Do you think it is the literal light radiating from God that will cause the wicked to suffer and die?

We know the death that sin causes from the cross.

We know the death that sin causes from the cross.

T:We know the death that sin causes from the cross.

GC:That is true. However, that is but one of two forms of death in its category, as symbolized by the two goats: the sacrificial one and the scapegoat. Satan's death will be that of the Scapegoat, while Jesus' was that of the Sacrifice.

We know the wicked will die. We the know inevitable result of sin is death. But what you haven't explained is what you think will cause them 1) to suffer and 2) to die.

I believe the radiant firelight of God's presence is what will cause them to suffer and to die.

I do not believe comprehending the contrast between their character and God's will cause them to suffer and to die. What do you believe?

M: We know the wicked will die. We the know inevitable result of sin is death. But what you haven't explained is what you think will cause them 1) to suffer and 2) to die.

T: I've mentioned both DA 108 and DA 764 to explain this. Also GC 542-543 comes to mind.

M: I believe the radiant firelight of God's presence is what will cause them to suffer and to die.

T: That doesn't fit with DA 108, for sure. Actually, all three of the passages I quoted deal with the issue of character; that is, that the character of the wicked is what causes the presence of God to be a consuming fire to them. Your explanations have been "fleshly" ones, that they suffer because they don't have resurrected bodies.

M: I do not believe comprehending the contrast between their character and God's will cause them to suffer and to die. What do you believe?

T: You're saying do not believe comprehending the contrast between their character and God's will cause them either suffer and die, or both? In other words, are you saying you don't believe seeing their own characters in the light of God's character won't cause the wicked any suffering? Would you say this to the judgment as a whole? That is, as the wicked are shown the wrong paths they have taken, the sins they have committed, that they will be lost forever, that they could have had an eternal joyful existence, none of these things will cause them to suffer?

T: I think these things will cause the suffering which is described in both Scripture and the SOP, and it will proportional, with those having had sinned the most, against the most light, suffering the most as these things are revealed to them.

Notwithstanding that Satan has been constrained to acknowledge God's justice and to bow to the supremacy of Christ, his character remains unchanged. The spirit of rebellion, like a mighty torrent, again bursts forth. Filled with frenzy, he determines not to yield the great controversy. The time has come for a last desperate struggle against the King of heaven. He rushes into the midst of his subjects and endeavors to inspire them with his own fury and arouse them to instant battle. But of all the countless millions whom he has allured into rebellion, there are none now to acknowledge his supremacy. His power is at an end. The wicked are filled with the same hatred of God that inspires Satan; but they see that their case is hopeless, that they cannot prevail against Jehovah. Their rage is kindled against Satan and those who have been his agents in deception, and with the fury of demons they turn upon them. {GC 671.2}

Saith the Lord: "Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God; behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness. They shall bring thee down to the pit." "I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. . . . I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee. . . . I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. . . . Thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more." Ezekiel 28:6-8, 16-19. {GC 672.1}

"Every battle of the warrior is with confused noise, and garments rolled in blood; but this shall be with burning and fuel of fire." "The indignation of the Lord is upon all nations, and His fury upon all their armies: He hath utterly destroyed them, He hath delivered them to the slaughter." "Upon the wicked He shall rain quick burning coals, fire and brimstone and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup." Isaiah 9:5; 34:2; Psalm 11:6, margin. Fire comes down from God out of heaven. The earth is broken up. The weapons concealed in its depths are drawn forth. Devouring flames burst from every yawning chasm. The very rocks are on fire. The day has come that shall burn as an oven. The elements melt with fervent heat, the earth also, and the works that are therein are burned up. Malachi 4:1; 2 Peter 3:10. The earth's surface seems one molten mass--a vast, seething lake of fire. It is the time of the judgment and perdition of ungodly men--"the day of the Lord's vengeance, and the year of recompenses for the controversy of Zion." Isaiah 34:8. {GC 672.2}

The wicked receive their recompense in the earth. Proverbs 11:31. They "shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts." Malachi 4:1. Some are destroyed as in a moment, while others suffer many days. All are punished "according to their deeds." The sins of the righteous having been transferred to Satan, he is made to suffer not only for his own rebellion, but for all the sins which he has caused God's people to commit. His punishment is to be far greater than that of those whom he has deceived. After all have perished who fell by his deceptions, he is still to live and suffer on. In the cleansing flames the wicked are at last destroyed, root and branch--Satan the root, his followers the branches. The full penalty of the law has been visited; the demands of justice have been met; and heaven and earth, beholding, declare the righteousness of Jehovah. {GC 673.1}