Lots of times we worry that we might have too lenient of an attitude toward sin. We worry that we will have "cheap grace" and take God for granted. Somehow we might get the idea that sin isnt all that bad and we get lax toward it. This can cause spiritual problems.

We also might worry that we will get a proud self-satisfied attitude and have too high of self-esteem.

But on the other hand, can it cause problems if we have sinned and allow it to take away all self-respect?

First of all, please read this:

In Heavenly Places, page 122
Chapter Title: Trust When You Have Failed
"Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Phil. 3:12.

In order to fight successfully in the battle against sin, you must keep close to Jesus. Do not talk unbelief; you have no excuse for doing this. . . . Unbelief always separates the soul from Christ.

It is not praiseworthy to talk of our weakness and discouragement. Let each one say, "I am grieved that I yield to temptation, that my prayers are so feeble, my faith so weak. I have no excuse to plead for being dwarfed in my religious life. But I am seeking to obtain completeness of character in Christ. I have sinned, and yet I love Jesus. I have fallen many times, and yet He has reached out His hand to save me. I have told Him all about my mistakes. I have confessed with shame and sorrow that I have dishonored Him. I have looked to the cross, and have said, All this He suffered for me. The Holy Spirit has shown me my ingratitude, my sin in putting Christ to open shame. He who knows no sin has forgiven my sin. He calls me to a higher, nobler life, and I press on to the things that are before." . . .

The humility that bears fruit, filling the soul with a sense of the love of God, will speak for the one who has cherished it, in the great day when men will be rewarded according as their works have been. Happy will be the one of whom it can be said, "The Spirit of God never stirred this man's soul in vain. He went forward and upward from strength to strength. Self was not woven into his life. Each message of correction, warning, and counsel he received as a blessing from God. Thus the way was prepared for him to receive still greater blessings, because God did not speak to him in vain. Each step upward on the ladder of progress prepared him to climb still higher. From the top of the ladder the bright beams of God's glory shone upon him. He did not think of resting, but sought constantly to attain the wisdom and righteousness of Christ. Ever he pressed toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus."

This experience every one who is saved must have."

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What if we view God as one who expects us to overcome sin, which I believe we should. But then when we do sin and fail... we view God as just waiting to punish us? What if we get so discouraged with some sin we have tendencies toward and we give up on ourselves? How can we balance these two ideas? How can we aim towards perfection of character but at the same time view God as being merciful towards our sin when we fail?

Can some "Historic" Adventists be so geared toward perfection that they forget the mercy of God? Will they then be so hard on themselves when they sin that they will finally give up altogether?

Not only that but... if keeping the law of God means to love our neighbor, then if we are so hard on ourselves when we sin and fail... we are unmerciful towards ourselves, then how can we be merciful towards others when we see sin in them? How can we keep the Law of love which is what we are striving for, if we dont love ourselves, though we have sinned?

any insights?

Claudia

[ February 23, 2002: Message edited by: Claudia Burrow ]

Claudia, thank you for creating this thread. How important it is what with so many threads dealing with the question of overcoming sin and maturing in the grace of God.

I love the story of Mary, how Jesus continued to forgive her even after falling back into the same sin time after time. His mercy is so amazing. It finally cured her of the sin by which she was plagued. Each time He promised her that she could go and sin no more trusting in the grace of God to empower her to experience the promise.

We cannot achieve what we cannot believe. Thus we must train our minds to claim God's promises, to stay connected to Jesus, especially when we are bombarded by dozens of devil thoughts for coming short of the glory of God. We cannot conclude that consistent, unbroken victory is impossible no matter how times we come short and fall into sin, because then we are sure to fail and fall.

Only the truth can set us free. But if we water down the promises of God and make them mean the opposite of what they clearly say, then we are making provision to fulfill the lusts of the flesh, and surely we will multiply our misery.

Our only safety is in taking God at His word, and trusting Jesus to fulfill His promises in us. He is the rock of our salvation. By beholding Christ we become Christlike. 2 Cor 3:18. Thank you Jesus.

If our minds are full of unholy thoughts and feelings, we must turn to Jesus for strength to resist them as the voice of Satan. And Jesus will not turn us away empty handed. Praise God. In it's place the Spirit will bless us with lovely thoughts and feelings of Jesus and His love. It's just so awesome and wonderful.

Sometimes, forgiving ourselves is the hardest part of all! Especially when we have done something, even years ago, that hurt many people, and, I know wherof I speak, for this is a personal fact. This is the kind of thing that causes one to truly know what is meant by the "visiting of the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation...." Yes, it is true, I have seen the natural consequences of my sins affecting not only my life, but, the lives of all three of my children. I pray it doesn't go any farther; to my grandchildren. This is one big reason why it has been hard for me to forgive myself, because of the hurts to others.

It has only been since I could begin to see myself as God sees me, "a child of the King, a princess, if you will," that I have been able to accept that it is time to forgive myself. Only because I was given the gift of seeing myself as God has promised to see me, through the eyes of a dear, dear friend, have I been able to accept the truth, and my worth in His eyes.

Dora,

I can sense the pain coming from your words. I know what it's like to have done something wrong that has effected lots of people and that you are truly sorry for... but you wonder if God is "angry" with you for having hurt others.

One thing that might help you is something that helped me a lot in the past, and even now.

Remember the story of Joseph and how when all of the things had gone wrong, Jacob, Joseph's father said that "everything was against him?"

But it turned out in the story that everything really wasnt against him and that God meant it all for good, to save many people, in the end. Joseph's brothers hurt him, but in the end God made the entire thing help lots of people.

You have to believe when the Bible says that "all things work for good, to them that love God". Even your mistakes. God can make people realize things through your mistakes, or lots of other good things can actually happen from your mistakes.

Claudia

Claudia,
Thank you for your kind words and concern, but, I need to correct something which I maybe did not make clear. No, I have never thouGht that God was "angry" at me for the hurts that others may have suffered or for the long lasting consequences of my sins. For, once I turned back to Jesus, I saw myself as having been that little lamb that had wandered away into the thorns, sharp rocks and had been caught in the brambles of sin. True, I was the lamb who wandered away, and I had CHOSEN the wrong path which led to the thorns, rocks and brambles, even to the danger of falling completely over the cliff. But, Praise God, Jesus came looking for me, as I was crying so faintly, hardly anyone else knew. No, He wasn't angry with me, nor did I ever feel that he was. I had cried out, even faintly, and He ever so gently picked me up, cradled me on His shoulder, spoke tender words to me, and carried me back to the fold. Not once, did I ever feel that He had roughly set me down, scolded me, or threatened me, He just brought me back, loved me, and the kind, loving "undershepherds" in the fold ( church) took good care of me, and have ever since! I praise Him when we have such good "undershepherds!" And, oh, how I praise our Good Shepherd for His love and patience then, and that it has continued.

No, I have never felt that God was "angry" with me for the hurts I have caused, and, because He has so freely forgiven, I can now forgive myself, and have felt like that for some time. I am sorry, still, for the things I have done wrong,but, choose not to dwell on them. I share them only when I feel I can reach out to another hurting person by doing so. My motto is instead, "forgetting those things which are behind, I press forward to the mark of the high calling which is in Christ Jesus."

But, again, Claudia, thank you for caring!!