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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39036
09/07/04 04:46 AM
09/07/04 04:46 AM
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Very Dedicated Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,664
Plowing
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Let me declare frankly here:
I would rather be in the company of a faithful muslim anyday than a false or bigotted christian. And I know plenty of good muslims. It's their wrong concepts of heavenly matters that is askew, not their manners, oftentimes.
Yet good morals do not indicate correct relationships with God. The social morals often can hide a black heart.
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39037
09/11/04 06:57 PM
09/11/04 06:57 PM
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Although the cut and paste from the Qur'an was interesting, could you possibly explain it in the context of this discussion, for those of us who are yet so slow.
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39038
09/11/04 08:25 PM
09/11/04 08:25 PM
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Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
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The cut and paste is self explanatory, and I also read in it that Jesus is not the Son of God..Very plain.
God Bless,
Will
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39039
09/12/04 02:44 PM
09/12/04 02:44 PM
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Yes, that part was very clear, but make your point in your own words for those of us that are yet so dull.
Sura 6:1 also says "All Praise be to GOD the One who created the heavens and the earth, and made the darkness and the light..."
Sura 6:2 "GOD is the One Who fashioned you from clay..."
Sura 6:3 "And He is GOD in the heavens and the earth, He knows your secrets..."
So here we have three attributes of Allah:
1) He is the Creator of heaven and earth and made the light.
2) He created man.
3) He knows our thoughts.
There are many others I have not listed. (There are also significant differences)
Please do not understand this as an attack on the Christian God or the Islamic Allah. It is neither. But it is a search for truth, answers, and understanding. If possible, address the question without the vitriolic rhetoric.
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39040
09/12/04 04:55 PM
09/12/04 04:55 PM
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Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
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Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Life. WHoever denies Christ as being the Son of God is well..antichrist. That is very plain and clear. However if you do not have faith in what the Word of God says then of course these things will be foolish to you.
God Bless,
Will
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39041
09/13/04 02:04 AM
09/13/04 02:04 AM
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Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
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And to even think that they are doing people the favor of asking you to expand and explain for the slow and dulll yet use words to sounds all high and mighty, but will not do the same. interesting, but I suppose some need that type of attenshun.
God Bless,
Will
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39042
09/13/04 03:42 AM
09/13/04 03:42 AM
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So far, the only really progressive response, (the resident Muslim scholar not withstanding) was Daryl's when he said that we do not know enough about their belief system to answer the question with any accuracy.
Nor, do I believe, can we, since if we understood the one postion perfectly, we could not understand the other to the same degree of perfection.
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39043
09/13/04 03:42 AM
09/13/04 03:42 AM
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Very Dedicated Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,664
Plowing
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If one performs religious rituals, like haj, mandatory memorized and automatic prayers daily, jihad and required circumcision of young boys and girls, is this belief or is this force?
Is death decrees on muslim converts to christianity (of any form) human force or Allah's All-loving Kindness?
========
Edited as it responded to now two deleted posts that were totally of a sparring nature that doesn't affect the integrity of this topic. - Daryl
[ September 14, 2004, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: Daryl Fawcett ]
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39044
09/13/04 03:52 AM
09/13/04 03:52 AM
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Very Dedicated Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,664
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Yes, Cedric, Daryl did say that many do not know enough about Islam and it's concepts about God and Allah. For most Westerners this is true.
Conversly muslims ignorance about authentic Protestant christianity is just as abysmal.
I am trying to share what I know. You seem not to want to discuss anything, read the Koranic references or Biblical ones either.
I do live in a muslim country.
Do you?
I have studied Islam,with muslims, for 35 years. Have you?
I have discussed the topics with imams, and shakhs. Have you?
This by no means make me anything but a student. However this student is attentive enough to know certain argumentive detours, which will not be taken.
Here is a tidbit from the "martyr", Shaheed Ayatollah Dr. Beheshti, writer of the book, "ISLAMIC CODE OF BEHAIVIOUR." available from the Islamic Propagation Organization , The Islamic Center of Hamburg.
"The Koran warns us against considering angels and apostles as God's offspring. They are His bondsmen, though admittedly eminent among them. But by no means may they be considered as His children. Adam, Noah, Abraham, Lot, Hud, Saleh, Ismael, Isaac, Jacob, Shoaib, Moses Joshua, Enoch, John, Jesus, Mohammad, and the other apostles are like us in so far as they are men and God's servants. He has created them as He has created others. Should those who say that Jesus is God's son mean that God is a father as we are to our children, then their characterisation of Him is improper.
God is elevated above such immature fancies. On the other hand, if they mean something different they should use a different notion to express it, rather than the misleading term "Son of God" "
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Re: What Are Some of the Things That Muslims Believe?
#39045
09/14/04 03:18 AM
09/14/04 03:18 AM
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Charter Member
Active Member 2014
Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,019
Northern CA
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quote:
Originally posted by Ikan:
Perhaps a peek at the Koran (Qu'ran) might help clarify what Islam teaches about Christ:
('Sura' = Chapter, 'People of the Scripture'= Christians)
Sura 4
Verse 157 "And because of their (Jews and pagan Romans) saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah's messenger - they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain.
158 But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.
171 O People of the Scripture! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning Allah save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and His word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers, and say not "Three" - Cease! (it is) better for you! - Allah is only One God. Far is it removed from His Transcendent Majesty that He should have a son. His is all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allah is sufficient as Defender.
Sura 5
51 O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them.
72 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise.
73 They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the third of three; when there is no God save the One God.
75 The Messiah, son of Mary, was no other than a messenger, messengers (the like of whom) had passed away before him. And his mother was a saintly woman. And they both used to eat (earthly) food. See how We make the revelations clear for them, and see how they are turned away!
Sura 9
31 They have taken as lords beside Allah their rabbis and their monks and the Messiah son of Mary, when they were bidden to worship only One God. There is no God save Him. Be He Glorified from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him)!
If one studies Islamic history, it becomes known that Islam was only exposed to Catholic/Coptic semi pagan "christendom", not authentic and tiny faithful christianity as much. Observe the references to Mary and monks above.
Thank you Ikan for posting this from the KKoran (Qu'ran). This is very plain that they are worshipping a false God when they deny Jesus Christ as the Son of God. When you mix truth with error it is like saying you can drink a "little poison" with your kool-ade and it will not hurt you. In love we should show people where they are in error and point them to Jesus Christ as their only Saviour.
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