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What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
#107739
01/22/09 05:14 PM
01/22/09 05:14 PM
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OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,127
Florida, USA
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Well I was contemplating this weekend all the issues that change and reform of our core beliefs brought up, when a view of it was unveiled right in front of my very eyes.
I went to a relatives Bat Mitzvah, "one (f.) to whom the commandments apply;" which is a term to describe the coming of age of a Jewish girl. According to Jewish law, when Jewish children reach the age of majority (generally thirteen years for boys and twelve for girls) they become responsible for their actions, and "become a Bar or Bat Mitzvah." In many Conservative and Reform synagogues, girls celebrate their Bat Mitzvahs at age 13, along with boys. Prior to this, the child's parents are responsible for the child's adherence to Jewish law and tradition, and after this age, children bear their own responsibility for Jewish ritual law, tradition, and ethics and are privileged to participate in all areas of Jewish community life.
Well it was at a Reform synagogue as Miami is always evolving and very forward looking but I thought it would still be very close to what I would see at a Conservative if not a Orthodox synagogue. Well coming to the friday night service was a true joy, the temple was filled with many people all dressed in their finest. We read from a prayer book which had many verses from scripture on various subjects and sang songs as the girls participated up front. Afterwards they had celebratory meal prepared with family, friends, and members of the community. I wondered why Adventist didnt come to such a friday service with as much energy and life to it.
Well come Sabbath morning, the Bat Mitzvah usually is associated with the young man or woman being called to read the Torah and/or Haftarah portion at a Shabbat service, so I thought it would be pretty close to the previous service. When we got there they had cleaning people preparing the temple and the lawn being groomed with many machines and trimmers. Well as I was reading the prayer book I came across a part that said a traditional section had been deleted which had to do with observing Gods commandments and the results. When the program began, we sang and read some of the same things from the night before and some new ones, then the girls read the torah.
I asked my wife and she had asked and found out that what the girls read had been practiced and prepared in detail, but they could not actually read and understand the other parts of the torah which had words outside of the selected part. The ceremony included a bowing to the actual synagogue torah which was then carried around for people to touch to show respect.
As soon as the program finished they had another celebratory meal with family, friends, and members of the community. But this celebratory meal eclipsed the religious ceremony itself, I later found out most of the people had come only for this which rivals a wedding celebration in extravagance.
It dawned on me that they were just going through the motions of ceremony and tradition, belief in what God had given them had been set aside. Some come for the Shabbat service itself at the synagogue, but most come for these types of programs or celebrations. And as the synagogue has one scheduled virtually every Shabbat there were always family, friends, and members of the community that attend, so the synagogue as any good theater always has a show to come to..
It seems change has taken all the strength out of their spiritual life and gutted their beliefs, and left them with a empty shell of tradition....
Last edited by Richard; 01/22/09 05:16 PM.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: Rick H]
#107741
01/22/09 09:15 PM
01/22/09 09:15 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
Very Dedicated Member
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,984
CA, USA
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that is very sad. but hasnt it been like that since they rejected Jesus as a group? im sure there are individuals who sincerely worship the God they know, but as a group it has been mostly about lip service, hasnt it?
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: teresaq]
#107748
01/22/09 11:39 PM
01/22/09 11:39 PM
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SDA Active Member 2014
Veteran Member
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 936
Quebec
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Mostly true Richard. But modern Judaism still carries a strong tradition of family. Generally a high regard for the elders and for community. While centered around the synagogue as a secular hub, at least they stick together. Overall it seems less empty than modern Adventism because they like to come together, share, do business, interact. There is a human element which would exist without the temple. And they will build one from scratch just so they can congregate. This perspective from a city with thousands of holocaust survivors and strong communal fabric. My first Bar Mitzvah at age twelve resembles your description - party, food, bling, an absence of alcohol. But there was a warmth, even to strangers which continues to this day. And a certain code of generosity and honour amongst many.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: gordonb1]
#107758
01/23/09 08:29 PM
01/23/09 08:29 PM
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OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,127
Florida, USA
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Mostly true Richard. But modern Judaism still carries a strong tradition of family. Generally a high regard for the elders and for community. While centered around the synagogue as a secular hub, at least they stick together. Overall it seems less empty than modern Adventism because they like to come together, share, do business, interact. There is a human element which would exist without the temple. And they will build one from scratch just so they can congregate. This perspective from a city with thousands of holocaust survivors and strong communal fabric. My first Bar Mitzvah at age twelve resembles your description - party, food, bling, an absence of alcohol. But there was a warmth, even to strangers which continues to this day. And a certain code of generosity and honour amongst many.
Yes, thats why I like to participate whenever I get a chance as it is very nice program, and we are treated like family by everyone, but spiritually the worship is dead. They treat the synagogue as most other non-Jews treat the country club, they go there to make business contacts, socialize, play and eat then go home. They pay fees as set for their place in the temple and their names on the walls, and they have much enjoyment in the temple, but something is missing. The prayer book was the same one I had read before, with the same pages being recited just updated, some even knew it by memory. Its like a play that everyone knows the words but the true meaning has faded...
Last edited by Richard; 01/23/09 08:38 PM.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: Rick H]
#107765
01/24/09 02:13 AM
01/24/09 02:13 AM
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Yes, this is truly sad, but what is truly even more sad is that this is not only happening there. It is also happening in many of our own Christian churches.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: Daryl]
#107774
01/24/09 09:57 AM
01/24/09 09:57 AM
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OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,127
Florida, USA
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Yes, this is truly sad, but what is truly even more sad is that this is not only happening there. It is also happening in many of our own Christian churches. Yes, the Lutherans and Anglicans, and a few others seem to have lost much of the zeal in their beliefs and seem to be without direction and drifting back to the Holy See as he is called and slowly acknowlinging his power and the Catholic Church's as the 'leader of the Christian world'.
Last edited by Richard; 01/24/09 09:58 AM.
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Re: What is the harm in changing our beliefs and reforming Adventism?
[Re: Rick H]
#107776
01/24/09 01:16 PM
01/24/09 01:16 PM
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OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,127
Florida, USA
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Here is some of the agreements the Anglicans are working on .... "The Anglican Roman Catholic International Commission (ARCIC) has released its latest document in its continuing dialogue.... "The Revd Canon Gregory Cameron, Anglican Co-Secretary of ARCIC, speaking in Seattle said,'This document represents sustained reflection on an aspect of Christian faith in which many Christians have found spiritual strength. It is our hope that all Christians will be helped by this statement to understand why Mary has been a figure of such significance.'" http://www.wfn.org/2005/05/msg00152.htmlquote: ---------- "What does the text say about Marian devotion? "The final major section of the document (paragraphs 64-75) addresses the place of Mary in the life of the Church, touching on questions pertaining to Marian devotion. The section begins with a strong affirmation:'We together agree that in understanding Mary as the fullest human example of the life of grace, we are called to reflect on the lessons of her life recorded in Scripture and to join with her as one indeed not dead, but truly alive in Christ'(paragraph 65). The text stresses that Marian devotion and the invocation of Mary are not in any way to obscure or diminish the unique mediation of Christ. It concludes: 'Affirming together unambiguously Christ's unique mediation, which bears fruit in the life of the Church, we do not consider the practice of asking Mary and the saints to pray for us as communion dividing.... we believe that there is no continuing theological reason for ecclesial division on these matters.'" ---------- http://www.anglicancommunion.org/acns/article... A third article on the agreement of the veneration and worship of Mary... http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0%2C%2C3... says, quote: ---------- "In the passage likely to cause most dissent, the document says the infallible dogmas of the Immaculate Conception and the Assumption - the teachings that Mary was herself conceived 'without sin' and that on death she was 'assumed' body and soul into Heaven - are 'consonant with the teaching of the Scriptures'." This doctrine is certainly not biblical and leads to idol worship and its roots are from pagan worship of the ' Queen of Heaven ' http://sabbatarian.com/Paganism/Queen01.htmlhttp://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/sunburst.htm http://www.spiralgoddess.com/Mary.html
Last edited by Richard; 01/24/09 02:09 PM.
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