Why did God command His people to kill sinners? For example, why did God command Moses and the COI (children of Israel) to stone the Sabbath-breaker and the blasphemer to death? Some say it wasn't God's ideal will. Others add that the unholy, immature state of His people made it necessary for Him to command capital punishment. Still others say it was temporary until they were ready for God to show them a better way. Finally, others say God risked being misunderstood as being in favor of capital punishment.

1. If it wasn't God's ideal will, was it wrong of Him to command His people to execute capital punishment? Or, was it the best thing for Him to do under the circumstances?

2. If it was the unholy, immature state of His people that forced God to temporarily command capital punishment did He compromise in order to accommodate their defects and imperfections? If so, was it wrong of Him to compromise?

3. Why did God command capital punishment if He was afraid others would misunderstand it as Him being in favor of it? Since God commanded it, why would anyone think He was opposed to it?

4. Did God consider it an act of sin when His people obeyed His command to execute capital punishment? Did He expect them to obey His command?

5. If His people had refused His command to execute capital punishment would He have considered it an act of rebellion? Or, was He hoping they would refuse and explain that it is because it is not in harmony with His ideal will?

6. What was God's ideal way to deal with people who violated His law? For example, in the cases of the Sabbath-breaker and the blasphemer, how would God have preferred to deal with them but couldn't because circumstances forced Him to command capital punishment?

I believe God commanded capital punishment because it symbolizes the final judgment, that is, it symbolizes the fact God will execute the wicked in the lake of fire.

It's like the counsel for divorce, given because of the hardness of their hearts. God's ideal will is seen in Jesus Christ. When we've seen Him, we've seen the Father. If we wish to understand God's character, that's where we should go.



It's like the counsel regarding divorce. Or allowing polygamy. Or giving them a king. Or entering into the Old Covenant with them. God did many things because of the hardness of their hearts. Again, we should look to Jesus Christ to understand God's ideal will.



Same as why He allowed polygamy, divorce, etc.



God would have preferred that people lived by His ideal will, as revealed in Christ, but He meets people where they are.



Jesus Christ had not yet revealed God's character, so this should be taken into consideration.



Look at Jesus Christ. See how He dealt with the woman caught in adultery. That was a revelation of God's ideal will.



This doesn't make sense to me. What makes more sense to me is that God was reacting to the circumstances, and doing what made the most sense given the situation of the people and what was happening. That God commanded capital punishment as a model in miniature for the judgment doesn't make much sense.

To understand the judgment, we should study Calvary. Trying to understand God by looking at the OT, while leaving aside Christ, is like using a candle instead of the sun for illumination. We've been studying these subjects for several years now, and how much time have we spent considering Christ vs. how much time on the OT? Maybe 1% Christ and 99% OT? Not a good ratio for understanding the truth about God, IMO.

A certain type of people have suggested that nowhere in the Bible can you find it speaks against polygamy. I have countered, but maybe what they really mean to say is nowhere in the Bible is there a direct admonition against polygamy.

So, keeping with MM's concept if I can't find an explicit statement, then allowed, and I should be able to have multiple wives and God would be ok with that. Right?

Kland, do you believe God commanded His people to have more than one spouse? If so, please post the passages that say so. Thank you.

PS - It would be nice if you answered the questions posted above. Tom recommended this thread hoping you would articulate the truth as to why commanded His people to employ capital punishment.

Was it wrong of God to command His people to execute capital punishment? Wasn’t it Jesus who commanded it? If it wasn’t Jesus, who do you think commanded it?


Did God (Jesus) command His people to get divorced, to have more than one spouse, to have a king, or to obey the law in their own strength? Would He have viewed it as rebellion if they refused to do these things? Do you agree God (Jesus) commanded them to execute capital punishment? If so, why?


Did Jesus command divorce, polygamy, etc? Do you agree God (Jesus) commanded them to execute capital punishment? If so, why? And, why would anyone think He was opposed to it?


Did God consider it an act of sin when His people obeyed His command to execute capital punishment? Did He expect them to obey His command?


Why didn’t Jesus reveal God’s character? And, since Jesus had not yet revealed the character of God, would He have considered it an act of rebellion if His people had refused to obey His command to execute capital punishment?


Do you think Jesus wanted to tell Moses to simply forgive the Sabbath-breaker and the blasphemer? If so, why didn’t Jesus say so when Moses inquired of Him? Do you think the Sabbath-breaker and the blasphemer were like the woman caught in adultery in that they were set up and led into sin? Do you think they were sorry for their sin and wishing to be forgiven?


Jesus did not come the first time to execute the final judgment. Instead, He came to pay our sin debt of death. True, He spoke fairly often about the final judgment, and when He did, He always cited the OT to state the truth about it. Why do you think Jesus cited the OT when He taught the truth regarding the final judgment?

While here in the flesh Jesus forgave sinners and commanded them to go and sin no more else something worse would happen to them. But He didn’t forgive everybody. Instead, He simply told them it was going to be worse for them during the final judgment than it was for the antediluvians and the inhabitants of S&G. Why didn’t Jesus forgive everyone like He did the woman taken in adultery?

You wrote, “What makes more sense to me is that God was reacting to the circumstances, and doing what made the most sense given the situation of the people and what was happening.” Do you believe Jesus commanded His people to execute capital punishment? And, was it wrong of them to obey His command? Was it a sin to execute capital punishment?

Sorry, I must have missed where Tom thought I would articulate the truth on this thread.

But why do you ask for where He commanded? It says God killed Saul. You say since it also says Saul killed himself, that's ok. But, in those cases where you can't find a specific thing contrasting with what God said, you say it's not true. So, wouldn't it follow if you can't find a statement contrasting with polygamy, it's not true that God is against it?

However, God did say not to kill. So what should we make of that in light of your above comments?

As far the other, besides what Tom answered, what about the other post, #123169, explaining a reason? As in, ideally.

It's of the same character as the counsel in relation to divorce.



I think these were, in general, of a similar character.



I think these were, in general, of a similar nature. As to why one would think God would be opposed to any of things, one would need to know God's character.



I think to see God's ideal will, we should and must look to Jesus Christ. The Israelites were a stiff-necked and ignorant people. We see God's ideal will, including His view of capital punishment, in situations like this in His treatment of the woman caught in adultery.



He came to reveal God. This was the "whole purpose" of His mission.



It should be clear from this to see why Jesus came. Surely "whole purpose" must encompass the reason.



MM, this was the Scripture of the time.



On the cross He prayed, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do!" This reveals the heart of God.



You can't forgive someone who doesn't wish to be change, no matter how much it breaks your heart.



Here was my comment:



In my opinion, if you wish to understand God, the place to look is Jesus Christ, while here in the flesh, during the time when His whole purpose was the revelation of God.

Regarding the people in the OT, I think God would have been delighted if they had the heart of Jesus Christ, and, on that basis, reacted how Jesus Christ did.

Perhaps you see nothing wrong with polygamy.

Here's another case. Was it God's ideal will for them to have a king?

Perhaps we should discuss one thing at a time. It’s difficult to discuss polygamy, divorce, kings, Saul committing suicide, and God commanding capital punishment all in the same breath. Since this thread is addressing capital punishment in particular it makes sense to me to discuss it first. I hope you don’t mind. Please feel free to start a separate thread to discuss your other concerns.

Regarding whether or not something is allowed or disallowed based on what is written or not written: As it relates to capital punishment, God very clearly commanded Moses, and others, to execute capital punishment. There is nothing unclear, uncertain, or ambiguous about it. For example, God plainly commanded Moses to stone the Sabbath-breaker and the blasphemer to death. Do you agree?

Yes, God commands us not to kill. However, the meaning of kill is murder. In other words, God forbids us to murder. Commanding Moses, therefore, to stone sinners to death does not violate the law. Do you agree?

And, as far as God’s “ideal will” is concerned, yes, of course, God would rather not be forced into situations where law, love, and logic require Him to command capital punishment. It would be much better if everybody lived in harmony with God’s will. But they don’t, so God is forced to do things He would rather not have to do. Do you agree?


You didn’t answer my question. Do you believe God commanded His people to have more than one spouse? And, do you believe He commanded His people to have a king? I assume your answer to both questions is, No! If so, does that mean you also believe God did not command capital punishment? Or, do you believe He did? For example, do you believe God commanded Moses to stone sinners to death?