I want to believe what the Bible says and don't want to go beyond that.

The Bible says:the amalgamation or the crossing was between the "Sons of God" and the "Daughters of Men". The result of this crossing produced "Giants" which became "mighty men which were of old men of renown". Gn6:2-5. Do you sincerely think that it means Christian men marrying wordly woman and having the ability to produce "Giants"?

In the OT "Sons of God" means angels. Job 1:6; Job 2:1; Job 38:7

Is there any biblical support of amalgamation of man with beast?

I was responding to what you said:
I responded by giving the example of finches. I was not speaking of whether species was what Ellen White was talking about. I was objecting to your statement that,
" new species, something that does not happen naturally".
Would you be saying that production of new species does happen naturally, just not by amalgamation?
If so, you would further need to qualify it by at least disqualifying plants.


So they thought. Then they discovered some strange creatures.

But then, what is "strange"?

Surely you were only contrasting a point and weren't suggesting amalgamation of man with angels, were you!?

And the offspring of the "sons of God" can be giants for the Lord still today!



Elle, if angels do not marry, how can they have children? Furthermore, if the "sons of God" represent angels of God, pray tell, why would God's own angels be committing this heinous crime of amalgamation, against His orders--to provoke His wrath to the point of destroying the earth with a flood?

As for the word "amalgamation," I'm interested in which Bible version you are finding that?

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Actually, the quote says, amalgamation of man and beast.


What did cause God to "send the flood"? What does the Bible say?

BTW. I never thought of this until I looked at this text yesterday. To me this is not a salvation issue and I'm not going to make a big fuss about this nor worth while to repeat this. However, if you go by what Gen 6 says, to me this kind of thinking goes with the context, makes sence and has more Biblical support the idea that their was an amalgamation between fallen angels and man. To accept that it was an amalgamation of Beast and man and that is what caused the flood, is a little too far fetch, doesn't go well with what Gen 6 says, there's missing links and lacks Biblical support.
The NT texts that you quoted refers in being "sons of God" by adoption. This is not how the OT language was refering to "Sons of God" in Job 1:6; Job 2:1; Job 38:7 which was clearly referring to angels.

Who says angels do not marry in heaven? I think the Bible doesn't really say enough about that for us to give such statement. But let's suppose they don't under God's will, but fallen angels can as they revert to a "natural Brute Beast"(in Jude) in their rebellious state.

Let's look at the Bible quotes referring to the one incidence that you are basing this supposition on:

The teaching Jesus was conveying in Mt 22,Mc 12, and Lk 20 to the trick question was of obedience to God. God's adoptive children, becomes God's children by the surrendering to the will of the Spirit of God which the outcome of their life is totally different from the children of this world.

The problem with sin is a rebellion to the Spirit of God including in our choices in marriages. In this earth, most men and woman marry on their own will and not by God's. Meaning they choose their own mate and do not let God choose for them. That is why their is so many divorces today as we poorly match ourselve.

If we surrender to God, He will find our perfect match and when He put two people together with the ties of love, no one can seperate them. That's what Jesus was referring when he said that
1. You err in thinking that it was a marriage put together by God to begin with,
2. you don't understand scripture in regards of man's need of the indwelling Spirit of God to be led in proper choices
3. You don't know the power of God meaning how inseperable the bonds of marriage are when God puts two people together.

The main problem of the marriages of this world is God is not behind them.

Then Jesus continues and confirms the line of thought by saying
God is not the God of the dead, but of the living. Abraham, Jacob, and Issac where men surrendering to the will of the Spirit of God. That's what makes them "alive" today eventhought they are sleeping in the grave. However, eventhought you are walking around in 2010, if do not walk by the Spirit of God, to God you are dead.

Most people today are walking dead and will continue marrying, and giving in marriage their daughters until Jesus second coming.

But those at the ressurection, won't marry by their own will, nor give their daughters in marriage for personal interest, for they live by the will of the Spirit of God just like the angels in heaven does.


These angels, most likely referring here in Gen 6, are the fallen angels,

Notice Job 1:6
both instance Satan present himself among them(the angels) before the Lord, because Satan is an angel. And at that time, He was going from earth to heaven as He pleased. see Job 1:7

In Jude 1:6 says So we have a support here that the angels(the 1/3 fallen ones) left their first estate(the order of God) and is very plausible that they went on earth(as mention in Job 1:7, and Gen 6) and took woman for wives and made some babies, Giant ones of great renown. Here does not necessarily mean that they were big in statue, but big in influences.

Then it is talking of the incredible state of wickedness in the earth. Since these are in the same breath in the paragraph, it is not too far fetch to suppose that one has to do with the other.

We need to read Gen 6 as what is saying. It is mentioning a phenomena that the wickedness of the people on the earth was "continually evil". This took place in a time where they could walk at the door of the garden of eden and see angels with sword. The story of creation and adam and Eve where very fresh. Evidence was abondance, however in less than 1000 years, we see a phenomena that took place and that probably increased the speed of wickedness.

Since the flood, 5000 years passed by, and the wickedness still haven't reached that peaked. So I think this has been overlooked. Where's your biblical evidence that it was an amalgation of man and beast that caused the flood?

Sorry for misleading, however, if you notice I didn't put in quotes amalgamation as coming from the Bible. I always use KJV and the full text read as so :

Notice here that the Bible specifies that the daughters were born from men that multiply on the earth. There's no mention that these men where christian or followers of God, but just a general statement of men multiplying and daughters were born to them.


So these "sons of God"(most likely angels and not converted men) took the daughters of men(specified in v.1) as wives. So it is a cross of specie since angels and man are not created the same at the beginning. So you can call it AMALGAMATION

Mrs. White tells us that the sons of God spoken of in Genesis referred to the descendants of Seth, who followed God.

She even speaks of this sin of those God-fearing sons of Seth marrying the daughters of the world as being a smaller sin which led toward the destruction of the world later on by flood.

So, she speaks of this "trifle" as having had dire consequences, and actually having been a much greater sin than it might initially appear.

It still leaves me wondering, however, if this constituted the sin of "amalgamation" which was so heinous in God's sight as to cause a flood. If "interracial marriage" between the race of Cain and the descendants of Seth was such a sin, what would that mean for interracial marriage today?

Elle, if the Satanic host can marry and have children, which of us is part demon? Are all angels male? Or are there female ones?

You realize, of course, that when people try to claim that the sons of God were fallen angels (basically a Mormon belief), that they open a whole can of worms, and inconsistencies.

You quoted the statement by Jesus where in heaven we will not marry, but be as the angels. Here is what Mrs. White says about this statement:



Lest you be disappointed that will be no marriage in Heaven, Mrs. White adds the following:



Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Interesting discussions.
As Elle said, knowing exactly what this "amalgamtion is, is probably not a salvation issue.
And marrying unbelievers can become a salvation issue thus a very important point.

However, there are things in these EGW quotes and Bible texts that suggest something much bigger than just the Sethites letting down their guard.

But before getting in to that let me answer a few questions.

Amalgamation means - to mix, to form a blend of diverse (unlike, as in DIFFERENT normally unrelated) elements.

The first question I think I already answered.



Nature does not allow mating between divergent species to produce offspring. A fish can't mate with human and produce a mermaid. A horse can't mate with human and create a centaur. A lion can't mate with a human and create a sphinx.
Nor can zebra mate with a lion and create a zeblion.
Any such variations could only happen by amalgamation not by mating.



I'm refering to the massive remains (thousands of them) of the various dinosaurs in particular, which disappeared suddenly from the face of the earth.

Remember too that
1. amalgamation must start with something that already has life.
2. EGW says they tried amalgamation after the flood as well, though I believe God stepped in to stop it before it got out of hand once more.
3. Not all sea creatures died in the flood -- the fish, etc. had to survive in the water.

Those statements considered, we can now focus on the massive destruction of a multitude of creatures, many huge in size that were wiped into extinction during the flood.



The quote by E. G. White says "of man and beast" it does not say "of man and man and of beast and beast", but clearly states that it was of man and beast.
In 3SG pp. 64 & 75 and 1SP pp. 69, 78 we see that this amalgamation or crossing or mixing of species caused confusion resulting
1. in creatures "which God did not create", and
2. "which defaced the image of God" in man who was created in the image of God.



Gen. 6:12 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.
Notice ALL FLESH, not just man.

Gen. 6:13 The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

The whole creation had gone bad, and needed to be destroyed.
The earth filled with violence -- by ALL FLESH -- seems to imply the terrible results of amalgamation (dinosaurs included) helped fill the earth with violence.

Of course humans are very much included in that statement as well.

NOW TO GENESIS 6


That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

That was verse two.
KJV
There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

ASV
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.

Let's follow the word "Nephilim".

Numbers 13:33
And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

ASV
And there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, who come of the Nephilim: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

That's the only three uses of the word "giant"= "Nephilim" in scripture.

It does give the meaning physical largeness.

Let's see who "Anak" was?

Duet. 9:2
A people great and tall, the children of the Anakims, whom thou knowest, and of whom thou hast heard say, Who can stand before the children of Anak!

So the giant "Nephilim" children of Anak, lived in Canaan and caused the Israelites considerable fright.

Duet. 1:28 "The people is greater and taller than we; the cities are great and walled up to heaven; and moreover we have seen the sons of the Anakims there."

See also Num.13:22,28,33
Calab was given the territory of the Anakims and succeeded largely in driving them out.
See Josh. 15:13,14, and 21:11 also Judges 1:20

Again thes "nephilim" were very large people.

The Bible gives the dimensions of the bed of one of these giant kings.

Duet. 3:11 "Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold, his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; ... nine cubits was the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.

A cubit is from 18-20 inches.
That means his bed was 13.5 to 15 feet long,
and 6 to 7.5 feet wide.

So my conclusion is that something happened there in Genesis 6 which enabled people to produce very tall people.

We know from EGW that Adam was created by God twice as tall as the average man today. So he would have been somewhere between 11 to 12 feet tall.

But these "nephilums" were taller than that. Between 13 o 15 feet tall.

Can a Zebra mate with a horse?