I haven't read the whole context of the quote Tom brought here, however, this quote does say that Lucifer could of been pardon without the shedding of the blood of Christ. So that is quite a strong EGW quote that can negate the belief of "penal substitution".

God's law stands fully vindicated. He is just, and yet the justifier of all who believe in Jesus. Nothing less than this plan of atonement could convince the whole universe of God's justice. {4SP 323.2}

Where does it say "the shedding of the blood of Christ" was not necessary? I haven't read that anywhere.

God's law stands fully vindicated. He is just, and yet the justifier of all who believe in Jesus. Nothing less than this plan of atonement could convince the whole universe of God's justice. {4SP 323.2}

The whole world needs to be instructed in the oracles of God, to understand the object of the atonement, the at-one-ment, with God. The object of this atonement was that the divine law and government might be maintained. The sinner is pardoned through repentance toward God and faith in our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. There is forgiveness of sin, and yet the law of God stands immutable, eternal as His throne. There is no such thing as weakening or strengthening the law of Jehovah. As it has always been, so it is. It cannot be repealed or changed in one principle. It is eternal, immutable as God Himself.--Manuscript 163, 1897.

Lucifer was doing far more then "questioning", he was spreading dissatisfaction and doubts in a very underhanded manner. MANY were affected by his insinuations. Many were confused.

Could God simply reinstate him without an atonement?

All these offerings were to typify Christ and to rivet the great truth in their hearts that the blood of Jesus Christ alone cleanseth from all sin, and without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins. Some wonder why God desired so many sacrifices and appointed the offering of so many bleeding victims in the Jewish economy. {1SM 106.4}
Every dying victim was a type of Christ, which lesson was impressed on mind and heart in the most solemn, sacred ceremony, and explained definitely by the priests. Sacrifices were explicitly planned by God Himself to teach this great and momentous truth, that through the blood of Christ alone there is forgiveness of sins. {1SM 107.1}

The atonement, or "at-one-ment," in Lucifer's case would have been his repentance and submission, just as God communicated.

God's law stands fully vindicated. He is just, and yet the justifier of all who believe in Jesus. Nothing less than this plan of atonement could convince the whole universe of God's justice. {4SP 323.2}

Don't know what I said to this last time..., but both you two, courtesy of Tom, aren't looking also at the Bible and SOP on the judgement of God against sin with hell fire, and everything placing any human there. How Lucifer gets there is his own fault, and immaterial to our salvation, since Lucifer isn't a candidate for salvation, being the first in the queue for God's judgement of hell.

sorry, my brother, this doesnt/hasnt sounded like any bible/sop ive read. it is completely alien to what i have read from those. but it does sound like a courtroom which i have never equated with the bible/God/sanctuary.

The transgression of God's law in a single instance, in the smallest particular, is sin. And the nonexecution of the penalty of that sin would be a crime in the divine administration. God is a judge, the Avenger of justice, which is the habitation and the foundation of His throne. He cannot dispense with His law; He cannot do away with its smallest item in order to meet and pardon sin. The rectitude, justice, and moral excellence of the law must be maintained and vindicated before the heavenly universe and the worlds unfallen.--Manuscript 145, Dec. 30, 1897, "Notes of Work." {UL 378.6}

The fig leaves represent the arguments used to cover disobedience. When the Lord calls the attention of men and women to the truth, the making of fig leaves into aprons will commence in order to hide the nakedness of the soul of every transgressor. {21MR 193.4}
The Lord Jesus Christ has prepared a covering, the robe of His own righteousness, that He will put on every repenting, believing soul who by faith will receive it. Said John, "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." Sin is the transgression of the law. Christ died to make it possible for every man to have his sins taken away. {21MR 193.5}
A fig-leaf apron will never cover our nakedness. Sin must be taken away, and the garment of Christ's righteousness must cover the transgressor of God's law. Then when the Lord looks upon the believing sinner, He sees, not the fig leaves covering him, but Christ's own robe of righteousness, which is perfect obedience to the law of Jehovah. Man has hidden his nakedness, not under a covering of fig leaves, but under the robe of Christ's righteousness. {21MR 193.6}
Christ has made a sacrifice to satisfy the demands of Justice. What a price for heaven to pay to ransom the transgressor of the law of Jehovah. Yet that holy law could not be maintained with any smaller price. In the place of the law being abolished to meet sinful man in his fallen condition, it has been maintained in all its sacred dignity. In His Son God gave Himself to save from eternal ruin all who would believe in Him. {21MR 194.1}
Sin is disloyalty to God, and deserving of punishment. Fig leaves sewed together have been employed since the days of Adam, yet the nakedness of the soul of the sinner is not covered. All the arguments pieced together by all who have interested themselves in this flimsy robe, will come to naught. Sin is the transgression of the law. Christ was manifest in our world to take away transgression and sin, and to substitute the pure robes of His righteousness for the covering of fig leaves. The law of God stands vindicated by the suffering and death of the only begotten Son of the infinite God. {21MR 194.2}
The transgression of God's law in a single instance, in the smallest particular, is sin. And the non-execution of the penalty of that sin would be a crime in the divine administration. God is a judge, the avenger of justice, which is the habitation and foundation of His throne. He cannot dispense with His law, He cannot do away with its smallest item in order to meet and pardon sin. The rectitude and justice and moral excellence of the law must be maintained and vindicated before the heavenly universe and the worlds unfallen. {21MR 194.3}
What is the justice of God? It is the holiness of God in relation to sin. Christ bore the sins of the world in man's behalf that the sinner might have another trial, with all the divine opportunities and advantages which God has provided in man's behalf. "Whosoever committeth sin," says John, "transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that He was manifested to take away our sins; and in Him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in Him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen Him, neither known Him" [1 John 3:4-6]. {21MR 194.4}
I would call on all who would win heaven, to take warning. Do not devote your precious probationary time to sewing together fig leaves to cover the nakedness which is the result of sin. As you look into the Lord's great moral looking glass, His holy law, His standard of character, do not for a moment suppose that it can cleanse you. There are no saving properties in the law. It cannot pardon the transgressor. The penalty must be exacted. The Lord does not save sinners by abolishing His law, the foundation of His government in heaven and in earth. The punishment has been endured by the sinner's substitute. {21MR 194.5}
Not that God is cruel and merciless, and Christ so merciful that He died on Calvary's cross to abolish a law so arbitrary that it needed to be extinguished, crucified between two thieves. The throne of God must not bear one stain of crime, one taint of sin. In the councils of heaven, before the world was created, the Father and the Son covenanted together that if man proved disloyal to God, Christ, one with the Father, would take the place of the transgressor, and suffer the penalty of justice that must fall upon him. {21MR 195.1}
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." Christ did not come to change the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. He did not come to lessen the law of God in one particular. He came to express in His own person the love of God. He came to vindicate every precept of the holy law. {21MR 195.2}
Christ presented to His disciples their exalted position in the world. "Ye are the light of the world," He said, "a city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" [Matthew 5:14-16]. {21MR 195.3}
Christ read the hearts of the Pharisees, who were bracing themselves to resist the light. Their prejudice against Him was strengthening; they were saying in their hearts, He is doing away [with] the law; we will have no such teaching. But while they were bottling up their wrath, there fell on their startled ears the answer to their unspoken thought: Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill (every specification of the law). For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle will in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven" [Matthew 5:17-19]. {21MR 195.4}

No, I say no. Colin, I don't understand why in nearly every post I have to keep repeating the request for you to quote me as opposed to misrepresenting what I've said. I really don't understand this. Please stop doing this.

It should be clear from the fact that I keep quoting this that I believe that rebels must be dealt with. Where we differ is as to what the punishment consists of. Is it something arbitrary God does to them, or is it the result of choosing sin?

perhaps, my brother, you are not "searching the scriptures to see if that is so", but are bringing your "proof texts"? smile

i spent my spare time today collecting the statements containing "hold back" and "sweep away". one thing i started seeing was how we can "deny" Gods mercy with some of our beliefs.

the message that we should be giving the world isnt that God is going to "zap" them, get even with them, if they dont shape up.

the message we need to be giving the world, and very quickly in light of what has been happening, is that God is holding back the winds of disaster of every kind. He is preventing satan from having his way in this world through those who prefer satans character to Gods.

the context has to do with us trying to cover ourselves with fig leaves instead of accepting the righteousness, imputed/imparted of Christ. the context also has to do with the fact that God has, in no way, shape, or form, done away with the law but lived it perfectly. He offers it to us in exchange for our fig leaves.

sorry, my brother, this doesnt/hasnt sounded like any bible/sop ive read. it is completely alien to what i have read from those. but it does sound like a courtroom which i have never equated with the bible/God/sanctuary.

The transgression of God's law in a single instance, in the smallest particular, is sin. And the nonexecution of the penalty of that sin would be a crime in the divine administration. God is a judge, the Avenger of justice, which is the habitation and the foundation of His throne. He cannot dispense with His law; He cannot do away with its smallest item in order to meet and pardon sin. The rectitude, justice, and moral excellence of the law must be maintained and vindicated before the heavenly universe and the worlds unfallen.--Manuscript 145, Dec. 30, 1897, "Notes of Work." {UL 378.6}

The death of Christ removes every argument that Satan could bring against the precepts of Jehovah. Satan has declared that men could not enter the kingdom of heaven unless the law was abolished, and a way devised by which transgressors could be reinstated into the favor of God, and made heirs of heaven. He made the claim that the law must be changed, that the reins of government must be slackened in heaven, that sin must be tolerated, and sinners pitied and saved in their sins. But every such plea was cast aside when Christ died as a substitute for the sinner. --The Signs of the Times, May 21, 1912.