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Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74125
06/28/06 01:36 PM
06/28/06 01:36 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
Quote:

keeping the law is not restrictive but freedom from a life of misery. The decalog was given for our own good. Keeping the laws of God is a privilege, not a burden.





Well said. They are not a list of arbitrary rules which God punishes us for breaking because He gets upset at us or offended, but are the principles of life, happiness and peace. Love is the fulfilling of the law. Selfishness, which is anti-love, can only lead to misery, pain, suffering, and eventually death.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74126
06/28/06 01:40 PM
06/28/06 01:40 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
Quote:

Here is no question about what is meant and it goes way beyond the original commandment.




What Christ said did not go beyond the original commandment at all. God has always been concerned with the heart. Jesus explained the original intention of the commandment, which existed before Moses brought down those tablets.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74127
06/28/06 01:58 PM
06/28/06 01:58 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
God knew that no men might be justified by His law, but He still commanded men to keep it, because only through His law he might has the legal right to execute judgment upon men (to abolish sin and sinners through death) and thus justify Christ righteousness to become our sin redeemer.

Paul tells exactly why God formally gave the law. It was "added because of transgressions."

The law was given as a diagnostic tool. It shows us our need for Christ by making clear our sin. When we receive Christ, it testifies of the righteousness we have in Him.

God has never been dependent upon something written on tablets to have the right to execute judgment. And besides, the judgment which God executes is simply to allow those who have made free choices to experience the results of those choices.

For example:


For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the Lord; they would none of my counsel; they despised all my reproof. Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices. For the turning away of the simple shall slay them, and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them.Prov. 1:29-32.

But it was in His plan from the beginning that justification at the end is by faith without the deeds of the law (Romans 3:19-22). So, when (the object of our) faith came, we are no longer under a schoolmaster (the law).

It wasn't God's plan in the sense that God looked at several alternatives and said, "Let's go with this one!" The only way by which one can be reconciled to God is by faith. Not because God said so, but because there is no other way. That's why God said so.

Faith is the open hand of a beggar, accepting the free gift which God places in it. Since we have nothing of ourselves by which we can restore our relationship with God, God must meet us where we are, revealing His kindness to us, and bidding us to receive His forgiveness, provided at great cost and risk to Himself.

The law is individually our shoolmaster, to lead us to Christ, not dispensationally. That is, Paul is not saying that those who were before Christ did not need faith, and those after Christ were saved by faith instead of the law. What Paul said must apply to both those who lived before the cross as well as after. Otherwise, how could those who lived before the cross have been saved?

Paul is not speaking in terms of chronological time. Paul is speaking in terms of the condition of each one's heart. Paul is saying that the law is our (individual) schoolmaster, to lead us to Christ. When we try to satisfy God by our righteousness, we are under the law. When we believe that God graciously forgives us, out of the goodness of His own heart, we are no longer under the schoolmaster; we have been led to Christ.

This principle is true for all who have ever lived, regardless of whether before or after the cross. The poster boy for righteousness by faith is Abraham, who lived even before the law was given by Moses!


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74128
06/28/06 02:12 PM
06/28/06 02:12 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
It might be that the teaching from Jesus mount sermon did not go beyond Gods intentions even before the lawgiving, however, if we keep ourselves from speculating about Gods intentions and read only what the text in exodus acctually says we find the difference between "do not kill" and in the mount sermon "do not harbor anger or insult to anyone". If any of the laws given to/by Moses includes one against anger/hate/unspoken insult, id like to see it.


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74129
06/28/06 03:29 PM
06/28/06 03:29 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
We aim to please, Thomas. Here you go:

"Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart." Leviticus 19:17.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74130
06/29/06 02:11 AM
06/29/06 02:11 AM
Redfog  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 733
Michigan, USA
It's my experience that those who try to say the Ten Commandments are no longer valid are those that for one reason or the other wish to do away with the 7th day Sabbath. All the other nine all of Christianity agrees on but not the 4th. Thou shall not kill (murder) is a no brainer, as is committing adultery, stealing, taking the Lords name in vain etc. It's the Sabbath one that people wish not to follow.

Personally I'm so thankful for the Sabbath. Without it, in my field of work, I'd work 7days a week, sometimes 20 hours a day. I'm so glad that at the end of Creation week God set aside one day for rest and spiritual renewal.

Redfog


If at first you don't succeed.....destroy all evidence you ever tried.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74131
06/29/06 04:14 AM
06/29/06 04:14 AM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
Many don't really wish to do away with the law for any specific reason, like breaking the Sabbath, but because of their theological beliefs. Many know nothing about the Sabbath, but are against the idea of the Ten Commandments being in force, because they think we are under grace not under the law, like those who lived in the Old Testament. Adventists tend to know more about those who are familiar with the Sabbath, because they talk to them about it!

But you're right that many do use the argument as an excuse not to keep the Sabbath. And you're also right that it's a great blessing!


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74132
06/29/06 10:22 PM
06/29/06 10:22 PM
Redfog  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 733
Michigan, USA
It's a little sad and amusing that here in the US we are having debates about whether or not we can display facsimiles of the 10 commandments in public places, and the very people who are pushing to put them on display are Sunday keepers.

Redfog


If at first you don't succeed.....destroy all evidence you ever tried.
Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74133
06/30/06 03:48 PM
06/30/06 03:48 PM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
Quote.
James if the ten commandments are no longer valid is it no longer sin to disregard the Sabbath Is adultry no longer sin? If not why not?
Unquote.

Redfog, does the law of love justify adultery? Stealing? Killing?

Regarding Sabbath, in line with this thought, a rest from self righteousness by abiding in Christ through faith is the whole matter. Unlike the disobedient from Moses time, they would never enter God’ rest even they have a day of rest (7th day Sabbath), but Christ believers from nowadays may enter God’ rest at any day as long as it is still called today, for God has set a certain day called today.

In His love

James S

Re: Ten Commandments Abolished? #74134
06/30/06 03:56 PM
06/30/06 03:56 PM
J
James Saptenno  Offline
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
Quote.
Paul tells exactly why God formally gave the law. It was "added because of transgressions."
Unquote.

Exactly, it was added because of transgressions, otherwise if there is no law there is no transgressions (Romans 4:15), and if there is no transgression, no one should die. But sin and death was present even there is no law, only sin would not be imputed if there is no law (Romans 5:13,14), and if sin is not imputed there should be no death as the wages of sin.

Could you see the chain of reaction IF THERE IS NO LAW?

Therefore, it was added because of transgressions.

In His love

James S

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