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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: gordonb1]
#120271
10/08/09 09:39 PM
10/08/09 09:39 PM
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OP
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Yes crater, also known as trolling and forbidden on many forums. _____ Trolling? Am I to understand that you find Asschericks preaching fits one or more of the following then? "controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages"? Controversial for some, obviously. But as the other thread shows, Asscherick is presently one of the movers of this denomination so his preaching would be considered mainstream for that reason alone. Off-topic? Hardly as it started a new topic. The post was the topic. Irrelevant? Not if you are a christian. With an intent of provoking an emotional response? Quite failed in such case. I havn't seen any emotional responses in this thread...
Galatians 2 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Rosangela]
#120272
10/08/09 09:49 PM
10/08/09 09:49 PM
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OP
Active Member 2011
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Pastor Asscherick made it clear in his message he believes Jesus declared them legally sinless though in reality they were very sinful and defective. I think he refers to the fact that Jesus said, "You are clean" before the disciples forsook Him and Peter denied Him. The point is, He knew they would do that. What about the point that you cannot ask anyone to continue doing something that they are not already doing?
Galatians 2 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: vastergotland]
#120279
10/08/09 11:41 PM
10/08/09 11:41 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Thomas,
Sorry, I didn't understand your question. Could you please clarify?
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Rosangela]
#120285
10/09/09 07:18 AM
10/09/09 07:18 AM
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OP
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Yes, the motif Asscherick gives himself for saying what he does about the cleansing.
Galatians 2 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: vastergotland]
#120290
10/09/09 11:57 AM
10/09/09 11:57 AM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Do you refer to the point at which he says, "How can you remain in Christ if you don't believe you are in Christ?"
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Rosangela]
#120293
10/09/09 12:05 PM
10/09/09 12:05 PM
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OP
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Galatians 2 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: vastergotland]
#120315
10/10/09 05:49 PM
10/10/09 05:49 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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The question is - How can it be said people are in Christ while they are in the throes of known sin?
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Mountain Man]
#120321
10/10/09 10:26 PM
10/10/09 10:26 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Are we fully conscious of our own flaws? How do you see the episode with the disciples and Jesus' words: "You are clean"?
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Rosangela]
#120323
10/10/09 11:16 PM
10/10/09 11:16 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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If we are not conscious of our cultivated sinful habits and practices, the question is - Why not? Also, what types of sins fall into this category? And, I understand "Ye are clean" in the following way: At the words, "If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with Me," Peter surrendered his pride and self-will. He could not endure the thought of separation from Christ; that would have been death to him. "Not my feet only," he said, "but also my hands and my head. Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit." {DA 646.2}
These words mean more than bodily cleanliness. Christ is still speaking of the higher cleansing as illustrated by the lower. He who came from the bath was clean, but the sandaled feet soon became dusty, and again needed to be washed. So Peter and his brethren had been washed in the great fountain opened for sin and uncleanness. Christ acknowledged them as His. But temptation had led them into evil, and they still needed His cleansing grace. When Jesus girded Himself with a towel to wash the dust from their feet, He desired by that very act to wash the alienation, jealousy, and pride from their hearts. This was of far more consequence than the washing of their dusty feet. With the spirit they then had, not one of them was prepared for communion with Christ. Until brought into a state of humility and love, they were not prepared to partake of the paschal supper, or to share in the memorial service which Christ was about to institute. Their hearts must be cleansed. Pride and self-seeking create dissension and hatred, but all this Jesus washed away in washing their feet. A change of feeling was brought about. Looking upon them, Jesus could say, "Ye are clean." Now there was union of heart, love for one another. They had become humble and teachable. Except Judas, each was ready to concede to another the highest place. Now with subdued and grateful hearts they could receive Christ's words. {DA 646.3}
Like Peter and his brethren, we too have been washed in the blood of Christ, yet often through contact with evil the heart's purity is soiled. We must come to Christ for His cleansing grace. Peter shrank from bringing his soiled feet in contact with the hands of his Lord and Master; but how often we bring our sinful, polluted hearts in contact with the heart of Christ! How grievous to Him is our evil temper, our vanity and pride! Yet all our infirmity and defilement we must bring to Him. He alone can wash us clean. We are not prepared for communion with Him unless cleansed by His efficacy. {DA 646.4}
Jesus said to the disciples, "Ye are clean, but not all." He had washed the feet of Judas, but the heart had not been yielded to Him. It was not purified. Judas had not submitted himself to Christ. {DA 649.1} "At the words, 'If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with Me,' Peter surrendered his pride and self-will." Peter confessed and crucified his sins before Jesus washed his feet. He was already "clean" when Jesus washed his feet. Of course, watching Jesus wash the feet of the other disciples contributed to his desire to confess and crucify his sins. In this sense, confession and cleansing happened simultaneously. I do not believe Jesus taught sinners are clean in the sins. He declared them clean because they were clean, that is, they had confessed and crucified their sins.
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Re: D Asscherick Sermonettes
[Re: Mountain Man]
#120326
10/11/09 12:28 AM
10/11/09 12:28 AM
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SDA Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
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The question is - How can it be said people are in Christ while they are in the throes of known sin? There is no known sin in Christ.
By God's grace, Arnold
There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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