We should always remember "the wheat and tares grow together until the harvest” but why would God want tares to be in the church? He does not delight in the destruction of the wicked, and we should do everything we can to correct an exhort those who have fallen or have not found the path. We are not supposed to rip them out before the harvest, but God never said we are to accept them or their teachings either.

It's not like God is saying "we should make peace with the tares", we are to acknowledge they are going to be there until the end, and we are supposed to warn them. It is our duty to warn them, but so many people have become numb to what should and should not be accepted in our church.

In some congregations the tares have taken over, but the true remnant church is not forsaken, those who sigh and cry for the abominations done in the sanctuary will be those who are empowered in the last days to warn the world.

It is not a sin to defend our faith or the words given to our prophet. It is a sin to speak against the Spirit of Prophecy. Those who claim to be leaders or teachers in our faith who do not accept the testimonies to the church are going to suffer like no one else in the end, so it is our duty to warn them.

Peace.

The testimonies are the Spirit of Prophecy. They are the unique message of the church that fulfilled the great disappointment. The Spirit of Prophecy is the testimony of Jesus.

I know I'm out on a limb here, but does no one else see this as a bit self-serving? -- "I am the testimony of Jesus, and if you ignore what I say God will cast you out of his kingdom."

It seems more like a way of controlling the adherents than a message from God.

I remember pointing this out to a friend long ago. I saw that this is a very convenient "prophecy" for EGW. If you believe her, great. If you don't believe her, you should repent because her prophecies came true. It's definitely a win-win.

However, that does not make the statement false. Consider this statement: Those who are bad at math will question my statement that e^(i^i) is a real number. Either a person believes that I know what I'm talking about, or they will not believe me and prove that what I said is correct. Either way, I "win." Nevertheless, my statement is true.

But your paraphrase is not correct. She didn't say, "If you ignore what I say God will cast you out of his kingdom." She said, "Whoever Satan deceives will give up the testimonies." It's a matter of cause and effect, and is a crucial distinction.

We should always view the matter from the perspective of God. What more could He have done to warn and correct the world?

He truly loves us so much, even though we have all gone astray, even though every one of us has persecuted and abused the Son of God who has already come as the perfect example.

God gave His word to the world and we all could have received the understanding if we prayed and asked for His wisdom then in faith received forgiveness of sins and wisdom from above. But He saw how many would not understand because of the darkness and confusion that would fill the church, so He sent a messenger who could interpret the sticky points that God saw Satan using to distract and confuse.

Mrs White was not an intellectual genius, she admitted to not even understanding many of the things in scripture that her husband could understand, but as soon as the elders ran into an obstacle that could have been a dividing point among the brethren, God would give Mrs White a vision or dream that would interpret the scripture for them. This is the same today for the true remnant.

I was looking for the promise God gave me in 1995, but because of my past I was confused and God saw the need to give me direction in truth, so He gave me a direct sign that the Sabbath was the true day of rest. No man did it for me, only His Spirit through scripture and His unction led me to the truth. The same day He led me to the SDA church. A week later I was fully embracing the writings of Ellen White because God showed me that she was guided by the same Spirit that led me to the Sabbath.

No man could ever change my mind about the testimonies because of how God led me to her inspired writings. God gave me visions and dreams that were exactly like her writings, only I saw the dream first, then read her stuff and found those same images, like God used an established prophet to reach my soul deeper than any other way.

I had a dream of being on board a train heading to the end of the world, then I told it to a brother in the SDA church God had just led me to, and then he shows me EGW's dream of the whole world on board a train heading to the end of the world and it solidified the dream God gave me. I could never forget it if I tried.

God always sends a prophet to receive the truth that other prophets wrote about, to put it together, proving it through scripture so they can teach others. This is what God used Mrs White for. But Mrs White also received words from God beyond what scripture put into words. Everything in the Spirit of Prophecy (testimony of Jesus), the inspired writings of Mrs White, are in perfect harmony with scriptures earlier Spirit of Prophecy, but those words are amplified. God fills in the blanks that were not fully included in the bible. The Spirit of those inspired words is in scripture already, the foundation laid and main context illustrated so when we would receive the Spirit of Prophecy we would have all the proof we need to receive it as from God. God prophesied the handmaiden who would prophecy, and that was fulfilled during the time of the great disappointment when the sealed chapters of Daniel would be partially comprehended. God sent the handmaiden to comprehend what everyone else was stumbling over.

That is where the dividing comes. Most Men do not see the importance of rightly dividing the word of truth. They hold on to their superstitions or tradition and they try to fit God into their box. My God is begging to show us more than anyone has ever seen of His mercy. But men will not listen.

When men receive the words of truth with disdain and do not try to test the Spirit of Truth, they cut themselves off from the source of life. That is why Mrs Whites warns us about rejecting the testimonies.

Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God; correct? Every single person inside the SDA church who disputes the testimonies are approaching the issue like the words are from Mrs White. They say "Her writings"... But God is the one gave those visions and dreams, just like He gave John the book of the Revelation of Jesus. Would anyone here say those are Johns writings? They are from his pen, but God gave the words, just like He gave the interpretation of those words to Mrs White.

To me that is in perfect fulfillment of prophetic guidance.

Now I get the benefit of her being guided by the Spirit to find the meanings of scriptures I have a hard time understanding.

I believe her writings are from God so perfectly that if I had a belief that was contrary to her writings and it were shown to me, it would immediately change my perspective on the subject and I would repent. There is some room for debate over unfulfilled elements of the testimonies, but very soon there will be no room for debate. The fulfillment will have come and everyone who received the truth will see.

asygo, it matters not how one paraphrases it. The result is the same.

It matters a great deal. Eternal destinies hang in the balance when cause is confused with effect.

1. The obedient will have eternal life.
2. Those with eternal life will be obedient.

If you think the two are equivalent, I must disagree.

I have no idea what you are talking about.

Wow that's strong language James. Have you tested the EGW 3 angels message thoroughly with all scriptures? If not, then you have failed you solemn duty as EGW and the Lord told us.

How did this discussion been diverted to EGW? Sorry I haven't followed this discussion.

What happen if Ellen White was sent to test all of us whether we would follow the Lord and be obedient to Him. This is one reason the Lord sents prophets according to what He said in Deut 13:1

If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, 2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; 3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him. 5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

Notice the test of a prophet is NOT if the signs comes to pass or having visions, but to test whether we can distinguish if she or he talks according to what the Lord has previously reveal.

What happens if EGW was sent to test you and me if you will be obedient to the Lord in testing whatever she said against the word of the Lord. This is what Deut 13 says.

Let's be very honest....I haven't seen many being obedient to the word of the Lord by testing every word she has said. The Church leaders has not done this work either and even teaches to stone anybody that dare test the words of EGW. We teach in our church that virtually ALL the word of EGW are infallible. Even I have seen many uphold EGW writings above scriptures when it is in contradiction.

EGW and James told us not to quote her and that it was our solemn duty to test all things with scriptures.

Everything Mrs White wrote under inspiration of God was in light of the present truth of her day.

There will be many things that are expounded upon but NONE of the foundational pillars of our faith will EVER change. Even the dissapointments of our church were prophesied by God in scripture. There will never be a change to what God has established through the Spirit of Prophecy. There are many unanswered questions but all of the evidence is there waiting for God to reveal the truth.

God told Mrs White that He was behind the great dissapointment. That HE put His hand over certain texts that would have discouraged them in their persuit of the three angels messages. It was foretold in prophecy, But God never sends us a prophet and uses them to test His people through lies, He sends them to correct and exhort and reproove, to draw other closer to Him through truth.

He does not test us by lies and He always warns us before allowing us to make wrong interpretations. Do you see any more such dissapointments recorded in prophecy?

The only thing that is left is the shaking, and the revelation of the mystery of Godliness through the 144,000 durring the loud cry. God will never put us through a dissapointment again because our message is not suspended on "time" any longer. There are signs to watch not a callendar.