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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#182980
03/27/17 05:22 AM
03/27/17 05:22 AM
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Global Moderator Supporting Member 2022
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The Millerite Adventists in setting the date for the day of Atonement in 1844 to Oct. 22 were using the Biblical reckoning -- the same as the Karaites. They were NOT using the more recent rabbinical reckoning which is, and was in their day, much more common. Millerites were calculating according to Karaite reckoning In their paper J. Himes wrote: "The commencement of their years being always governed by the time the barley harvest should be reaped, made them always virtually of the same length as our own; for there must have been as many years, as there were barley harvests, and no more. The year beginning with the new moon nearest the barley harvest, made that feast a moveable feast, and the year sometimes began earlier and sometimes later, varying half a moon, as the barley ripened early or later, and the new moon came near to the time of the harvest. Now there is at dispute between the Rabinical, and the Caraite Jews, as to the correct time of commencing the year. The former are scattered all over the world, and cannot observe the time of the ripening of that harvest in Judea. They therefore regulate the commencement of the year by astronomical calculations, and commence with the first day of the new moon nearest the vernal equinox, when the sun is in Aries. The Caraite Jews on the contrary, still adhere to the letter of the Mosiac law, and commence with the new moon nearest the barley harvest in Judea; and which is one moon later than the Rabinical year. The Jewish year of A D 1843, as the Caraites reckon it in accordance with the Mosaic law, therefore commenced this year with the new moon on the 29th, day of April and the Jewish year 1844, will commence with the new moon in next April, when 1843 and 2300 days, according to their computation, will expire. But according to the Rabinical Jews, it began with the new moon the first of last April, and will expire with the new moon in the month of March next. {June 21, 1843 J. Himes (Signs of the Times; June 21, 1843; p. 123) In an article on the Jewish year, published in the Cry of April 27, 1843, Bro. Whiting says: "The rabbinical calculation makes the first day of Nisan commence with the new moon nearest the day on which the sun enters Aries, on the vernal equinox. It ought, however, to be observed, that the Caraite Jews maintain that the rabbins have changed the Calendar, so that, to present the first fruits on the 16th of Nisan would be impossible if the time is reckoned according to the rabbinical calculations, since barley is not in the ear at Jerusalem till a month later. The accounts of many travelers confirm the position of the Caraites. (The Midnight Cry; Oct. 11, 1844; p. 117) The fulfillment of the Day of Atonement began Oct. 22, 1844. That is when Christ -- the Son of Man was brought before the ancient of Days and was given the dominion and kingdom (See Daniel 7:13-14) -- Christ as the Son of Man, taking the place of Adam at the head of the human race , standing before the heavenly court room receives mankind's lost inheritance and then confesses the names of all who overcome by His blood before the Father and the angels (comp. Rev. 3:5) The last feast -- feast of tabernacles will be fulfilled at the Lamb's marriage feast when all the citizens of Christ's kingdom will be seated at the heavenly banquet (See Rev. 19:8-9) The starting date of the 2300 years is 457 BC Ministry Magazine has a good article establishing this date
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#182982
03/27/17 03:51 PM
03/27/17 03:51 PM
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Global Moderator Supporting Member 2022
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In October of 1844 J.V.Himes wrote again concerning the Biblical calendar and it's relationship to prophecy: The prophecy of Dan. ix. 25 concerning the 69 weeks, was intended for the whole Jewish nation; and they were condemned because they understood it not. {October 2, 1844 JVHe, HST 70.8} In Luke xix. 43, 44, we find our Lord denouncing upon them the most awful judgments because they knew not the time of then visitation. The prophecy was plain, and they should have heeded it. Our Savior, also told them plainly when the period ended, saying, "The time is fulfilled." See Mark i. 14, 15; Matt. iv. 12, 17; Acts x. 37; thus we see that the 69 weeks ended, and the 70th week began, soon after John's imprisonment. John began his ministry in the fifteenth year of Tiberius Casar--see Luke iii. 1--3. The administration of Tiberius began, according to the united testimony of chronologers, in Aug., A. D. 12. Fourteen years from that point, extend to Aug. A. D. 26, when his 15th year began. The ministry of John, therefore, 71 commenced in the latter part of A. D. 26. From Luke iii. 21, we learn that after John had been baptizing for some time, Jesus came and was baptized; and verse 23 informs us that at that time he was 30 years of age. It is astronomically proved that our Savior was born four years before the Christian era. The proof is this. About the year 527, Dionysius Exigus, a Roman monk, fixed the beginning of the Christian era in the year of the Julian period 4713. This reckoning has been followed to the present time. But Josephus, in his Antiquities, Book 17, chapt. 6, mentions particularly an eclipse of the moon, which occurred a short time before the death of Herod; and the astronomical tables prove the eclipse to have been the 13th of March, in the year of the Julian period 4710. Our Lord was born some months previous to this; for after his birth Herod sought to destroy his life, and Joseph being warned by the angel of the Lord in a dream, took the young child and his mother, and went into Egypt, where he remained till after Herod's death--see Matt. ii. 13--15. The latest point, therefore, that we can fix upon for the birth of Christ, is near the close of the year 4709, just four years earlier than the point given by Dionysius for the commencement of the Christian era. Consequently Jesus was 30 years of age near the close of A. D. 26, and at his baptism was a little more than 30. Soon after this, as is evident from John ii. 11--13, there was a passover. This, being the first Passover after the beginning of John's baptism, must have been in the spring of A. D. 27. ...Jesus began the proclamation of the gospel in Galilee, in the autumn of A. D. 27. Here ended the 69 weeks, and here began the week, during which the covenant was confirmed--see Dan. ix. 27. In the midst of the week Jesus caused the sacrifice and the oblation to cease by offering himself as a Lamb, without spot, to God upon the cross. The Hebrew word translated "midst," is by the Lexicon defined "half, half part, middle, midst." The week was divided into two halves, and the event which was thus to divide it was the death of Christ. This took place, according to Dr. Hales, one of the ablest and best chronologers, in the spring of A. D. 31. Ferguson has placed it in A. D. 33; but in order to prove it he assumes the Rabbinical mode of reckoning the year, which is not correct. They commence the year with the new moon in March; but the Caraites with the new moon in April. The word Caraite signifies "one period in the law." These accuse the Rabbins of having departed from the law, and conformed to the customs of the heathen; and the charge is just, as they regulate their year by the vernal equinox, in imitation of the Romans; whereas the law says nothing of the vernal eqoinox; but required on the 16th day of the first month, the offering of the first fruits of the barley harvest. But if the year be commenced according to the Rabbins with the new moon in March, the barley harvest could not possibly be ripe in 16 days from that time. The Caraites are therefore undoubtedly correct. Now our Lord was crucified on the day of the Passover, as is evident from John xviii. 28. It was likewise the day before the Sabbath, as is proved by John xix. 31. According to the Rabbinical reckoning, the Passover occurred the day before the Sabbath, in A. D. 33, and not for several years before and after. But according to the Caraite reckoning, the Passover occurred on that day in A. D. 31. Therefore that was the year of the crucifixion. The covenant was confirmed half a week by Christ, and the other half by his apostles--see Heb. ii. 3, 4: "How shall we escape if we neglect so great salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto as by them that heard him; God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost according to his own will?" The covenant which was confirmed is the new covenant, i. e. the gospel. To confirm it signifies to establish it on a firm foundation. The foundation of the gospel, is Jesus and the resurrection--See Acts xvii. 18; 1 Cor. iii. 9--11; Eph. ii. 20. The gospel was established on this foundation by testimony, accompanied by miracles, as those proofs which were indespensably necessary. ... But when Paul was converted, and received his dispensation of the gospel to the gentiles, a special witness was called upon the stand. {October 2, 1844 JVHe, HST 70.9} These all testified to the one glorious, fundamental fact, that Jesus Christ had risen from the dead. Gal. i. 10--12; 1 Cor. xv. 1--9. It was not with the apostles a matter of faith that Christ had risen, but a matter of knowledge. They had seen, handled, and conversed with him, they had eaten and drunken with him after his resurrection, and had received from him a command to testify to these things. By so doing they confirmed the covenant, or, in other words, established the gospel, upon the resurrection of Christ, which is the foundation of the faith and hope of all God's children. But this testimony alone was not sufficient to establish the fact that Jesus had risen from the dead. Therefore we are told, Mark xvi. 20, "And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them and confirming the word by signs following." See also Heb. ii. 3, 4. When the last witness, that is Paul, had been called, and had given his testimony, confirmed by miracles, the gospel as a divine system of faith, hope, and love was established on its true foundation; in other words, the covenant was confirmed. Paul was converted in the autumn of A. D. 34. As Jesus Christ was crucified in the midst or middle of the week, and on the day of the Passover, which was the fourteenth day of the first month, it follows that the week began in the 7th month of A. D. 27, and ended in the 7th month of A. D. 34. This was the termination of the seventy weeks. From that point, 1810 years remained to the end of the 2300 days. And from the 7th month of A. D. 34, 1810 years extend to the 7th month of A. D. 1844. {October 2, 1844 JVHe, HST (Signs of the Times) 71.1}
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#182983
03/27/17 05:34 PM
03/27/17 05:34 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,499
Midland
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After starting this topic 11 years ago I just came across a fascinating statement in the appendix of the 1888 GC, page 681.4: Anciently the year did not commence in midwinter, as now, but at the first new moon after the vernal equinox. Therefore, as the period of 2300 days was begun in a year reckoned by the ancient method, it was considered necessary to conform to that method to its close. hence, 1843 was counted as ending in the spring, and not in the winter. {GC88 681.4} Apparently by 1888 the consensus of the church and Ellen White was that the ancient correct reckoning of the Biblical New Year and therefore the timing of the Day of Atonement in 1844 was based on the first new moon after the vernal equinox not the first new moon of the barley harvest as taught by the Karaites. (It's always important to check quotes!) I noticed that the above quote is in the capitalized NOTES section of the great controversy. Did Ellen White, or other inspired writers write that? If not, it could still be correct, though. But tell me if I'm wrong, the purpose of the note, when you read the context of the referenced page 328, is to solely point out that the years did not coincide with our years and therefore the calculations had to be made from spring rather than our December/January. The purpose of the note was not to determine whether calculations were made based on spring barley or spring equinox but purely that it was spring and not our year end. Do you agree? But you do realize, starting the year based on the equinox, is NOT found in the Bible. Starting the year based upon Barley IS found in the Bible. Regardless of which method, you do realize that the new moon after the equinox varies by up to a month depending upon the location on the earth. The Jewish calendar system was for the Jewish economy.
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Elle]
#182993
03/28/17 03:19 AM
03/28/17 03:19 AM
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Active Member 2019 Died February 12, 2019
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
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Bump! In case Mark didn't see this post at the end of the other page. I brought up a similar point as kland. I did edit the content of the quote a little but haven't changed any meaning or the context. ?? The Catholic Church set's their easter celebration after the equinox calendar, but what I seem to recall what I've read about the different Jewish faith... The majority of them their calendar is based on calculation. And they(well most them) have been using this system since their Babylonian captivity release(690?BC), not only since 70 AD.
However, the Bible teach to determine the start of the calendar via the ripeness of the barley, not the equinox. So I don't know how you can come to conclude with such assurance that the Karaites, who uses the barley ripeness method, that their fall Feast dates was a month too early as oppose to the Adventist having it right by using the equinox?
Blessings
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#183010
03/28/17 02:00 PM
03/28/17 02:00 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
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Joined: Oct 2008
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Midland
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as oppose to the Adventist having it right by using the equinox?
Have we established that, yet? I haven't seen anything other than the mentioned NOTE in the appendix.
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#183015
03/29/17 12:42 AM
03/29/17 12:42 AM
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OP
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Dedication, the Millerites did use the Karaite reckoning, I agree. And the editors of the 1888 GC who authored the end notes in the Appendix and who type set the book were aware of that too, but their end note which Ellen White approved (which is a fair assumption since she was very careful to review anything that bore her name) shows that by this time, rightly or wrongly, they now believed that the scriptural reckoning was the vernal equinox rule. I think it was Tertullian who states that the Jews after the dispersion of 70AD began to keep the Passover in some years one month too early, like they do today and like they did in 1844. So I'm saying only that the editorial board of the Review Publishing House of 1888 saw this as I do and that Ellen White is not on record as objecting. It's for whoever has ears to take it for what value it should be given.
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#183017
03/29/17 12:47 AM
03/29/17 12:47 AM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2020
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Posts: 4,583
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By the way, this year, except for Pentecost which is always on the first day of the week, the Jews are observing the feasts on the correct month and the correct day I think but could be one day too early.
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Charity]
#183028
03/30/17 01:39 PM
03/30/17 01:39 PM
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And the editors of the 1888 GC who authored the end notes in the Appendix and who type set the book were aware of that too, but their end note which Ellen White approved (which is a fair assumption since she was very careful to review anything that bore her name)
Are all notes approved by Ellen White? Did she ever fail to object to something that was not true? Again, consider my point of what the point of the note was. I'd like to hear your comment on that in relation as to whether Ellen White should object to the note or not. Or tell what you believe was the point and purpose of the note.
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Elle]
#183034
03/31/17 12:26 AM
03/31/17 12:26 AM
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Active Member 2019 Died February 12, 2019
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Nehemia Gordon from Karaites Korner send an official letter to our Church saying that our claim that the 1844 Yom Kippur date according to the Barley Harvest was on Oct 22 is FALSE. Why do we still claim that the Karaite reckoning was on Oct when we were corrected by the Karaites ?
Are you guys aware of this?
Blessings
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Re: Is there a Biblical/Divine calendar?
[Re: Elle]
#183035
03/31/17 01:09 AM
03/31/17 01:09 AM
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Colville, Wa
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Nehemia Gordon from Karaites Korner send an official letter to our Church saying that our claim that the 1844 Yom Kippur date according to the Barley Harvest was on Oct 22 is FALSE. Why do we still claim that the Karaite reckoning was on Oct when we were corrected by the Karaites ?
Are you guys aware of this? If the Kairites say we are wrong about Jesus being the Messiah should we also give up on the divinity of Jesus? Just pointing out that there could very well be an ulterior motive to the letter other than truth by a group who denies that Jesus is the Son of God.
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