Since Jesus is an example of a born again believer why do we insist that they begin imperfect and eventually become perfect?

Since sin is not dealt with in the holy place why do we teach that sanctification is the process of slowly overcoming our moral defects of character?

Since the priest is an example of a born again believer why do we say we begin defect and then become perfect? Why don't we teach that self must first be crucified and buried before we can be born again?

Are we confusing the process of conversion with the product of conversion? According to the sanctuary illustration self is first crucified at the altar in the outer court, and then buried in the laver. And when we emerge from the laver we are born again a new man in Christ. At which point we immediately enter the holy place where we imitate the example of Jesus maturing in the fruit of the Spirit through Bible study, prayer, fellowship and outreach, which have nothing to do with sinning and repenting (all that happens and is accommodated outside the holy place).

How can we, using the sanctuary as our guide, teach that born again believers begin imperfect and gradually become perfect bouncing back and forth between the outer court and the holy place in and out of the sanctuary sinning and repenting?

Doesn't the sanctuary clearly teach that sin and self is first crucified and buried before we are born again a new man in Christ?

Have you read the Christ object lessons on the parable of the talents? Such good references for this subject, also "without a wedding garment". One does not overcome his sins then comes to God for a new birth.....One must be born again so God can work the miracle of reformation, recreation and a life of the new man.

Tit 2:14 "Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works."

Jam 4:8 "Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse [your] hands, [ye] sinners; and purify [your] hearts, [ye] double minded."

Mat 5:48 "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

Those that are translated when Christ appears in the clouds, will have fulfilled all the requiremnts of God. The promise of Eternal life is a free gift but all promises are conditional.

On the Day of Atonement the sanctuary was cleansed of all sin. The sanctuary is a representation of God’s people. “Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?” 1 Corinthians 3:16. Likewise, on our personal Day of Atonement, which is when our name comes up in the Judgment, we will be cleansed of all sin. The Judgment is not something to be feared as many do, but rather something to look forward to!

“And the serpent saith unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die; For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.” Genesis 3:4-5. When Satan told Eve that when she ate the fruit of the tree she would gain a knowledge of evil, he was right. “The only knowledge they gained by their disobedience was a knowledge of sin and its results.” AUCR March 1, 1904. The knowledge of sin through experience is the definition of a sinful nature. When this experiential knowledge is removed from our minds then we will no longer have a sinful nature. Removing sin from our minds is the work of the Judgment.

“For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. For then would they not have ceased to be offered? Because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.” Hebrews 10:1-2. The subject of this text is obtaining perfection and it says that the sacrificial system was not sufficient to make us perfect. Then this text goes on to say that when God’s people are perfected (purged) they would have no more conscience of sins.” The word conscience, according to Strong’s Concordance, can also mean knowledge. This text is saying that when we are cleansed (perfected, purged) then we will have no more knowledge of sins, bringing us back to the perfect nature.

In the Bible the words “blot,” “purge,” and “cleanse” all mean the same thing and can be used interchangeably. Here’s the proof. “Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy loving kindness; according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies BLOT out my transgressions. Wash me thoroughly from mine iniquity, and CLEANSE me from my sin. PURGE me with hyssop, and I shall be CLEAN; wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.” Psalm 51:1-2,7. When God cleanses us from all sin, which happens on our Judgment Day, then we are perfected and given the new nature. What wonderful news! This is the message of the Day of Atonement and as we observe this day we keep this wonderful news in mind.

“You will talk and we will not be thinking of ourselves and what others are doing, but what God and Jesus are doing…What are they doing? They are CLEANSING the SANCTUARY OF OUR SOULS of all unrighteousness, that our names may be written in the Lamb’s book of life, that our sins may be BLOTTED out when the times of REFRESHING shall come from the presence of the Lord.” Lift Him Up, p. 216.

The dead are given this gift of perfection after they are in the grave so that when they rise up at the resurrection they are perfect. This happens during the Judgment of the Dead, which is now going on and has been since The Day of Atonement in 1844.

When does the Judgment of the Living begin? Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.” Acts 3:19. The Judgment of the Living begins during the refreshing, or Latter Rain of the Holy Spirit, which happens during the Time of Trouble. The last generation is the ONLY generation to receive this wonderful gift while they are still alive. This gift enables them to go through the seven last plagues, which happens after the close of probation, without a mediator and without sinning. God’s people cannot sin during that time because there is no mediator. God knows this and so He gives them the gift of perfection before the close of probation. When we are perfect then it is easier to do good than to do evil. God’s people by this time will hate evil so much that they are no longer tempted by evil.

“So, in the time of trouble, if the people of God had unconfessed sins to appear before them while tortured with fear and anguish, they would be overwhelmed; despair would cut off their faith, and they could not have confidence to plead with God for deliverance. But while they have a deep sense of their unworthiness, they have no concealed wrongs to reveal. Their sins have gone beforehand to judgment and have been blotted out, and they cannot bring them to remembrance.” Great Controversy, p. 620.

“Those only who through faith in Christ obey all of God’s commandments will reach the condition of sinlessness in which Adam lived before his transgression.” Ellen White’s comments in Bible Commentary, Vol. 6, p. 1118. “There is no change of character when Christ comes.” Review and Herald, August 25, 1885. The change of character is done on Judgment Day.

What wonderful news!

Jean, thank you for those thought provoking words. But I have always believed that we crucify our old man habits of sin or character imperfections under the influence of the early rain, and that during the latter rain our memory and record of sin is blotted out, so that we cannot recall our specific sins any more, and that we will receive our sinless flesh nature when Jesus returns and gives us a new body.

I see Mary saying NO, No to her Darling child when he wanted to do something harmful or wrong. I see we are told very little about the raising of this perfect child other than:

Luk 2:40 "And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.

Luk 2:52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man."

charlene: These two scriptures may also be said about the Baby Christian as he takes his first steps till he reaches maturity.

Do we not see the new convert waxing stronger and stronger gaining god's wisdom as he studies His word? Is the new born again Christian incresing in favor with God and man in his Christian growth. Do you see Jesus walking without a stumble? do you see Jesus running without a fall.? i can't believe that one completely gives ones heart to God and submits his will to Him that satan does not come in like a roaring lion and seeks whom he can devour.

Mike what does it meen to have your life hidden in Christ while you are walking the straight and narrow.? What does it mean to be wearing Christ's robe as we climb the steps to character perfection.? Taking steps are one at a time, not a quantum leap. Why is a saving relationship sanctification a process?

In Heavenly Places---Infinite Power----PG- 17
"The only-begotten Son of God came to this world to redeem the fallen race. He has given us evidence of His great power. He will enable those who receive Him to build up characters free from all the tendencies that Satan reveals. We can resist the enemy and all his forces. The battle will be won, the victory gained, by him who chooses Christ as his leader, determined to do right because it is right. "

When this choice is made.....The building begins...New Birth. Reformation, turning around ones life.....new heart being put into place....new spirit guiding, teaching, prompting, learning new ways. Process started.

Ellen White is clear that there is no change of character at the Second Coming. “There is no change of character when Christ comes.” Review and Herald, August 25, 1885. Thus, we must have received moral perfection BEFORE the Second Coming. At the Second Coming we receive perfect bodies, or Glorification, which is immortality.

To recap, the perfect mind is completed at Judgment Day and the perfect body is completed at the Second Coming.

The last generation has to go through the Seven Last Plagues without a mediator in the Sanctuary, since Jesus stops His mediation with the close of probation. This means that during the time of the Seven Last Plagues God's people CANNOT sin because there is no mediator to deal with their sin. This leaves a terrible dilemma if we are still in our sinful nature, because in our sinful nature we sin all the time.

Examine the following quote carefully:

"The religious services, the prayers, the praise, the penitent confession of sin ascend from TRUE BELIEVERS as incense to the heavenly sanctuary, but passing through the corrupt channels of humanity, they are so defiled that unless purified by blood, they can never be of value with God. THEY ASCEND NOT IN SPOTLESS PURITY, and unless the Intercessor, who is at God's right hand, presents and purifies all by His righteousness, it is not acceptable to God." Selected Messages, Vol. 1, p. 344.

This quote is stating that the prayers of the righteous people of God, as long as they are in their sinful nature, are so corrupt that without Jesus' mediation, are too corrupt for God to hear.

This quote is not talking about the wicked--but rather the righteous! So, if we are that polluted in our sinful state, then, in order to stand without a mediator, then God HAS to give us the new nature BEFORE the Seven Last Plagues or else we don't stand a chance!

I realized all this before I came to an understanding of this truth and used to agonize over how I would stand through that time without a mediator without sinning. Now, I know that through the wonderful mercy of God He has provided a way of escape! When I fully understood this beautiful truth what a weight fell off my shoulders! And, my love for God increased tremendously! He isn't going to put us in a terrible bind during that time. He has made a way of escape!

The sad part is, because so many don't understand this truth, some are falling off on the right side and some on the left regarding this subject. In other words, one popular minister, whom I'm sure recognizes this dilemma, has written a book entitled Never Without An Intercessor. This book stated that God's people have an intercessor during the time of the Seven Last Plagues--in blatant defiance of Ellen White's quote where she plainly says we don't. Others on the other side are lowering the meaning of perfection, saying things like "as long as Jesus' blood covers us we are as perfect as is possible." Yes, Jesus' blood covering us is Justification--the first step, which is IMPUTED righteousness. But, if one studies thoroughly, one finds out that we also have to participate in IMPARTED righteousness, which is what sanctification and purification are all about. Preaching imputed righteousness only (righteousness on the credit card principle although in reality we are not righteous) is a false balance if we leave out sanctificaton and purification and lowers the standard of perfection.

In order to participate in purification (when we are given the new nature and our minds are made totally perfect) we have to participate in both Justification (imputed righteousness) AND Sanctification (imparted righteousness). The Bible makes this clear. Here's the text: "For by one offering He hath PERFECTED for ever them that are SANCTIFIED." Hebrews 10:14. God is saying here that He will perfect those who are participating in Sanctificaton and if one is truly participating in Sanctification then they have to also be participating in Justification because without Justification there is no Sanctification.

Anyway, I thought that perhaps there are some of you out there who have also been wrestling with this like I used to be, and I wish for you the wonderful PEACE, LOVE, AND JOY that one receives when they fully understand this beautiful truth.

[ March 13, 2002: Message edited by: Jean Miller ]

quote:

---

RH, September 19, 1912

Peter's Last Epistle and His Death

In the second letter addressed by Peter to those who had obtained "like precious faith" with himself, the apostle sets forth the divine plan for the development of Christian character. He writes:

"Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord, according as his divine power hath unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

"And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; and to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; and to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ."

These words are full of instruction, and strike the key-note of victory. The apostle presents before the believers the ladder of Christian perfection, every step of which represents continual advancement in the knowledge of God, and in the climbing of which there is to be no standstill. Faith, virtue, knowledge, temperance, patience, godliness, brotherly kindness, and charity are the rounds of the ladder. We are saved by climbing round after round, mounting step after step, to the height of Christ's ideal for us. Thus he is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption.

God has called his people to glory and virtue, and these will be manifest in the lives of all who are truly connected with him. Having become partakers of the heavenly gift, they are to go on to perfection, being "kept by the power of God through faith." It is the glory of God to give his virtue to his children. He desires to see men and women reaching the highest standard; and when by faith they lay hold of the power of Christ, when they plead his unfailing promises, and claim them as their own, when with an importunity that will not be denied they seek for the power of the Holy Spirit, they will be made complete in him.

Having received the faith of the gospel, the next work of the believer is to add to his character virtue, and thus cleanse the heart and prepare the mind for the reception of the knowledge of God. This knowledge is the foundation of all true education and of all true service. It is the only real safeguard against temptation; and it is this alone that can make one like God in character. Through the knowledge of God and of his Son Jesus Christ, are given to the believer "all things that pertain unto life and godliness." No good gift is withheld from him who sincerely desires to obtain the righteousness of God.

"This is life eternal," Christ said, "that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." And the prophet Jeremiah declared: "Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches: but let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the Lord which exercise loving-kindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the Lord." Scarcely can the human mind comprehend the breadth and depth and height of the spiritual attainments of him who gains this knowledge.

None need fail of attaining, in his sphere, to perfection of Christian character. By the sacrifice of Christ, provision has been made for the believer to receive all things that pertain to life and godliness. God calls upon us to reach the standard of perfection, and places before us the example of Christ's character. In his humanity, perfected by a life of constant resistance of evil, the Saviour showed that through cooperation with divinity human beings may in this life attain to perfection of a character. This is God's assurance to us that we too may obtain complete victory.

Before the believer is held out the wonderful possibility of being like Christ, obedient to all the principles of the law. But of himself man is utterly unable to reach this condition. The holiness that God's Word declares he must have before he can be saved, is the result of the working of divine grace, as he bows in submission to the discipline and restraining influences of the Spirit of truth. Man's obedience can be made perfect only by the incense of Christ's righteousness, which fills with divine fragrance every act of obedience. [b/The part of the Christian is to persevere in overcoming every fault. Constantly he is to pray to the Saviour to heal the disorders of his sinsick soul.[/b] He has not the wisdom nor the strength to overcome; these belong to the Lord, and he bestows them on those who in humiliation and contrition seek him for help.

The work of transformation from unholiness to holiness is a continuous one. Day by day God labors for man's sanctification, and man is to cooperate with him, putting forth persevering efforts in the cultivation of right habits. He is to add grace to grace; and as he thus works on the plan of addition, God works for him on the plan of multiplication. He is always ready to hear and answer the prayer of the contrite heart, and grace and peace are multiplied to his faithful ones. Gladly he grants them the blessings that they need in their struggle against the evils that beset them.

There are those who attempt to ascend the ladder of Christian progress; but as they advance, they begin to put their trust in the power of man, and soon lose sight of Jesus, the author and finisher of their faith. The result is failure--the loss of all that has been gained. Sad indeed is the condition of those who, becoming weary of the way, allow the enemy of souls to rob them of the Christian graces that have been developing in their hearts and lives. "He that lacketh these things," declares the apostle, "is blind, and can not see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins."

The apostle Peter had had a long experience in the things of God. His faith in God's power to save had strengthened with the years, until he had proved beyond question that there is no possibility of failure before the one who, advancing by faith, ascends round by round, ever upward and onward, to the topmost round of the ladder that reaches even to the portals of heaven.

---