Actually, Tom, I have learned alot about sin and death and salvation by studying with you, and the others, this topic. Though I must also admit it is not the most pleasing topic to study. The idea of God killing people and angels isn't exactly my favorite subject to study.

So, if the glory of God is a consuming fire, in the symbolic sense, rather than in a literal sense, how is it that the unsaved can stand in the presence of God, at the Great White throne, long enough to be judged and sentenced without instantly imploding on the spot? Does God have some kind of on/off switch to control His glory and fire?

Where did you get the idea that God's glory was symbolic, MM???

A sword coming out of Christ mouth and His riding a horse, now THAT is symbolic. Pregnant with meaning, but surely not literal.

I see two questions here, but the need to discuss basic elements of one factor before we start.

First, and again, MM we need to agree, if all are willing, what the definition of glory is. Is it a mindless power? Or only shininess, like in paintings of halos and light beams? Is it good or neutral? Is it God's Personhood as well as His appearance?

Then we need to see that every notch in the history of sin on this quarentined world must be met by God with the best solution for THAT problem or event. The Cross is not the burning bush or the Flood or the lake of Fire. Each problem has it's own solution, even though sin is the "black underlining" of all our history.

One is foolhardy to consider that God has no control of His own powers,or glory. He can exercise them and stop exercising them, according to His Wisdom. He is not controlled by His attributes of creative energy, but modifies them according to His wisdom and the needs of the hour. Not all "displays" of His glory, the mind-boggling vitality that maintains the orbits of billions of planets, are the same.

But power with God is goodness,personified, not unbridled kinetic energy. This may be a new idea to some.

Here is a significant example of what could be termed "reflective glory". Moses in essence was literally aglow with His goodness. Think of the brightness of the angels they never rebelled. This is also refective, as no glory is original save His.

Note the pain and fear even this borrowed type of glory caused those immersed in sin:

"The people perceive that it is the voice of Moses; that,although he is transformed and glorified, he is Moses yet. They tell him that they cannot look into his face, for the radiant light in his countenance is exceedingly painful to them. His face is like the sun; they cannot look upon it. When Moses finds out the difficulty, he covers his face with a veil. He does not plead that the light and glory upon his face is the reflection of God's glory that He placed upon him, and that the people must bear it; but he covers his glory. The sinfulness of the people make it painful to behold his glorified face. So will it be when the saints of God are glorified just previous to the second appearing of our Lord. The wicked will retire and shrink away from the sight, for the glory in the countenances of the saints will pain them. " {3T 354.3}

I think Phil's quote brings out the principle well.

The way I conceive of things, the judgment itself is God's revealing His glory. That is, they are not two separate events. God will patiently and lovingly explain to the wicked the answers to their questions, and show where during their lives He spoke to them, making appeals, acting in their lives to try to save them, protecting them from danger, and so on. This process is painful for the wicked, who I believe will misunderstand what's happening, although it will be clear to onlookers.

The best anaology I know of this is one by C. S. Lewis who in a children's tale had a lion named Aslan who represented Christ. Some children asked Aslan why he didn't comfort a bitter old man who was living by himself in a cabin. He responded that he couldn't because no matter what he did, all the old man heard was a lion roaring.

As the Spirit of Prophesy puts it, by a lifetime of rebellion the wicked for characters so out of harmony with God's character that His presence becomes to them a consuming fire. Again the quote of Phil explains it well. It's like opening the door on a bright winter day with the sun reflecting off the snow -- the light's just too bright, it's painful to look at.

The light of the glory of God, which gives life to the righteous, slays the wicked.

It's important to note that it is the same thing which gives life to the righteous which slays the wicked. The same thing, which has two different responses.

Yes, of course, God manifests His glory in many and various ways. However, this insight begs the question - How is God innocent of killing unsaved sinners if He possesses the ability to regulate the effects of His glory? If they die because He chooses not to shield them from the deadly effects of His glory doesn't that make Him directly responsible for their death? I mean, apparently their sinfulness isn't enough to cause them to burst into flames, because otherwise why does God have to consume them with His unveiled glory? In other words, why don't they just die from spontaneous combustion?

I'm not understanding your questions, MM. I explained things as I understand them as best I could above. God gives the wicked up to their choice, which is death.

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This is not an act of arbitrary power on the part of God. The rejecters of His mercy reap that which they have sown. God is the fountain of life; and when one chooses the service of sin, he separates from God, and thus cuts himself off from life. He is "alienated from the life of God." Christ says, "All they that hate Me love death." Eph. 4:18; Prov. 8:36. (DA 764)

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If our sins cut us off from the source of life - why don't we die right now? What does the glory of God have to do with the death of the unsaved in the lake of fire?

“Man had sinned, and it was necessary that he learn what the wages of sin are, and that God does not arbitrarily decree death because of transgression, but that death is wrapped up with sin itself…Probation is therefore God’s solution to the problem of giving men continued existence though they had violated the law of life. It is a day of grace granted all, during which time God does not impute to him their sins but does all that love can contrive to win them back to obedience. ” M.L. Andreasen, “The Book of Hebrews”, page 285,296

If the second death is the natural consequences of sinning, then why does God have to regulate His glory in order not to kill them? Also, why did God have to prevent them from eating from the tree of life? How could a sinner regularly eat the fruit from the tree of life and "live forever" if the wages of sin is death? And, why does God have to resurrect the unsaved? Is it required that they die by being exposed to God's unshielded glory?

MM:If the second death is the natural consequences of sinning, then why does God have to regulate His glory in order not to kill them?

Tom: The very reason that sin inevitably results in death is because those who have resisted God's Spirit have formed characters so out of harmony with God's character that His very presence becomes to them a consuming fire. This is spelled out very clearly in DA 764.

MM; Also, why did God have to prevent them from eating from the tree of life?

Tom: For the same reason He allowed them to eat meat after the flood. In mercy, He did not want man's life to be perpetuated too long.

MM: How could a sinner regularly eat the fruit from the tree of life and "live forever" if the wages of sin is death?

Tom: Sin results in death when God reveals His glory to men. Even to Moses, who was as close to God as anyone, God could not reveal His glory directly, because it would have killed Moses. This was explained to Moses in Ex. 33. So the conclusion is the only reason man is not destroyed immediately is that God does not reveal His glory to him. This really has nothing whatsoever to do with the tree of life, which has special healing powers.

MM; And, why does God have to resurrect the unsaved?

Tom: This is an excellent question which I have asked myself. I can't remember if it's been asked on this forum. You could post it as a topic, as it's worth discussion.

MM; Is it required that they die by being exposed to God's unshielded glory?

Tom: Same comment. Good question, which deserves its own topic, IMO.