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Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: Charity] #139181
01/26/12 09:39 PM
01/26/12 09:39 PM
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Peter L  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mark Shipowick
Quote:
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. Dan 7:25


The above text is the first place the 1260 days are mentioned in scripture. The same period is referred to in Daniel 12 and again in Revelation 11 and 13. Regarding Revelation 13 Ellen White says all of it applies to the future:

Quote:
The Sabbath question will be the issue in the great conflict in which all the world will act a part. [Rev. 13:4-10 quoted.] This entire chapter is a revelation of what will surely take place [Rev. 13:11, 15-17 quoted] (MS 88, 1897).


Daniel 7 continues:

Quote:
But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. Daniel 7:26.


The sequence we have in Daniel 7 is that while the Little Horn speaks blasphemies against God and His people, the court of heaven convenes. This cannot be referring only to 1844 because the Man of Sin had received the mortal wound 46 years earlier in 1798 and was silent. The picture we have here is that while the mouth of the little horn is speaking great words heaven’s court convenes. This portends the transition from the judgment of the dead that began in 1844 to the judgment of the living at the latter rain.


Daniel 7:25
(25) And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.


Romans 6:16
(16) Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: Charity] #139235
01/28/12 08:59 AM
01/28/12 08:59 AM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Mark Shipowick
Quote:
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. Dan 7:25


The above text is the first place the 1260 days are mentioned in scripture. The same period is referred to in Daniel 12 and again in Revelation 11 and 13. Regarding Revelation 13 Ellen White says all of it applies to the future:

Quote:
The Sabbath question will be the issue in the great conflict in which all the world will act a part. [Rev. 13:4-10 quoted.] This entire chapter is a revelation of what will surely take place [Rev. 13:11, 15-17 quoted] (MS 88, 1897).


Daniel 7 continues:

Quote:
But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. Daniel 7:26.


The sequence we have in Daniel 7 is that while the Little Horn speaks blasphemies against God and His people, the court of heaven convenes. This cannot be referring only to 1844 because the Man of Sin had received the mortal wound 46 years earlier in 1798 and was silent. The picture we have here is that while the mouth of the little horn is speaking great words heaven’s court convenes. This portends the transition from the judgment of the dead that began in 1844 to the judgment of the living at the latter rain.


Another reason for linking the first angels message the judgment of the living is this statement from EGW:
Quote:
I saw that God had children who do not see and keep the Sabbath. They have not rejected the light upon it. And at the commencement of the time of trouble, we were filled with the Holy Ghost as we went forth and proclaimed the Sabbath more fully. This enraged the churches and nominal Adventists, as they could not refute the Sabbath truth. And at this time God's chosen all saw clearly that we had the truth, and they came out and endured the persecution with us. I saw the sword, famine, pestilence, and great confusion in the land. The wicked thought that we had brought the judgments upon them, and they rose up and took counsel to rid the earth of us, thinking that then the evil would be stayed. {EW 33 and 34.}


Notice that it's at the "commencement of the time of [little] time of trouble" that the Holy Spirit empowers the message. Some major event will trouble the world and arrest it's attention. The mighty angel of Revelation 10 along with the angel of Revelation 14 and the angel of Revelation 18 will utter their voices to give the final warning message that the "hour of His judgment is come," interpreting the event(s).

Peter, sorry I'm not clear on what you're saying in your last post.

Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: Charity] #139259
01/28/12 09:04 PM
01/28/12 09:04 PM
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Charity  Offline OP
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In the following statement, EGW links the mighty angel of Revelation 10 with a future message that arrests the world's attention. How will the angel demand attention? I'll concede that it could simply be by the power of the Holy Spirit speaking through consecrated men, similar to the great awakening under William Miller; but if we put all of the inspired texts together, it seems more likely that there will be some events that are global in scope that will focus the world's attention our present truth, judgment hour message:
Quote:
The mighty angel who instructed John was no less a personage than Jesus Christ. Setting His right foot on the sea, and His left upon the dry land, shows the part which He is acting in the closing scenes of the great controversy with Satan. This position denotes His supreme power and authority over the whole earth. The controversy had waxed stronger and more determined from age to age, and will continue to do so, to the concluding scenes when the masterly working of the powers of darkness shall reach their height. Satan, united with evil men, will deceive the whole world and the churches who receive not the love of the truth. But the mighty angel demands attention. He cries with a loud voice. He is to show [future tense] the power and authority of His voice to those who have united with Satan to oppose the truth. {7BC 971.3}


This last part of the quote agrees with Daniel 7 where the little horn is judged at the height of it's power during that future time when it again speak blasphemies, uniting with "Satan to oppose the truth".

Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: Charity] #139265
01/28/12 11:28 PM
01/28/12 11:28 PM
jamesonofthunder  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mark Shipowick

Notice that it's at the "commencement of the time of [little] time of trouble" that the Holy Spirit empowers the message. Some major event will trouble the world and arrest it's attention. The mighty angel of Revelation 10 along with the angel of Revelation 14 and the angel of Revelation 18 will utter their voices to give the final warning message that the "hour of His judgment is come," interpreting the event(s).


This is exactly right. The major event that will trouble the world is the revealing of Satan as an angel of light, coming as the eighth King of Rev 17, then immediately afterwards is the "angel that cries with a mighty voice' which was originally proclaimed before the great disappointment of 1844. The loud cry of Rev 18 begins by proclaiming that Babylon has become "Inhabited by demons".

Quote; "The saints must get a thorough understanding of present truth, which they will be obliged to maintain from the Scriptures. They must understand the state of the dead, for the spirits of devils will yet appear to them, professing to be beloved friends and relatives, who will declare to them that the Sabbath has been changed, also other unscriptural doctrines.—Early Writings, 87 (1854). {LDE 156.3}

The apostles, as personated by these lying spirits, are made to contradict what they wrote at the dictation of the Holy Spirit when on earth. They deny the divine origin of the Bible.—The Great Controversy, 557 (1911). {LDE 157.1}

Through the two great errors, the immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness, Satan will bring the people under his deceptions. While the former lays the foundation of spiritualism, the latter creates a bond of sympathy with Rome.—The Great Controversy, 588 (1911). {LDE 157.2}


'But the people of God will not be misled. The teachings of this false christ are not in accordance with the Scriptures. His blessing is pronounced upon the worshipers of the beast and his image, the very class upon whom the Bible declares that God’s unmingled wrath shall be poured out.'—The Great Controversy, 624, 625 (1911). {LDE 157.4}

This is the last great conflict before Jesus comes that will unite the world in error.


Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: jamesonofthunder] #139267
01/29/12 05:06 AM
01/29/12 05:06 AM
jamesonofthunder  Offline
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So this pope dies... Satan, coming in the form of number six of the previous seven Kings, which would be John Paul II, appears to have been resurrected from the dead. As this is happening other demons impersonate some of the apostles, who lead the Ten Horns on the last phase of the Rome beast recorded in Rev 17 to lend their power to the beast for one hour (two literal weeks). The Spirit of Prophecy states that the ten horns represent the protestant churches in America, so these apostate apostle apparitions lead the protestant churches to unite with the Satanic resurrection of the worlds most beloved pope. This will be quite dramatic.


Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: jamesonofthunder] #139268
01/29/12 05:07 AM
01/29/12 05:07 AM
jamesonofthunder  Offline
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Imagine the movie that could be made on this story line eh?


Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: jamesonofthunder] #139272
01/29/12 04:10 PM
01/29/12 04:10 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder

So this pope dies... Satan, coming in the form of number six of the previous seven Kings, which would be John Paul II, appears to have been resurrected from the dead. As this is happening other demons impersonate some of the apostles, who lead the Ten Horns on the last phase of the Rome beast recorded in Rev 17 to lend their power to the beast for one hour (two literal weeks). The Spirit of Prophecy states that the ten horns represent the protestant churches in America, so these apostate apostle apparitions lead the protestant churches to unite with the Satanic resurrection of the worlds most beloved pope. This will be quite dramatic.

James, did Jesus show you in a dream or vision that Satan will impersonate John Paul II after Benedict dies? Also, where in the SOP does Ellen say the "ten horns represent the protestant churches in America"?

Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: jamesonofthunder] #139299
01/30/12 11:11 AM
01/30/12 11:11 AM
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Peter L  Offline
Active Member 2012
Regular Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 89
Australia
Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder

So this pope dies... Satan, coming in the form of number six of the previous seven Kings, which would be John Paul II, appears to have been resurrected from the dead. As this is happening other demons impersonate some of the apostles, who lead the Ten Horns on the last phase of the Rome beast recorded in Rev 17 to lend their power to the beast for one hour (two literal weeks). The Spirit of Prophecy states that the ten horns represent the protestant churches in America, so these apostate apostle apparitions lead the protestant churches to unite with the Satanic resurrection of the worlds most beloved pope. This will be quite dramatic.


The problem with the theory of the 7 headed beast in Rev 17 being the Papacy is that the whore is the Papacy and the beast and horns turn on the whore at the end of Rev 17

Last edited by Peter L; 01/30/12 11:11 AM.

Romans 6:16
(16) Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: jamesonofthunder] #139460
02/04/12 08:06 PM
02/04/12 08:06 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian

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Posts: 25,121
Nova Scotia, Canada
From where did this idea originate?

Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder

So this pope dies... Satan, coming in the form of number six of the previous seven Kings, which would be John Paul II, appears to have been resurrected from the dead. As this is happening other demons impersonate some of the apostles, who lead the Ten Horns on the last phase of the Rome beast recorded in Rev 17 to lend their power to the beast for one hour (two literal weeks). The Spirit of Prophecy states that the ten horns represent the protestant churches in America, so these apostate apostle apparitions lead the protestant churches to unite with the Satanic resurrection of the worlds most beloved pope. This will be quite dramatic.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Judgment of the Living - Where is it in Scripture? [Re: Peter L] #139925
02/20/12 02:11 AM
02/20/12 02:11 AM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Peter L
The problem with the theory of the 7 headed beast in Rev 17 being the Papacy is that the whore is the Papacy and the beast and horns turn on the whore at the end of Rev 17


James or anyone, what's your thinking on this. Is the whore the Papacy? Why or why not and what are the implications.

Also, James, I was reading your "Eight King" blog and you state that the judgment of the living began during the reign of John Paul II. Can you say more about that here?

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