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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: Rick H]
#114252
06/06/09 11:01 PM
06/06/09 11:01 PM
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wow!! well that should get us to studying!!
what is the rest in Christ we should all have, for starters? is it just on the sabbath, or is the 7th day sabbath rest different from the rest in Christ?
and what do these people mean, exactly, when they say they are resting in Christ?
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: teresaq]
#114258
06/07/09 01:10 AM
06/07/09 01:10 AM
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Ok, really easy, here: "Sabbath rest" in Hebrews there means same day Jews keep holy and why!
What Christ has done for us enables him to do it in us too, if we are taught by the Holy Spirt all the things Jesus wants his disciples to do.
This does need something else to be clear: justification by faith is also a heart change, not just pardon for the past. Also sanctification is part of the subjective gospel for us: we are required to be obedient to Jesus, and that should be perfect in Christlikeness, too. Without both these righteousness factors, the Sabbath itself is off the menu, with the rest of the law, too!
Holy Spirit in us is no basis for Christ not doing in us what he has done for us, as the Spirit teaches us what, exactly???
Last edited by Colin; 06/07/09 01:20 AM. Reason: editing
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: Colin]
#114262
06/07/09 01:48 AM
06/07/09 01:48 AM
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the OT folks did not have this available to them (i.e. rest in Christ) therefore there rest was on the seventh day...likewise the people Jesus spoke to in the Gospels did not have this available to them either...so they also kept the sabbath (day) I would focus on this, I think. This shows a real lack of understanding that the Gospel has not changed, or that the rest of Christ was just as available for OT saints as for NT saints. Indeed, there never has been any true rest, except in Christ. Once one establishes that the same Gospel, and the same Christ, and the same rest, was in effect in the OT that is in the NT, one should be able to study what has changed and what hasn't (e.g. ceremonial law vs. moral law).
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: Rick H]
#114271
06/07/09 02:04 AM
06/07/09 02:04 AM
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Hebrews 4 is one of the most argumentative verses in the Bible when it comes to the issue of Sabbath and rest. There have been two views on this for as far back as I have known being a Seventh-day Adventist. Let us review the Scriptures from Hebrews starting with the third Chapter:
Chapter 3
3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus; 3:2 Who was faithful to him that appointed him, as also Moses [was faithful] in all his house. 3:3 For this [man] was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house. 3:4 For every house is builded by some [man]; but he that built all things [is] God. 3:5 And Moses verily [was] faithful in all his house, as a servant, for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken after; 3:6 But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end. 3:7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice, 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness: 3:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years. 3:10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in [their] heart; and they have not known my ways. 3:11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my (rest.) 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. 3:13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; 3:15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation. 3:16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. 3:17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? [was it] not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness? 3:18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? 3:19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Chapter 4
4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left [us] of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard [it]. 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh [day] on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. 4:5 And in this [place] again, If they shall enter into my rest. 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief: 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God [did] from his. 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 4:13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things [are] naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast [our] profession. 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin. 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
The first time the word rest is used in Hebrews comes from the book of Psalms in Chapter 95 starting with verse 7:
95:7 For he [is] our God; and we [are] the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice, 95:8 Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, [and] as [in] the day of temptation in the wilderness: 95:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work. 95:10 Forty years long was I grieved with [this] generation, and said, It [is] a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways: 95:11 Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest. Now with this word rest in both the Psalms and Hebrews there are no correlating verses to explain the word rest. So what was Jesus speaking about to David and to Paul about this rest? We need to look up the word rest in other verses and possibly the concordance to know the meaning of this word rest used in both the OT and NT by the writers given to them by Jesus regarding this rest.
First question I ask myself is the rest used in Genesis of the seventh day the same rest given in Psalms and Hebrews.
I looked the words up and came up with this 4496 OT Menwchak means repose, peacefully, comfortable, still. 2663 NT, reposing. Then in Genesis 7673 Shabath means repose, desist from exertion.
Since we have one word used in all three words for rest we find repose or reposing. What does repose or reposing mean?
repose1 definition
re·pose (ri pōz′)
transitive verb reposed -·posed′, reposing -·pos′·ing to lay or place for rest: often reflexive to repose oneself on a bed
Etymology: LME reposen < OFr reposer < LL repausare < L re-, again + LL pausare: see pose
intransitive verb
1. to lie at rest 2. to rest from work, travel, exercise, etc. 3. to rest in death or a grave 4. to lie quiet and calm 5. to lie, rest, or be supported shale reposing on a bed of limestone 6. Archaic to have trust (in); rely (on or upon)
noun
1. a reposing, or resting 2. 1. rest 2. sleep 3. peace of mind; freedom from worry or troubles 4. calm or ease of manner; composure 5. calm; tranquillity; peace 6. harmony of form or color, giving an effect of tranquillity, as in painting
repose2 definition
re·pose (ri pōz′)
transitive verb reposed -·posed′, reposing -·pos′·ing
1. Rare to place; put 2. to place (trust, confidence, etc.) in someone 3. to place (power, management, etc.) in the control of some person or group
Etymology: ME reposen < L repositus: see repository
Webster's New World College Dictionary Copyright © 2005 by Wiley Publishing, Inc., Cleveland, Ohio. Used by arrangement with John Wiley & Sons, Inc.
It appears that reposing could mean the same thing as far as the sabbath rest and/or trusting someone.
There is a verse in the Psalms before verse 7 that gives me a clue:
5:6 O come, let us worship and bow down: let us kneel before the LORD our maker.
The word that stands out to me is worship and who do we worship and why? Let us go a few verses before verse 6:
95:3 For the LORD [is] a great God, and a great King above all gods. 95:4 In his hand [are] the deep places of the earth: the strength of the hills [is] his also. 95:5 The sea [is] his, and he made it: and his hands formed the dry [land].
Where do we find such words written? Let us go to Exodus 20:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
I think we can try to make this word rest to mean anything we wish, but the picture I see coming from these verses and go along with Chapter 4 we are talking about the Seventh-day Sabbath rest.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: Rick H]
#114291
06/07/09 03:43 AM
06/07/09 03:43 AM
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Global Moderator Supporting Member 2022
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I am coming across many Christians who know Sunday is not the Sabbath yet they come up and say "my rest is in Christ" or "Christ is our rest". How would you answer such a statement. Here is part of what I was told:
if you want to keep some special day then go for it.....i'm just explaining why i don't keep any special days...Christ has kept them for me......"
Christ has also kept the whole moral law for us. It is His righteous merits credited to us that gives us the perfection needed for heaven. Does this mean we can now steal, take God's name in vain, covet, following the pride of life, the lust of the eye and desires of the flesh, as we "rest in Christ"? No, of course not. Sin is rebellion against the things of God, it's the transgression of God's law which includes trampling on God's holy Sabbath day -- Yet the person united in Christ is to count themselves dead to the old life of sin and alive in Christ, not letting sin reign in their mortal bodies, but to serve righteousness! Hebrews 3-4 from which such arguments as you've heard, are usually taken says TODAY IF YOU WILL HEAR MY VOICE DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEART IN REBELLIONThree times the author repeats this phrase: (3:8. 3:15, 4:7) What are we to do today? We are to hear God's voice and not harden our hearts in rebellion! Another verse says the same thing only with different words. Vs. 3:13 "Exhort one another daily, while it is called TODAY lest anyone be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.TODAY HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS THROUGH THE DECEITFULNESS OF SIN! It is the law that points out the deceitfulness of sin, so we need not be deceived by it. Why would we want to abolish the law with its Sabbath, because "Christ fulfilled it for us"? The law, including the call not to forget the Sabbath, points out the deceitfulness of sin, the Holy Spirit leads us to confess that sin, the blood of Christ cleanses us from that sin, what do we say then, do we continue in that sin? NO God forbid, why would we go back and harden our hearts in rebellion with the deceitfulness of sin? Do we find rest by setting aside the law? No, the Bible say in Psalms 119.165: "Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them." It also says in Isaiah 57.20-21 "But the wicked are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, whose waters cast up mire and dirt. There is no peace, saith my God, to the wicked." As long as we are in opposition to God's law which includes the Sabbath, there is no way we can find the real rest in Christ. For the rebellious heart is constantly chafing and bucking under the restraining purity of Christ, and finds itself most uncomfortable in His presence, which is the essense of a Sabbath DAY rest. It is only as we surrender our "old man" to die with Christ, recognizing our need for cleansing and our dependance upon Christ, and raising in newness of life, placing ourselves in harmony with the God's law, that we are in harmony with Christ. Then we will find delight in spending quality time with Him on His holy day. To walk with Christ is to walk in the ways of the His law, for the two cannot be separated.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: dedication]
#114294
06/07/09 03:49 AM
06/07/09 03:49 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Lawrence, Kansas
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As long as we are in opposition to God's law which includes the Sabbath, there is no way we can find the real rest in Christ. This is a nice thought. The Sabbath stands for the whole law. The rebellion in the last days against the Sabbath is not simply against the Sabbath, but against the whole law, and against the author of the law.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: liane]
#114297
06/07/09 04:10 AM
06/07/09 04:10 AM
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Hebrews 4 is one of the most argumentative verses in the Bible when it comes to the issue of Sabbath and rest. ....First question I ask myself is the rest used in Genesis of the seventh day the same rest given in Psalms and Hebrews.
I looked the words up and came up with this 4496 OT Menwchak means repose, peacefully, comfortable, still. 2663 NT, reposing. Then in Genesis 7673 Shabath means repose, desist from exertion.
Interesting word study! When God offered "rest" to the children of Israel, He offered His holy Sabbath with it. And if BOTH WERE OFFERED TO ISRAEL AT THE SAME TIME, then one can't be a shadow of the other. It is no different today, Christ is still offering His rest, as well as His Sabbath! One is not a shadow of the other. Did you know there are at least two words used for "rest" in Hebrews itself? Therefore a Sabbath Rest Remains for the people of God. (Hebs. 4:9)The word translated as "rest" in this verse is not the same word as translated "rest" in elsewhere in the chapter. The Greek word translated "rest" in most passage throughout Hebrews 3 and 4 is "katapausis." 3:11,18, 4:1,3,5,10,11 It is also used in Acts 7:49 "Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool, what house will you build me, or what is the place of my REST." It can carry the meaning of "putting to rest" or "a place of rest". katapauō is used in verses 4:4 and 4:8 (meaning to take rest, matching more your word for "repose") BUT the word for "rest" in Hebrews 4:9 is (sabbatismos). The term (sabbatismos) is seen in the writings of Plutarch, Justin, Epiphanius, and others, and each time the term denotes the observance of the Sabbath. Also consider the verb "remains" "(apoleipetai) which literally means "has been left." So the text is saying, that Sabbath obsevance remains for the people of God. He has connected the "rest" Later the author tells us what has been abolished BUT FIRST he confirms the SABBATH REST remains behind for the people of God.
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Re: "My rest is in Christ"?
[Re: teresaq]
#114305
06/07/09 05:56 AM
06/07/09 05:56 AM
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a few thoughts from the bible/sop. When Jesus was awakened to meet the storm, He was in perfect peace. There was no trace of fear in word or look, for no fear was in His heart. But He rested not in the possession of almighty power. It was not as the "Master of earth and sea and sky" that He reposed in quiet. That power He had laid down, and He says, "I can of Mine own self do nothing." John 5:30. He trusted in the Father's might. It was in faith--faith in God's love and care--that Jesus rested, and the power of that word which stilled the storm was the power of God. {DA 336.1} As Jesus rested by faith in the Father's care, so we are to rest in the care of our Saviour. If the disciples had trusted in Him, they would have been kept in peace. Their fear in the time of danger revealed their unbelief. In their efforts to save themselves, they forgot Jesus; and it was only when, in despair of self-dependence, they turned to Him that He could give them help. {DA 336.2} ylt: Heb 3:7 Wherefore, (as the Holy Spirit saith, `To-day, if His voice ye may hear-- Heb 3:8 ye may not harden your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of the temptation in the wilderness, Heb 3:9 in which tempt Me did your fathers, they did prove Me, and saw My works forty years; Heb 3:10 wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, Always do they go astray in heart, and these have not known My ways; Heb 3:11 so I sware in My anger, If they shall enter into My rest--!') Heb 3:12 See, brethren, lest there shall be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in the falling away from the living God, Psa 78:22 Because they believed not in God, and trusted not in his salvation: Psa 37:7 Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for him: fret not thyself because of him who prospereth in his way, because of the man who bringeth wicked devices to pass. Psa 95:7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice, Psa 95:8 Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness: Psa 95:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work. Psa 95:10 Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways: Psa 95:11 Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest. Consecrate yourself to God in the morning; make this your very first work. Let your prayer be, "Take me, O Lord, as wholly Thine. I lay all my plans at Thy feet. Use me today in Thy service. Abide with me, and let all my work be wrought in Thee." This is a daily matter. Each morning consecrate yourself to God for that day. Surrender all your plans to Him, to be carried out or given up as His providence shall indicate. Thus day by day you may be giving your life into the hands of God, and thus your life will be molded more and more after the life of Christ. {SC 70.1} A life in Christ is a life of restfulness. There may be no ecstasy of feeling, but there should be an abiding, peaceful trust. Your hope is not in yourself; it is in Christ. Your weakness is united to His strength, your ignorance to His wisdom, your frailty to His enduring might. So you are not to look to yourself, not to let the mind dwell upon self, but look to Christ. Let the mind dwell upon His love, upon the beauty, the perfection, of His character. Christ in His self-denial, Christ in His humiliation, Christ in His purity and holiness, Christ in His matchless love --this is the subject for the soul's contemplation. It is by loving Him, copying Him, depending wholly upon Him, that you are to be transformed into His likeness. {SC 70.2} Jesus says, "Abide in Me." These words convey the idea of rest, stability, confidence. Again He invites,"Come unto Me, . . . and I will give you rest." Matthew 11:28. The words of the psalmist express the same thought: "Rest in the Lord, and wait patiently for Him." And Isaiah gives the assurance, "In quietness and in confidence shall be your strength." Psalm 37:7; Isaiah 30:15. This rest is not found in inactivity; for in the Saviour's invitation the promise of rest is united with the call to labor: "Take My yoke upon you: . . . and ye shall find rest." Matthew 11:29. The heart that rests most fully upon Christ will be most earnest and active in labor for Him. {SC 71.1} When the mind dwells upon self, it is turned away from Christ, the source of strength and life. Hence it is Satan's constant effort to keep the attention diverted from the Saviour and thus prevent the union and communion of the soul with Christ. The pleasures of the world, life's cares and perplexities and sorrows, the faults of others, or your own faults and imperfections--to any or all of these he will seek to divert the mind. Do not be misled by his devices. Many who are really conscientious, and who desire to live for God, he too often leads to dwell upon their own faults and weaknesses, and thus by separating them from Christ he hopes to gain the victory. We should not make self the center and indulge anxiety and fear as to whether we shall be saved. All this turns the soul away from the Source of our strength. Commit the keeping of your soul to God, and trust in Him. Talk and think of Jesus. Let self be lost in Him. Put away all doubt; dismiss your fears. Say with the apostle Paul, "I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave Himself for me." Galatians 2:20. Rest in God. He is able to keep that which you have committed to Him. If you will leave yourself in His hands, He will bring you off more than conqueror through Him that has loved you. {SC 71.2} Those who are unwilling to give the Lord faithful, earnest, loving service will not find spiritual rest in this life nor in the life to come. "There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. . . . Let us labor therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fail after the same example of unbelief." The rest here spoken of is the rest of grace, obtained by following the prescription. "Labor diligently." {PUR, November 7, 1901 par. 6}
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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