspiration are often described when the evangelical approach to scripture is discussed:[12]:239 1) Dictation Theory: God dictated the books of the Bible word by word as if the biblical authors were dictating machines;[12] 2) Verbal Plenary Inspiration: This view gives a greater role to the human writers of the Bible, while maintaining a belief that God preserved the integrity of the words of the Bible."[13] The effect of inspiration was to move the authors so as to produce the words God wanted.[12] In this view the human writers' "individual backgrounds, personal traits, and literary styles were authentically theirs, but had been providentially prepared by God for use as his instrument in producing Scripture."[13] 3) Dynamic Inspiration: The thoughts contained in the Bible are inspired, but the words used were left to the individual writers. [#3 is the SDA position]
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#152009
04/19/13 04:07 PM
04/19/13 04:07 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
Regarding degrees of inspiration, or passages of the Bible which are or are not inspired, Mrs. White wrote the following:...
If you don't wish to accept Mrs. White's counsel,... It is a circular argument to use Mrs. White's writtings to prove that Mrs. White is inspired. (Yes, I know. We use the Bible to prove the Bible is inspired. The Bible is in a different category, which is my contention.) ...upon what Biblical basis can one support the concept of "degrees of inspiration"? There may not be any, just like there is no Biblical support for Duel Application of prophecy or or the IJ doctrine. (These are just examples, not side-tracks.) After much study and thought I have come to think of inspiration in this manner. This is how I view it; Ya just gotta' live with it.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: Rosangela]
#152010
04/19/13 04:11 PM
04/19/13 04:11 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
There are degrees of value, not of inspiration. How is this different from my Continuum? Inspired (but of no value)......................to...............Inspired and authoritative. JAK, why would God inspire something if it is of no value? I'm speaking of less value/more value. Fine. Put your cut-off line wherever you want. But it seems you do agree with my Continuum.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#152011
04/19/13 04:29 PM
04/19/13 04:29 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
Indeed. There can be inspired writings which are not part of the Scriptures (the Bible itself mentions several of them). That's the very basis on which EGW can be accepted as inspired. Yes. And Martin Luther, and Chuck Swindol, and Oswald Chambers, and Brennan Manning, and E.P. Saunders, and Krister Stendahl, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer, and, and, and. None of which is on the level of Scripture. This is a common mistake. Martin Luther wasn't inspired, nor Chuck Swindoll, nor Oswald Chambers, nor any of the others you mentioned. People who are inspired are called prophets, and the people you mentioned aren't prophets. Perhaps. Perhaps not. Any thinking person will recognize that these are good men, who produced good work. Therefore, as per the following logic train previously mentioned: A) If it is Good, it is from God. B) If it is from God, it is Inspired. C) All Inspiration is Equal. Therefore: Anything "Good" is Inspired by God on an Equal Level., these men are also on the level of Scripture.
Last edited by JAK; 04/19/13 04:29 PM.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: Why or why not accept Mrs. White as a prophet?
[Re: JAK]
#152015
04/20/13 01:36 AM
04/20/13 01:36 AM
|
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
|
|
Fine. Put your cut-off line wherever you want. But it seems you do agree with my Continuum. Any Christian will agree that in the Bible there are things more important than others. However, this is not to say that there are things more inspired than others.
|
|
|
If it
[Re: JAK]
#152016
04/20/13 01:47 AM
04/20/13 01:47 AM
|
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
|
|
Perhaps. Perhaps not. Any thinking person will recognize that these are good men, who produced good work. Yes, but what is the difference between their works and the works of an inspired prophet? The difference is that inspired writings are "superintended by the Holy Spirit, preserving the authors' works from [doctrinal] error." Therefore, as per the following logic train previously mentioned:
A) If it is Good, it is from God. B) If it is from God, it is Inspired. C) All Inspiration is Equal. Therefore: Anything "Good" is Inspired by God on an Equal Level.,
these men are also on the level of Scripture. Whose logic is this? The error is in B: "If it is from God, it is inspired." The Holy Spirit suggests good thoughts all the time to all of us - but the communication of these thoughts is not generally superintended by the Holy Spirit and kept free from doctrinal error.
|
|
|
|
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
|
|
|