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Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #122502
12/30/09 04:11 PM
12/30/09 04:11 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Mark, do you think Ellen White knew we would still be here 100 years after her passing? And, do you think these 100 years are accounted for in prophecy? If so, why did she continue to believe Jesus' return was imminent? Seems to me the next prophetic event she was waiting for was Sunday Laws. Next would follow the shaking, sealing, latter rain, loud cry, etc.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Charity] #122517
12/31/09 07:14 AM
12/31/09 07:14 AM
dedication  Online Content
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Originally Posted By: Mark Shipowick
I've found that generally those who allow for future applications have greater urgency in their message and their appeal to be prepared than those who take a purely historical approach.

The SOP says that it is when we as a church understand the end time prophecises of Daniel and Revelation better that we'll see a great revival. If the truths presented by say Uriah Smith were enough to enlighten and revive the church, why urge us to study and search for greater light.

Ellen White herself knew much more about the prophecies that we give her credit for. There are many statements in her writings showing greater understanding and insight than her peers. Historicists and in fact all of us unfortunately tend to ignore them or interpret them to fit our views. So she repeated urges us to come to scripture with a prayerful attitude and opened mind.


I agree -- that a deeper study of Daniel and Revelation will bring a great rival. But did you know that this deeper study is to give us "glimpses of heaven"?

It's not about trying to create all kinds of things that we think will happen in the future prior to the second coming. We already know there will be a time of trouble such as never was when the papal power unites with other religions, combines with spiritualism and using state power will persecute those who obey God rather then man.

What we need is getting those glimpses of heaven!



Read it --

When the books of Daniel and Revelation are better understood, believers will have an entirely different religious experience. They will be given such glimpses of the open gates of heaven that heart and mind will be impressed with the character that all must develop in order to realize the blessedness which is to be the reward of the pure in heart.

That's what we have been finding in our studies of Daniel and Revelation -- more and more glimpses into what Christ is doing in the heavenly sanctuary.

The thunders -- They are all about Christ's work in "finishing the mystery of God" -- finishing the redemption of the faithful, and bringing in eternal justice!

EGW in refering to them says

"Jesus Christ. Setting His right foot on the sea, and His left upon the dry land, shows the part which He is acting in the closing scenes of the great controversy with Satan. This position denotes His supreme power and authority over the whole earth. {1MR 99.2}

The great plan of redemption, as revealed in the closing work for these last days, should receive close examination. The scenes connected with the sanctuary above should make such an impression upon the minds and hearts of all that they may be able to impress others. All need to become more intelligent in regard to the work of the atonement, which is going on in the sanctuary above. When this grand truth is seen and understood, those who hold it will work in harmony with Christ to prepare a people to stand in the great day of God, and their efforts will be successful. --Testimonies, vol. 5, p. 575.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #122518
12/31/09 07:27 AM
12/31/09 07:27 AM
dedication  Online Content
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Originally Posted By: Mountain Man

M: I suspect the crisis will begin when Sunday laws are enforced. When Sabbath-keepers must choose between the laws of man and the laws of God the crisis will be well under way.

D: But won't it be too late to start sounding the three angels message then?

MM: Saying Sunday Laws will come is not as convincing as saying Sundays Laws are here. Ellen White wrote:

“Heretofore those who presented the truths of the third angel's message have often been regarded as mere alarmists. Their predictions that religious intolerance would gain control in the United States, that church and state would unite to persecute those who keep the commandments of God, have been pronounced groundless and absurd. It has been confidently declared that this land could never become other than what it has been--the defender of religious freedom. But as the question of enforcing Sunday observance is widely agitated, the event so long doubted and disbelieved is seen to be approaching, and the third message will produce an effect which it could not have had before. {GC 605.3}



Maybe we should start a new thread on Sunday laws.
They are coming in by stealth, while satan keeps the saints sound asleep thinking they will give the three angels message in some future time.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #122519
12/31/09 07:59 AM
12/31/09 07:59 AM
dedication  Online Content
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Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Mark, do you think Ellen White knew we would still be here 100 years after her passing? And, do you think these 100 years are accounted for in prophecy? If so, why did she continue to believe Jesus' return was imminent? Seems to me the next prophetic event she was waiting for was Sunday Laws. Next would follow the shaking, sealing, latter rain, loud cry, etc.


Though I am not Mark,
your question raises some good points.

EGW believed Christ would come in her lifetime.
She never expected to get old and die.

All the pioneers firmly believed all the timelines were fulfilled and the next events would be the closing ones.

But did she see those closing events in the order you placed them.
Remember in 1888?
What event did she say was beginning?

She was expecting the latter rain, and even said it was beginning in 1888.
The Sunday issue was also showing signs of coming in.
The church was being shaken
It can happen all at once.

BUT back then -- it all stopped.

"Christ could have come ere this".

We aren't on a "timeline" anymore, we are on the eve of eternity.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: dedication] #122525
12/31/09 07:35 PM
12/31/09 07:35 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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I believe we need to experience and proclaim the truth about righteousness by faith and then all other events will follow in their train.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #122784
01/09/10 05:30 PM
01/09/10 05:30 PM
Rick H  Offline

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Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Mark, how does the following insight fit into it?

7BC 971
The special light given to John which was expressed in the seven thunders was a delineation of events which would transpire under the first and second angels' messages. It was not best for the people to know these things, for their faith must necessarily be tested. In the order of God most wonderful and advanced truths would be proclaimed. The first and second angels' messages were to be proclaimed, but no further light was to be revealed before these messages had done their specific work. This is represented by the angel standing with one foot on the sea, proclaiming with a most solemn oath that time should be no longer. {7BC 971.6}
In order for our faith to be tested we must go through the end time events without a complete timeline and description, otherwise we would just mark time like at a airport and get on board (and let go of sin) when the time says Christ is 'on his way' to the docking station, please show your boarding pass (no fatith is needed)... shocked

Last edited by Richard; 01/09/10 05:33 PM.
Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Rick H] #122850
01/12/10 03:41 PM
01/12/10 03:41 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Richard, good point. God waits to announce the day and hour of Jesus' arrival until toward the end of the time of trouble.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #123156
01/30/10 05:19 PM
01/30/10 05:19 PM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Richard, do you think the seven thunders are unsealed? What about you MM?

My posting on time prophecies has been tentative and I have to apologize for leaning too much towards the possiblity of timing prophecies for the latter rain, close of probation etc. More recently though, my view is that time prophecies in Daniel and Revelation regarding the abomination of desolation in connection with the third angel's message are indeed in a time framework. Chist Himself urges us to study the prophecies of Daniel in that regard. In Daniel the abomination of desolation is linked to the 1260, 1290 and 1335 days. Since the termination of the 1335 days is 1843 even on the corrected chart we have good reason to keep an open mind on the topic - especially when we consider that God consistently has fortold the duration of persecution of His people historically.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Charity] #123163
01/31/10 06:10 PM
01/31/10 06:10 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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I don't think the seven thunders were recorded. I also think they were fulfilled during the Millerite Movement. I don't think the time prophecies will be fulfilled again. I believe the next prophetic step is the NSL followed by the shaking, etc.

Re: Are the seven thunders of Rev 10 unsealed? [Re: Mountain Man] #123289
02/09/10 12:28 PM
02/09/10 12:28 PM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Seven thunders not recorded but fulfilled? Eugene Prewitt thinks the same. Dedication sees the weakness of putting the thunders in the past but not being able to point to seven descrete events. So Dedication has assigned events which are messages. If they are still sealed though, it's not wise to explain them because that would be adding to the words of the book.

Apparently, Dedication thinks that they're unsealed. Ellen White makes only one comment on them, and she doesn't explain them. Eugene and others think she does, applying the thunders to the Great Disappointment. Ellen White however applies the bitter after-taste of the sweet little book to the disappointment.

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