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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: Johann] #82646
12/17/06 04:20 AM
12/17/06 04:20 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
How many covenants bring us eternal life?


One, called the New Covenant, Abrahamic Covenant, and/or Covenant of Grace.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: asygo] #82647
12/17/06 07:26 AM
12/17/06 07:26 AM
asygo  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: Johann
How many covenants bring us eternal life?
One, called the New Covenant, Abrahamic Covenant, and/or Covenant of Grace.


Have we ever broken that covenant? Since the covenant is made with individuals, the question can only be answered individually.

If you have ever been in a lost condition (i.e. without eternal life), then you have broken that covenant.

The good news is that the covenant can be re-established. If you want to figure out if you have re-established the covenant, then just ask God to reveal to you if you are receiving the blessings of the covenant (see Galatians, Hebrews, and Titus for the covenant's blessings). Since God always fulfills His end of the deal, if you are not receiving those blessings, then you are not fulfilling your end of the deal -> no covenant for you.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: asygo] #82648
12/17/06 07:47 AM
12/17/06 07:47 AM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: Johann
How many covenants bring us eternal life?
One, called the New Covenant, Abrahamic Covenant, and/or Covenant of Grace.


Have we ever broken that covenant? Since the covenant is made with individuals, the question can only be answered individually.

If you have ever been in a lost condition (i.e. without eternal life), then you have broken that covenant.

The good news is that the covenant can be re-established. If you want to figure out if you have re-established the covenant, then just ask God to reveal to you if you are receiving the blessings of the covenant (see Galatians, Hebrews, and Titus for the covenant's blessings). Since God always fulfills His end of the deal, if you are not receiving those blessings, then you are not fulfilling your end of the deal -> no covenant for you.


How do I break that covenant?

When and how do I have eternal life?

Last edited by Johann; 12/17/06 07:51 AM.

"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: Johann] #82649
12/17/06 08:53 AM
12/17/06 08:53 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
How do I break that covenant?

When and how do I have eternal life?


Here's how to have eternal life: "He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life." (1Jn 5:12)

Here's when you can have eternal life: "For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him." (Romans 6:5-9)

Here's how to break the covenant: "For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it." (Matthew 16:25)


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
Reply Quote
Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: asygo] #82651
12/17/06 09:47 AM
12/17/06 09:47 AM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: Johann
How do I break that covenant?

When and how do I have eternal life?


Here's how to have eternal life: "He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life." (1Jn 5:12)

Here's when you can have eternal life: "For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him." (Romans 6:5-9)

Here's how to break the covenant: "For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it." (Matthew 16:25)


Wonderfful assuarances, Arnold, and taken right from Scripture, and that is our faith on which we can rely.

Matt. 16:25 states that life is not given by our desire alone. Our life must be deposited completely with Jesus, and then we are in His covenant of eternal life.

Eternal Life? But when do we become immortal? Are the angels immortal?


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: Johann] #82654
12/17/06 10:21 AM
12/17/06 10:21 AM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Originally Posted By: Johann
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: Johann
How many covenants bring us eternal life?
One, called the New Covenant, Abrahamic Covenant, and/or Covenant of Grace.


Have we ever broken that covenant? Since the covenant is made with individuals, the question can only be answered individually.

If you have ever been in a lost condition (i.e. without eternal life), then you have broken that covenant.

The good news is that the covenant can be re-established. If you want to figure out if you have re-established the covenant, then just ask God to reveal to you if you are receiving the blessings of the covenant (see Galatians, Hebrews, and Titus for the covenant's blessings). Since God always fulfills His end of the deal, if you are not receiving those blessings, then you are not fulfilling your end of the deal -> no covenant for you.


How do I break that covenant?

When and how do I have eternal life?
Johanns question is good. Is not this covenant almost more like a promise? God saying, this I will do for you.


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: vastergotland] #82771
12/19/06 12:27 AM
12/19/06 12:27 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: västergötland
Is not this covenant almost more like a promise? God saying, this I will do for you.


It is a promise, but it is conditional. "I will do this for you if you ..."

God promises to give eternal life to those who meet the conditions. Unfortunately, as Jesus said, most people will choose to go down the road of destruction.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
Reply Quote
Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: asygo] #82856
12/19/06 10:27 PM
12/19/06 10:27 PM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: västergötland
Is not this covenant almost more like a promise? God saying, this I will do for you.


It is a promise, but it is conditional. "I will do this for you if you ..."

God promises to give eternal life to those who meet the conditions. Unfortunately, as Jesus said, most people will choose to go down the road of destruction.


By what means can I break this covenant? I'd like to have a more specific answer than the one given in the text. Is there another text which describes this?


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
Reply Quote
Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: Johann] #82861
12/19/06 11:02 PM
12/19/06 11:02 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
By what means can I break this covenant? I'd like to have a more specific answer than the one given in the text. Is there another text which describes this?


Here are a few more texts. Compare and contrast them to see what the conditions are for life and death. Broken covenant = death.

John 17:3 - And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

1 John 5:12 - He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.

1 John 3:9 - Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

Ezekiel 18:20 - The soul who sins shall die.

Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 5:24 - Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Luke 13:27 - Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.

Matthew 19:17 - But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Romans 6:8 - Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,

Romans 6:3-4 - Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: Lesson Study #11 - Jacob Becomes Israel [Re: asygo] #82877
12/20/06 09:48 AM
12/20/06 09:48 AM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
So perfect performance in avoiding sin is the key?


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Reply Quote
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