this gives me a very high goal to want to copy. the other view just gives me a picture of another Person struggling with temptation-self-centered.

Jesus was other-centered. His hours spent in prayer and communing with the Father were not about overcoming temptation, but for strength, power and wisdom to show us the Father, and His holiness, to continually give to others.

"post-laps" have never given me that picture. the bible and egw do.

Well, substitute the chocolate for sleezy women...it doesn't matter what the temptation was, Jesus responded the same way every time. You find no record of Him struggling with sexual sin, ever. When he saw a provocative women, His first and only reaction was to help her recover from her sin...lust didn't have any hold on Him whatsoever. After all, she was a child of His.

It is true, Satan was there parading sleezy women in front of Him many times, trying to find something in Him to arouse....but he always failed.



If, when Satan comes to us, he is still able to find something somewhere in us, it doesn't matter where, ...if he can find ANYTHING in us that responds to his temptations...then....we are not safe to save. That is why we are still here! Jesus could have come a long time ago, He is only waiting for a people who reflect His character...but unfortunately, many are copying a wrong pattern...and they don't realize it...and they haven't made the connection in their minds yet, that this is the very reason that the Lord has not come back.

When people talk about "the flesh" and how our flesh will always desire sin....that is just an excuse to sin. What is your flesh? Your arms, your legs, your body, right? Your arms, legs and your body, they don't desire sin....they only do the bidding of your mind & your heart...it all has to do with the mind, not "the flesh"....that is why Jesus said, "Let this mind be in you..." and "I will give you a new heart..."

Sure, our bodies get physically hungery, and tired....but that doesn't make us desire sin. Jesus got physically hungry and tired, too.... Clearly we are told He took the nature of Adam after the Fall.

Well...must run! Happy New Year to you all!

the basic problem is making the assumption that those of us opposed to the wording and thought of this topic have anything to do with this "fordian gospel". once that thought is destroyed, what is actually written might be "heard".

Amid impurity, Christ maintained His purity. Satan could not stain or corrupt it. His character revealed a perfect hatred for sin. ...(ST May 10, 1899). {5BC 1142.8}

O, if every one could see this matter as it is presented before me in all its bearings, how soon would they quit with the enemy in his artful work! How they would despise his measures to bring sin upon the human family! How they would hate sin with a perfect hatred, as they consider the fact that it cost the life of heaven's Commander, in order that they should not perish, that man should not be bound a hopeless captive to Satan's chariot, a degraded slave to his will, a trophy of his victory and his kingdom. {FE 291.2}

Well I dont know about just 'sleezy women' causing sin, I think its more people seeking the pleasures of sin and let it lock in and affect their minds and hearts away from God...

2 Timothy 3:4
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;

Titus 3:3
For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

Temptation is enticement to sin, and this does not proceed from God, but from Satan and from the evil of our own hearts. {MB 116.2}

That is an excellent point, Theresa. I couldn't be further, myself, from Fordism.... And yet, so many automatically think that is what I am, because I believe that Jesus had no desire to sin. For, clearly we are told that He hated sin with a "perfect hatred".

Surely everyone has overcome some sin in their lifetime...perhaps it is smoking as an example. I've heard many say who used to smoke, now that they have quit, that they hate it, it is repulsive. That is how all sin must become to us, replusive.

That is an excellent point, Theresa. I couldn't be further, myself, from Fordism.... And yet, so many automatically think that is what I am, because I believe that Jesus had no desire to sin. For, clearly we are told that He hated sin with a "perfect hatred".



And, we too, can and must come to the point where we hate sin with a perfect hatred -


It is impossible to hate sin with a perfect hatred and at the same time have an inner desire for sin....

Surely everyone has overcome some sin in their lifetime...perhaps it is smoking as an example. I've heard many say who used to smoke, now that they have quit, that they hate it, it is repulsive. That is how all sin must become to us, replusive. Sin was repulsive to Jesus....and so it will be to His people also.

Much of the temptations we experience from within are due to our having inherited a fallen nature. Christ took upon His own sinless nature our fallen nature. He accepted the workings of the great law of heredity in order to "share our temptations." He could only "share" them if He experienced them.

Well, substitute the chocolate for sleezy women...it doesn't matter what the temptation was, Jesus responded the same way every time. You find no record of Him struggling with sexual sin, ever. When he saw a provocative women, His first and only reaction was to help her recover from her sin...lust didn't have any hold on Him whatsoever. After all, she was a child of His.