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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75096
06/12/06 04:07 PM
06/12/06 04:07 PM
C
Colin  Offline
Active Member 2012
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
Quote:

In an attempt to answer the question in my previous post, Sunday's study properly looks at why Christ came to this earth, which is to save sinners, which all of us are, therefore, Christ came to this earth to save all of us from the penalty of sin, which is the second death, the eternal death, from which there is no resurrection.

In light of this, what then would blasphemy against the Holy Ghost be?

Perhaps, another good question would also be, what is the purpose or function of the Holy Spirit in connection with Christ's purpose?


Christ saved mankind from its sinfulness and from the Devil's power over that sinfulness; the Spirit convicts the world of those truths and achievements.

It is practically possible to distance oneself from God till one doesn't want to hear him anymore, but that isn't even effectively blaspheming the Holy Spirit - that's just being obstinate about grace. The unforgiveable sin of blaspheming the Spirit is attributing its work to the Devil, isn't it?

Can grace not preclude forgiveness for such an assertion? - is it not the divine equivalent of treason down here?

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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75097
06/12/06 09:55 PM
06/12/06 09:55 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Having had a long thought on this subject, I have to change what I said. I have heard that rejecting Gods calling long enough would eventually immunize a person from hearing it again. I still think that the main understanding of blasphemy against the spirit would be attributing His actions to the devil.

/Thomas


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75098
06/12/06 10:49 PM
06/12/06 10:49 PM
C
Colin  Offline
Active Member 2012
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
Yes, resisting God's call is what most Adventists think, but the real thing is much more serious than that - from both points of view!...

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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75099
06/12/06 11:03 PM
06/12/06 11:03 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Would you explain?

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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75100
06/13/06 05:05 AM
06/13/06 05:05 AM
D
Dr.Glenn  Offline
Full Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 104
Nevada
Quote:

The following is the memory text for this week's study:

Quote:


"Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: but he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation" (Mark 3: 28, 29).




What is this blasphemy against the Holy Ghost in which there isn't any forgiveness? I read two lines of thought here. Which one is it, or is it both?



Matthew 12:28 says: "But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you".
So, by whose spirit did Jesus cast out devils? By the Spirit of his Father? By his own Spirit? or by the spirit of a third god called "God the Holy Spirit"?
Today's lesson states: "However, by refusing to admit to Christ's divinity, and by actively opposing Him, these men had placed themselves in such a position that they were forced to explain His works on some other grounds than divine and hence assigned to Satan the works of God."
Now, who is really refusing to admit to Christ's divinity? Those who advocate the trinity doctrine or those who advocate the doctrine of the pioneers of the SDA church including Mrs. E. G. White?
Now, those who advocate the trinity doctrine state that Christ's divinity or divine person comes from himself and not from his Father because Christ in his divine person is NOT really the literal only begotten Son of his Father who is the only true God. Those who advocate the trinity doctrine say that Christ is 100% divine like the Father is 100% divine. They admit that the Father is 100% divine and is invisible to humans and is in every place all at the same time. But, they say that Christ is also 100% divine, but he is not like the Father and is not invisible and cannot be in every place all at the same time. So, then how can they claim that Christ in his divine person is 100% God just like the Father is 100% God?
Those who do NOT advocate the trinity doctrine also claim that Christ is 100% divine in his divine person and in his divine person he is invisible to humans and is every place all at the same time just like the Father because Christ is the literal only begotten Son of his Father in his divine person and he is what is known as the "Holy Spirit" or the "Comforter".
So, which of these two groups is really refusing to admit to Christ's divinity?


grw
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75101
06/13/06 05:55 AM
06/13/06 05:55 AM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Dr Glenn, maybe it would be easier if you did your homework on the position your not agreeing with and stoped making strawmen to burn..


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75102
06/13/06 01:21 PM
06/13/06 01:21 PM
D
Dr.Glenn  Offline
Full Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 104
Nevada
Quote:

Dr Glenn, maybe it would be easier if you did your homework on the position your not agreeing with and stoped making strawmen to burn..



HELLO:
How many times have you read the chapters in the book "Seventh-day Adventist Believe" that deal with the godhead or trinity? I have read them about 5 times.
How many times have you read the book "The Trinity" by Whidden, Reeve, and Moon? I have read it twice cover to cover.
Have many times have you read the introductory studies and the further stuidies on www.acts321.org? I have read through each of these studies at least once.
Is there something else you want me to read?


grw
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75103
06/13/06 01:55 PM
06/13/06 01:55 PM
Darius  Offline
Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
Quote:

Darius,

I am getting tired of these type of posts, and I don't think I am alone. I think others are also getting tired of these type of posts you are posting.

If you continue to show that you can't contribute better than this, we may need to remove your ability to post.

This isn't the first time I have sounded out a warning note, therefore, I hope you will take heed of yet another warning.

I think some here have placed you on their ingore posts list, which is the only reason why I haven't acted yet.

If I receive enough personal complaints about your posts, I will regretfully act.


And as the owner of this list it is your right to. This is the year 2006. Discussing what we continue to do cannot be better than trying to figure out why it is that what we are doing is ineffective. I am sorry you are offended by posts that are designed to get to the rest of the story. How is the world benefitted from Christians continually discussing the different ways in which they are wrong? This is not the first time that these topics are being discussed in SS. We keep going over old ground and making no progress. This is not the best use of the intelligence we were given by our Creator. Putting me on ignore or banning me again will not change reality. We can bask in our ignorance or break out of it. The choice is ours. In the meantime the world continues to suffer.


Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75104
06/13/06 04:58 PM
06/13/06 04:58 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian
OP
Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,122
Nova Scotia, Canada
I copied this from Monday's study:

Quote:


However, by refusing to admit Christ's divinity, and by actively opposing Him, these men had placed themselves in such a position that they were forced to explain His works on some other grounds than divine and, hence, assigned to Satan the work of God. They thereby closed their minds to the evidence of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit impresses truth upon the mind and heart (John 14:17, 16:13) and convicts of sin (John 16:8). But although God is long-suffering and merciful and not willing that any should perish (2 Pet. 3:9), His Spirit will not labor with the obdurate heart indefinitely (Gen. 6:3). If truth is persistently resisted and refused, the Spirit's promptings cease to be heard, and the soul is left in terrible darkness.




Wouldn't what I bolded in the above quote constitute the unpardonable sin, or as the Bible says, blasphemy against the Holy Spirit from which there isn't any forgiveness?


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
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Re: Lesson Study #12 - The Sin Against The HOLY SPIRIT #75105
06/13/06 09:47 PM
06/13/06 09:47 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Uhm, what about the bible?

Quote:


Phi 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phi 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phi 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Phi 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Phi 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
Phi 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
Phi 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.





Jesus cast out devils by the Spirit of His Father becourse Jesus had laid down divine authority when being born a human. (Dont ask me how it is done, I just read that it says so here and therefore count it true.)
You are right, I have not the slightest idea what those books you mention says about anything. That I called your argument strawman is entierly due to how I find it in contrast with the bible. Which by the way is the main authority on any theological question (this so since we are even called to test the spirits by its word, so prophesy or vision are both subject to scripture.)

/Thomas


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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