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The other question is this; why is it that the default position for humans with regards to choice is usually evil?
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Selfishness is our nature inherit from Adam ever since he sinned in Eden where he lost “the glory of God”, the agape love of God created in him.

Selfishness is then contrary to agape, the love that seeks no self in it.

We then have a heart that is selfish, and a sinful nature, as Paul said “the sin is in our members.”

But through the miracle of rebirth or baptism, we might have a new heart, free of self, but still a sinful nature, which would be changed at Christ 2nd coming if we remain faithful.

With a new heart free of self, and a life after the Spirit, our default is no longer evil for our carnal mind that is enmity against God has been taken away.

But looking to my own experience, after many years since receiving a new heart, I elapsed again in my former default. How could it happen? Many factors involved, but I think the most important factor is I gradually averted my eyes from Jesus to self, and at last, I became a selfish man again.

In His love

James S

“For to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.” Romans 7:18.

This means, I have a free will, but by default I could only do evil, even I want to do good. I don’t have the power to do the thing I will, which is good.
Since I could only do evil no matter my will is doing what is good (in the sight of God), I may say, I have no free will, because my will is under enslavement of sin. My heart is selfish, my will is selfish, I could not seek to be unselfish and act accordingly.

A selfish heart gives way to selfish desires; does it have freedom of choice to do accordingly to what it chooses? If you could only do evil no matter what you choose, does it mean you have a free will? I have no free will, the will that is present with me is willing to do one way only, for my own benefit, to seek for my own, it could do nothing else.

In His love

James S

I just can have another will and could perform it when God through His Spirit impart or implant in me his will and by His power and my will to follow it, I could perform what I and He will.

In His love

James S

thanks for your answers to the questions I posed, I have heard them before and would say they are godtalk in a sense, what I mean is that they sound good, have a spiritual tone but don't really clarify or explain the issue...

my personal take is that if our nature's are corrupt then we cannot have free will because we will always choose selfishly... it does not make sense that one choice would change human nature so dramatically. Likewise, the concept of being born again many have found it difficult if not impossible to grasp, and I say that because if people did understand it there would not be as many rebaptisms as there are....

Since God is creator and sustainer of life it seems that from the very start Jesus' statement to the disciples makes sense, i.e. without me you can do nothing.... so is it a matter of being born again or one's mindset being changed... Saul zealous in killing christians, is now Paul zealous to preach the gospel of Christ... did his nature change or did his mindset change?

Being born again *is* one's mindset being changed, so it's not a matter of either or.

It's really not a difficult thing at all. God wants us to spend eternity with Him, starting now. We, because of sin, are unable to, or ourselves, be in harmony with Him. We cannot make ourselves be good (we've all tried).

But God is able to change our mindset, to use your phrase, so that we can both desire and do that which is in harmony with God. All we need do is respond to His drawing. That's it.

If we respond to His drawing, He will so transform us that we can do His will, and more than that, we will want to do His will!

Great subject and discussion!

Aren't we born captive to sin? God works to restore our freedom and Satan works to make us captive through addiction to sin.

That would mean to me that I am not born with a free will. As much as the carnal man wants to do good his selfishness defaults his actions.

Before Adam sinned humanity had a free will. We could choose to do anything that is good or bad, but our desire was to do good. Our default was to be kind and selfless. We were made in our Fathers image (God's character). Once Adam sinned he became sin's captive. This simply means that Adam's mind became corrupted with self and Adam gave up the power to choose to be unselfish. Now all the children of Adam can do is summed up in the term, "survival of the fittest."

God wants to restore our freedom and therefore demonstrated love divine through the life, death, and resurrection of Christ. When we see that love we are called by God's Spirit to respond. We either fall in love with God or we see the cross as a weakness and we despise it. If we fall in love with what we in Christ then we desire to be like Him and we are set right or justified.

God then gives us His Spirit and through our interaction with Him our minds are changed and our freedom is restored. I can choose to rebel anytime I want, but why would I choose to do something that will destroy my freedom. We are changed by the renewing of our minds. Through our connection with God in a personal relationship we begin to think like He thinks and the things that seemed so important to us when we belonged to the world just fade away. Christ delivers us from our bondage and sets us free to choose again. This time we will choose in the full knowledge of the love of God.

When we fall we have a friend who picks us up, wipes us off, and sets us free again. God is awesome!

In Christ, scott

Not responding to anyone in particular. Just some thoughts.

Does: “if I cannot do what I want to do, then I do not have a free will” mean that I do not have a free will?

So a free will would mean that whatever I wish happens. Interesting concept of “free will”. It reminds me sort of a ‘genie’.

This is not the scriptural concept of the will, and its function. Nor is that the concept of salvation. I think we need to consider the scriptural concept and function of the will, and do that which God is asking of us.

A free will means that I am able to think, wish, will, long for and desire, outside of my capabilities. A will that is not free would only reflect the chemical bodily functions, and hence would be the will of the body.

Are we that low that we regard our will simply the outworking of the flesh?
Or, is there a meaningful controversy going on? Is there any spirit left?

I can only respond to this question from my own experience as a Christian. I have been a SDA Christian now for a little over six years, even though I was raised SDA I did not accept Jesus as my savior until I was fifty.

What I have found is that God never will force my actions, or thoughts. Satan on the other hand is all about forcing us to do his will. God wants our obedience; however, we must freely give Him that obedience of our own free will. Jesus in John 8 makes this very clear when he talks about those who sin are slaves to sin.

Satan in contrast to God will accept our service any way he can. For example, say one has a problem with over eating. The individual has surrendered their heart to Jesus, and stating that they are willing to belong totally to Jesus. Then they are tempted to over eat and fall, and do not attempt at true heartfelt confession and turning away from sin. Satan has them; all he needs to do is ensure that they do not totally surrender to Jesus.

I believe that the only aspect of free will that we have is to whom we surrender. Going back to the words of Jesus regarding sin in John 8, from what He is saying it appears that we can be either a slave of Satan or a slave of |Jesus. All of the New Testament writers call themselves the bondservants of Christ. Again, referring to my own Christian walk this seems to be the case.

John

Before we are born again we cannot exercise our will to develop the fruits of the Spirit. But when we are born again, however, we can yield it to Jesus, who returns it us purified and refined. As such, we can exercise our will to work the works of God.

2MCP 694
You cannot control your impulses, your emotions, as you may desire; but you can control the will, and you can make an entire change in your life. By yielding up your will to Christ, your life will be hid with Christ in God and allied to the power which is above all principalities and powers. {2MCP 694.2}

2MCP 691
The Spirit of God does not propose to do our part, either in the willing or the doing. This is the work of the human agent in cooperating with the divine agencies. As soon as we incline our will to harmonize with God's will, the grace of Christ stands to cooperate with the human agent; but it will not be the substitute to do our work independent of our resolving and decidedly acting. {2MCP 691.3}

2MCP 693
God does not design that our will should be destroyed, for it is only through its exercise that we can accomplish what He would have us do. Our will is to be yielded to Him that we may receive it again, purified and refined, and so linked in sympathy with the Divine that He can pour through us the tides of His love and power.--MB 61, 62 (1896). {2MCP 693.4}

What is the difference between "power of will" and "power of self-control"?

2MCP 689
Strength of character consists of two things--power of will and power of self-control. Many youth mistake strong, uncontrolled passion for strength of character, but the truth is that he who is mastered by his passions is a weak man. The real greatness and nobility of the man is measured by the power of the feelings that he subdues, not by the power of the feelings that subdue him. The strongest man is he who, while sensitive to abuse, will yet restrain passion and forgive his enemies. Such men are true heroes.--4T 656 (1881). {2MCP 689.1}

2MCP 691
The power of the will and the importance of self-control, both in the preservation and in the recovery of health, the depressing and even ruinous effect of anger, discontent, selfishness, or impurity and, on the other hand, the marvelous life-giving power to be found in cheerfulness, unselfishness, gratitude, should also be shown.--Ed 197 (1903). {2MCP 691.2}