APL, you are incapable of grasping the truth as long as you adhere so stringently to your definitions which are too narrow. You would think that God is a hater (maybe even "the" hater) because He hates sin. You would think that God is a destroyer (maybe even "the" destroyer) because He has destroyed. You would think God is a/the punisher because He punishes. You would think God is "the" jealous one, because He says He is Jealous. You would consider God is a/the meat eater, because Jesus ate fish. You would think God is many things that He isn't, just because He's ever done it once.

The Bible is not to be interpreted as you do. You wrest the scriptures to make them teach things that they never said. God is not a meat eater. But God has eaten meat. God is not a destroyer, but He has and will destroy. I don't know how to explain these things to one who is so closed toward the broad and balanced truths of the Word of God. When prideful opinion puts blinders upon the eyes to make them see only what is wont to be seen, how can anyone assist in taking the blinders off?

God inspired Mrs. White to tell us more about God. The Bible and Mrs. White are both clear that sinners will be destroyed by the brightness of His coming. When that happens, I think your eyes will see what you have refused to see hitherto, and perhaps only then. Unfortunately, that will be too late to affect your eternal destiny. May God open your eyes to see before it's too late is my prayer.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

GREEN <> APL

APL, you are incapable of grasping the truth as long as you adhere so stringently to your definitions which are too narrow. You would think that God is a hater (maybe even "the" hater) because He hates sin. <sounds like you are defining yourself> You would think that God is a destroyer (maybe even "the" destroyer) because He has destroyed. <you think God is "a" destroyer. God destroys NO man> You would think God is a/the punisher because He punishes. <You think God is the one who executes pusnishment, but the judgments of God do not come directly from Him, but he leave the those that reject Him to themselves to reap that which they have sown> You would think God is "the" jealous one, because He says He is Jealous. You would consider God is a/the meat eater, because Jesus ate fish. You would think God is many things that He isn't, just because He's ever done it once.

The Bible is not to be interpreted as you do. You wrest the scriptures to make them teach things that they never said. God is not a meat eater. But God has eaten meat. God is not a destroyer, but He has and will destroy. I don't know how to explain these things to one who is so closed toward the broad and balanced truths of the Word of God. <You can't explain it because you won't see it. You are rejecting the truth as it is in Jesus> When prideful opinion puts blinders upon the eyes to make them see only what is wont to be seen, how can anyone assist in taking the blinders off? <DO take the blinders off and see God as revealed by Jesus!>

God inspired Mrs. White to tell us more about God. The Bible and Mrs. White are both clear that sinners will be destroyed by the brightness of His coming. When that happens, I think your eyes will see what you have refused to see hitherto, and perhaps only then. Unfortunately, that will be too late to affect your eternal destiny. May God open your eyes to see before it's too late is my prayer. < you are right - I don't see God as you see Him, that it clear. Look to the LAMB. The truth is that I know that sinners will die. Sin will be irradicated. What you don't like is the method God uses to do this. You can't believe that force is not part of God's government. Compelling power is found only under Satan's government. That really seems to irk you. Why???>

APL,

I noticed you didn't deny that God is a meat eater. Your reasoning of "if God has ever done something, it makes Him have said identity" forces the conclusion that you believe God is a meat-eater. It is this same unbalanced form of logic, which is not true to reality, nor to the Scriptures, which forces you to reject the fact that God has ever or will ever punish sinners. The discussion of this thread, so far as you're concerned, has been in vain.

I'm truly sorry. Enjoy your meat-eating God. My God is not a meat-eater. I am able to distinguish between acts of God which He does of necessity, not of desire, and the character of God which is behind those actions. Why did God eat meat? Why does He punish? The answer to both of those questions is more closely related than you may understand or admit. A single or occasional act does not force an identity all to one side. Such "all or none" thinking is unbalanced, and irresponsible in terms of understanding Scripture.

God has, does, and will punish. He says so Himself. Mrs. White asks the question regarding this very thing "Who will say God will not do what He says He will do?" She predicted that people would come teaching what you have been teaching here, APL. You are a fulfillment of prophecy.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

How does God punish? You say, by direct action. Yes EGW you can claim to believe says, "God destroys no man". She is speaking of direct action. "the judgments of God would not come directly out from the Lord upon them, but in this way: They place themselves beyond His protection. He warns, corrects, reproves, and points out the only path of safety; then if those who have been the objects of His special care will follow their own course independent of the Spirit of God, after repeated warnings, if they choose their own way, then He does not commission His angels to prevent Satan's decided attacks upon them"

She says, "Lord will do just what He has declared that He would--He will withdraw His blessings from the earth and remove His protecting care from those who are rebelling against His law and teaching and forcing others to do the same." Teaching contrary to the 10C is rebelling against the law of God, and this includes the 6th. Sinner die, they die because of sin, sin pays it wage.

APL,

You put words in my mouth, and in Mrs. White's mouth, that do not belong. Mrs. White, like the Bible, must be interpreted properly. She does say "God destroys no man." She also says things like "God destroyed the people with the waters of a great flood, and rained fire and death upon the wicked cities; but the great adversary was still free to pursue his scheme of demoralization." And... "This rainbow was to evidence the fact to all generations that God destroyed the inhabitants of the earth by a flood, because of their great wickedness."

But you cannot accept the truth of those passages. You have to wrest them to say things that they never were intended to mean.

My personal view? I believe God is "actively withdrawing His own presence" in order that we are NOT destroyed/consumed as in a moment by His wrath. There will come a time when He will cease His withdrawal, and release His glory. Then, sin and sinners will be consumed. God is waiting, with longing desire, for us to repent of our sinfulness before He must do this.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

I'll summarize some more points of this discussion later, when I have time.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Green <> APL

You put words in my mouth, and in Mrs. White's mouth, that do not belong. Mrs. White, like the Bible, must be interpreted properly. She does say "God destroys no man." She also says things like "God destroyed the people with the waters of a great flood, and rained fire and death upon the wicked cities; but the great adversary was still free to pursue his scheme of demoralization." And... "This rainbow was to evidence the fact to all generations that God destroyed the inhabitants of the earth by a flood, because of their great wickedness."

But you cannot accept the truth of those passages. <you can't accept the fact that sin is what causes destruction, not God. When men pass divine forbearance, God withdraws and lets the natural consequences of sin go forth> You have to wrest them to say things that they never were intended to mean. <actually one has to do mental gymnastics to that God is the destroyer when He destroys no man. Men are destroyed, but how is God involved?>

My personal view? <personal view of the SOP/Biblical view? When taken as a whole, the Bible and SOP fits what I have been saying> I believe God is "actively withdrawing His own presence" <that is an interesting twist of words - first time you used that combination> in order that we are NOT destroyed/consumed as in a moment by His wrath. <I still do not think you understand what God's wrath is, have you read Romans 1 recently?> There will come a time when He will cease His withdrawal, and release His glory. Then, sin and sinners will be consumed. God is waiting, with longing desire, for us to repent of our sinfulness before He must do this. <before he kills us?>

If you think they were not, why did you say:
What women and children were you referring to?


I did not see where you supported with scripture and EGW that the snakes bit specific Jews.
Would you be disagree with Ellen White saying the Father was revealed in Christ?

In what way did satan represent the Father employing water and fire to punish sinners?

APL, how do you justify Jesus permitting evil men and/or evil angels to murder innocent men, women, and children?

APL, you have not explained the lake of fire or how sinners will destroy themselves in it. Is the fire literal? Or, is it symbolic?