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Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW #126606
07/27/10 12:24 AM
07/27/10 12:24 AM
Daryl  Offline
OP
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
Here is the link to this week's study and discussion material:

http://www.ssnet.org/qrtrly/eng/10c/less05.html


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
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Sabbath School Lesson Study Material Link
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Daryl] #126614
07/30/10 10:35 PM
07/30/10 10:35 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Ben Holdsworth says the following in his commentary on lesson 5 in Spectrum:

Quote:
Some non-Judeans in Rome are known to have assimilated or accommodated many Judean religious characteristics, including Sabbath observance. However, non-Judean circumcision was a key contention, not only of religious, but also of ethnic change. [8] For non-Judeans, it was a key ethnic identifier used in critique of Judeans, (the circumcised). [9]
For Judeans, circumcision was the essential act for a male non-Judean to become a member of God’s covenant people. ...

What is important for Paul and his audience is that Abraham’s faith with God was credited to him before he was circumcised. Paul rearranges circumcision from a mark of the covenant and ethnic exclusivity to a seal of right relationship for Judeans in 4:11. Paul concludes that Abraham was the human forefather of not only Judeans, but also non-Judeans who had entered into a faith-based covenant with God that also resulted in righteousness – right relationship (4:9-13).

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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Rosangela] #126615
07/30/10 10:41 PM
07/30/10 10:41 PM
Rosangela  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Bacchiocchi gives more detail about this:

Quote:
The Stoic philosopher Seneca laments that "the customs of this accursed nation [Jews] have gained such influence that they are now received throughout the world. The vanquished have given laws to their victors . . . the greater part of the [non-Jewish] people go through a ritual not knowing why they do so" [Quoted by Augustine in City of God 6, 11].

The testimony of Seneca is confirmed by the Jewish historian Josephus when he writes: "There is not one Greek or barbarian nor a single nation to whom our custom of abstaining from work on the seventh day has not spread, and where the fasts and the lighting of lamps and many of our prohibitions in the matter of food are not observed" [Josephus, Against Apion 2, 40. A similar statement is found in Philo, Vita Mosis 2, 20].

http://www.biblicalperspectives.com/books/sabbath_new_testament/9.html


So, the key point which separated Jews from gentiles was indeed circumcision. That's why Paul focuses on it in his discussion.

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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Rosangela] #126616
07/30/10 10:44 PM
07/30/10 10:44 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
Good comment in the lesson material for Thursday:

Quote:
A few hundred years ago, Irish writer Jonathan Swift wrote: “But will any man say that if the words drinking, cheating, lying, stealing were by Act of Parliament ejected out of the English tongue and dictionaries, we should all awake next morning temperate, honest and just, and lovers of truth? Is this a fair consequence?”—Jonathan Swift, A Modest Proposal and Other Satires, (New York: Prometheus Books, 1995), p. 205.

In the same way, if God's law has been abolished, then why are lying, murder, and stealing still sinful or wrong? If God's law has been changed, then the definition of sin must be changed, too. Or if God's law was done away with, then sin must be, as well, and who believes that?

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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Rosangela] #126617
07/31/10 12:28 AM
07/31/10 12:28 AM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil

The law claims from man entire obedience through the whole period of his life. Hence it is impossible for him by future obedience to atone for even one sin. GCB March 5, 1895

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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Rosangela] #126621
08/01/10 03:44 AM
08/01/10 03:44 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,584
California, USA
A little late, but here's another one:
Quote:
When we have done all that it is possible for us to do, we are to count ourselves as unprofitable servants. We deserve no thanks from God. We have only done what it was our duty to do, and our works could not have been performed in the strength of our own sinful natures. {RH, January 29, 1895 par. 4}


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: asygo] #126622
08/01/10 03:46 AM
08/01/10 03:46 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,584
California, USA
Something for everyone here. How do you reconcile Paul's teaching that we are justified apart from our works and James' teaching that we are justified by our works?


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: asygo] #126626
08/03/10 03:51 PM
08/03/10 03:51 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
Quote:
R:Good comment in the lesson material for Thursday:

A few hundred years ago, Irish writer Jonathan Swift wrote: “But will any man say that if the words drinking, cheating, lying, stealing were by Act of Parliament ejected out of the English tongue and dictionaries, we should all awake next morning temperate, honest and just, and lovers of truth? Is this a fair consequence?”—Jonathan Swift, A Modest Proposal and Other Satires, (New York: Prometheus Books, 1995), p. 205.

In the same way, if God's law has been abolished, then why are lying, murder, and stealing still sinful or wrong? If God's law has been changed, then the definition of sin must be changed, too. Or if God's law was done away with, then sin must be, as well, and who believes that?


I agree this is a good comment. I've made the point many times that the law does not create reality, but describes it, or makes it plain. Understanding the principle pointed out here is useful to seeing the Plan of Salvation not in terms of arbitrary actions God performs to jump through legal hoops, but in terms of doing what's necessary to rescue His creatures from the effects of sin.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Tom] #126627
08/03/10 03:55 PM
08/03/10 03:55 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
Originally Posted By: asygo
Something for everyone here. How do you reconcile Paul's teaching that we are justified apart from our works and James' teaching that we are justified by our works?


The quick response is that the word "justified" is being used differently depending on the context of the respective authors. However, both writers express the principle the other one pointed out; that is, James expresses the principle of grace, and Paul expresses the importance of works in the life of one who is justified.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Lesson #5 - Justification and the LAW [Re: Tom] #126629
08/03/10 05:00 PM
08/03/10 05:00 PM
C
Colin  Offline
Active Member 2012
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
James emphasised the change grace produces when sinful humans accept the gifts of grace God gave them in Jesus his only begotten Son: justification which does not change the heart - is not more than intellectual is not genuine.

Paul said the same thing, emphasising genuineness of justification: together James and Paul said that unless something righteous happens to us when we are justified, it's not justification by faith.

Only with that changed heart experience of justification can then sanctification of character be real, with daily death to self and rebirth of the Spirit.

Last edited by Colin; 08/03/10 05:05 PM.
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