Ok Daryl, then please explain why all the others sabbath observance requirements outlined in the OT law no longer apply? On what basis do you go by the tables of stone alone? Where is it stated that these other sabbath requirements have been removed or abolished?

Lobo,

It seems to me that the God of the Scriptures distinguished between the Ten Commandments and the other laws that were given such as the laws regarding health and the laws regarding ceremonies.

In Hebrews 9:4 we read:

quote:

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Hebrews 9:4 Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had manna, and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;

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Three things were in the ark of the covenant:

1 - The golden pot that had manna

2 - Aaron's rod that budded

3 - The tables of the covenant.

What were the tables of the covenant referring to? I believe they were the Ten Commandments.

It says that the tables of the covenant, the Ten Commandments, were placed within the ark of the covenant.

Where were the other laws that were given to Moses by God placed?

They were placed beside the Ark, but does geography really have anything to do with it?

I mean in reality, the tables of stone were not used or referenced as a “working” law, because no one could look at or touch them. So what was the working law that Israel used? The book of the law or torah. This was a written version of all the 613 laws, which included those originally on stone.

So from a logistical perspective, the Torah was “The Law” because it had all the laws in it and was what they read from and taught from.

So I really don’t see how the tables of stone being in the Ark made it more law to Israel, or makes it more law to you?

In addition, if we use that as the criteria, what does Aaron’s rod and the manna have to do with us Christians now?

Also, are you trying to say that the tables of stone are more valid because in Revelation the Ark in heaven is seen? Does it even state anywhere that there are tables of stone in the heavenly Ark?

So let me ask another question; if what is on the tables of stone is the requirement, then why do you follow the kosher laws from the torah? Why are these laws more moral or valuable than the additional sabbath laws? I don’t see the distinction.

James, it thrilled my soul to read your last post. Praise the Lord. I totally agree with you. When we are truly, really in a loving relationship with Jesus, our service to Him will spring forth from a heart renewed by the love of God. And Oh, how sweet it is. Thank you Jesus.

Lobo, we have already addressed your objections to sabbath keeping. The requirements you listed above, which you feel constitute legitimate sabbath keeping, still apply in principle. But they must be balanced by what Jesus said in the NT - It is lawful to do well on the sabbath day.

For example, it wasn't necessary to run far and wide collecting firewood to cook manna on the sabbath - it was supernaturally preserved by God. The man who disregarded God's instructions and built a fire was guilty of rebellion. But nowadays we don't have manna. Nevertheless, we should still do as much food prep on Friday so we can enjoy the sabbath with Jesus more fully. So you see, the principle still applies.

The rule about a "sabbath day's journey" has been perverted. The principle of traveling on the sabbath implies that we should not travel so far that our entire sabbath is wasted taveling. Which is still true today, even though my vehicle is so comfortable it makes traveling a pleasure.

No matter what we think or say or read about the do's and don'ts of sabbath keeping no honest hearted Christian, who embraces the sabbath, feels like it's a bummer. Lobo, you have chosen to reject the sabbath. That's your prerogative. The rest of us have chosen to imitate Jesus' earthly example, and we also look forward to keeping it with Him throughout eternity. I wish you could enjoy the same with us.

Also, the sabbath commadment doesn't imply we can worship God only once a week. Not at all. Instead, it plainly says we must worship Him every day of the week - by working with Him the first six days and resting with Him on the seventh day.

James,
I praise the Lord for the way you have so eloquently outlined the differences between outward observance and being set free through Jesus Christ.

James you posted:

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But when we loved Jesus really, he would release us from this feeling and sense of bondage. It is a day of joy and happiness, sharing love and attention which others and with Jesus.

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Amen!

God Bless you and your family,
Will

James,

I also praise the Lord for the truth He has revealed to you through the Holy Spirit.

quote:

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James posted:
Thus, I think we must live with faith and love would rule our hearts where the Ten Commandments is no longer a bondage and slavery but fruits of the Spirit. No more a means to be justified, no more a means to be qualified for heaven, no more a means for self righteousness, but an expression of our faith and love.

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Yes, James, it is an expression, it is a result, of our faith and love towards Him.

Thanks all for your loving comments.

It’s really hard for me to be released from the feeling of bondage because, maybe, what I hear, what I read and what I saw is law keeping oriented. A kind of life where righteousness by works is more dominant than righteousness by faith.

So, I try to find a solution where I came up with ideas I have presented here, which I see is much alike with Lobo.

Anyway, this discussion has given me a better perspective of how to relate the law in accordance with righteousness by faith.

Thank you.

In His love

James S.

Lobo.

You are right!

The logic is, if we put the law ahead, it becomes bondage. But when love filled our heart, there is no law (Galatians 5:22,23)! Keeping the Sabbath day as according to what is written on stone tablets is a natural outflow of the hearts that loved Jesus more than self, an expression of our love filled hearts.

We go to church, we put aside our business activity, we turn off the TV, we share our happiness of having a special day alone with Jesus to our servants and employers by releasing them from serving us at that day. All this is done because we want to enter a rest of physical, pleasure and business activity to joint Jesus in faith by honoring him, glorifying him, praising him and meditating about him.

I am sure, this perspective would release me from the feeling of bondage, from the feeling of obligation, from the feeling I am under the law.

Maybe this is what is meant by: Sin would not be your master, because you are not under the law but under grace (Romans 6:14).

Being under grace, the love of God ruled our hearts, expressed it self in deeds that is in harmony with the law; “…. against such there is o law”, which I take as there is no law that I feel obligated to keep and observe, I did it as an expression of love that ruled my heart.

If I put the law ahead, if I feel oblige to keep and observe the law for not breaking it or to have a righteous living, sin (my self-love attitude) would take over and dominate me.

I think this is not against my previous ideas but just a solution or way out to put the law in a correct relationship between me and God.

When Christ is in our heart, his love ruling our mind and body, we became one with him, the partition wall that separates us from him (the law as a means of salvation or righteousness by works) was all removed and nailed to his cross (Ephesians 2:13-15), what left is Christ, in our hearts.

You wrote:

So to clarify, what I’m saying is that if you remove the rules or sabbath observance requirements, it is no longer the sabbath of the ten commandments, it’s something else.


What do you think?

Unquote.

That is my answer; at least I believe it is still fulfilling the 7th day Sabbath as according to what is written on stone.

In His love

James S.

James? Mentaati Sabat?! Selagi ada kejujuran selama itulah ada harapan!