i dont hear tom saying what you are hearing. again i guess it is a matter of perspective.

guilt trip, not buying!!

I got that from this:
I took that to mean that you didn't think it was too big a deal that God withheld rain, since there was food to be found elsewhere.

Normally I would ask rather than assume. But you don't like to be "interrogated" so I am left to make assumptions about what you mean.

I'll take this opportunity to say that it is very difficult studying with you. You don't like it when people make assumptions, but you don't like it when people ask you questions to clarify things. You want to talk about each plague one at a time, but you don't like it when MM addresses each plague one at a time. You say you don't disagree with my post, then say that you don't like what I said.

I would ask you how you want to go about it, but that would be "interrogation" again. So I am left to assume that "studying" with you will be a long process, that may or may not lead to anything of import. Perhaps someday you will come to regard plainly pointing out truth and error in the belief of others and yourself will not be such a painful experience associated with evil and hatred, but an opportunity to learn and grow. Then we can proceed much more quickly.

The prophets of Baal did not wake up, and will not wake up until the end of the Millennium.

we are referring to different points.

Exo 7:15 Get thee unto Pharaoh in the morning; lo, he goeth out unto the water; and thou shalt stand by the river's brink against he come; and the rod which was turned to a serpent shalt thou take in thine hand.
Exo 7:16 And thou shalt say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath sent me unto thee, saying, Let my people go, that they may serve me in the wilderness: and, behold, hitherto thou wouldest not hear.
Exo 7:17 Thus saith the LORD, In this thou shalt know that I am the LORD: behold, I will smite with the rod that is in mine hand upon the waters which are in the river, and they shall be turned to blood.
Exo 7:18 And the fish that is in the river shall die, and the river shall stink; and the Egyptians shall lothe to drink of the water of the river.
Exo 7:19 And the LORD spake unto Moses, Say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and stretch out thine hand upon the waters of Egypt, upon their streams, upon their rivers, and upon their ponds, and upon all their pools of water, that they may become blood; and that there may be blood throughout all the land of Egypt, both in vessels of wood, and in vessels of stone.
Exo 7:20 And Moses and Aaron did so, as the LORD commanded; and he lifted up the rod, and smote the waters that were in the river, in the sight of Pharaoh, and in the sight of his servants; and all the waters that were in the river were turned to blood.
Exo 7:21 And the fish that was in the river died; and the river stank, and the Egyptians could not drink of the water of the river; and there was blood throughout all the land of Egypt.
Exo 7:22 And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaoh's heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said.
Exo 7:23 And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also.
Exo 7:24 And all the Egyptians digged round about the river for water to drink; for they could not drink of the water of the river.
Exo 7:25 And seven days were fulfilled, after that the LORD had smitten the river.
so it is quite possible that God withdrew His protection and allowed that algae to take over.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_tide
(http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/topics/redtide/)

what is coming up for me in certain discussions and subsequent studies is the awareness of how much God is protecting us, that is why i would like to explore the plagues and other incidences. i think we will see Gods love more clearly.

sounds contradictory doesnt it?

magician may not give the right idea, i think. the definition sounds more like a witch/warlock. H2748 From the same as H2747; a horoscopist (as drawing magical lines or circles): - magician.

if all the waters had already been turned into "blood" how could the magicians appear to do the same?

Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
if this is why for the 7 last plagues is it the same reasoning for the egyptians? they had enslaved the hebrews, killed the baby boys at one time and probably killed whomever of the hebrews they wanted to.

if the algae might have applied to the egyptian plagues, as in God holding it back, in the last plagues it could apply to the oceans here. Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.

but when it comes to Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. that seems to apply more to the pollution we are causing which we have some laws that protect up to a point, but then we are told when probation ends laws will be made....and im wondering if we are just limiting the laws that will be made to sunday or death penalty laws when it could be broader. if the Spirit has been finally rejected and withdrawn then there will be nothing to hold man back from making whatever laws he wishes to further money-making schemes.

but ultimately we need, today, to be in a constant state of thanksgiving:how much could be happening if it werent for God second-by-second protecting us by restraining evil?

from clarke:

Exo 7:18
The Egyptians shall loathe to drink of the water - The force of this expression cannot be well felt without taking into consideration the peculiar pleasantness and great salubrity of the waters of the Nile. “The water of Egypt,” says the Abbe Mascrier, “is so delicious, that one would not wish the heat to be less, or to be delivered from the sensation of thirst. The Turks find it so exquisite that they excite themselves to drink of it by eating salt. It is a common saying among them, that if Mohammed had drank of it he would have besought God that he might never die, in order to have had this continual gratification. When the Egyptians undertake the pilgrimage of Mecca, or go out of their country on any other account, they speak of nothing but the pleasure they shall have at their return in drinking of the waters of the Nile. There is no gratification to be compared to this; it surpasses, in their esteem, that of seeing their relations and families. All those who have tasted of this water allow that they never met with the like in any other place. When a person drinks of it for the first time he can scarcely be persuaded that it is not a water prepared by art; for it has something in it inexpressibly agreeable and pleasing to the taste; and it should have the same rank among waters that champaign has among wines. But its most valuable quality is, that it is exceedingly salutary. It never incommodes, let it be drank in what quantity it may: this is so true that it is no uncommon thing to see some persons drink three buckets of it in a day without the least inconvenience! When I pass such encomiums on the water of Egypt it is right to observe that I speak only of that of the Nile, which indeed is the only water drinkable, for their well water is detestable and unwholesome. Fountains are so rare that they are a kind of prodigy in that country; and as to rain water, that is out of the question, as scarcely any falls in Egypt.” “A person,” says Mr. Harmer, “who never before heard of the deliciousness of the Nile water, and of the large quantities which on that account are drank of it, will, I am sure, find an energy in those words of Moses to Pharaoh, The Egyptians shall loathe to drink of the water of the river, which he never observed before. They will loathe to drink of that water which they used to prefer to all the waters of the universe; loathe to drink of that for which they had been accustomed to long, and will rather choose to drink of well water, which in their country is detestable!” - Observations, vol. iii., p. 564.


The plague of the bloody waters may be considered as a display of retributive justice against the Egyptians, for the murderous decree which enacted that all the male children of the Israelites should be drowned in that river, the waters of which, so necessary to their support and life, were now rendered not only insalubrious but deadly, by being turned into blood.

As it is well known that the Nile was a chief object of Egyptian idolatry, (See Clarke’s note on Exo_7:15), and that annually they sacrificed a girl, or as others say, both a boy and a girl, to this river, in gratitude for the benefits received from it, (Universal Hist., vol. i., p. 178, fol. edit)., God might have designed this plague as a punishment for such cruelty: and the contempt poured upon this object of their adoration, by turning its waters into blood, and rendering them fetid and corrupt, must have had a direct tendency to correct their idolatrous notions, and lead them to acknowledge the power and authority of the true God.

barnes:

Exo 7:15
He goeth out unto the water - The Nile was worshipped under various names and symbols; at Memphis especially, as Hapi, i. e. Apis, the sacred bull, or living representation of Osiris, of whom the river was regarded as the embodiment or manifestation. If, as is probable, the king went to offer his devotions, the miracle would have special force and suitableness. It was also the season of the yearly overflowing, about the middle of June; and the daily rise of the water was accurately recorded, under the personal superintendence of the king. In early inscriptions the Nilometer is the symbol of stability and providential care.

Exo 7:25
Seven days - This marks the duration of the plague. The natural discoloration of the Nile water lasts generally much longer, about 20 days.


Exo 7:17
Turned to blood - This miracle would bear a certain resemblance to natural phenomena, and therefore be one which Pharaoh might see with amazement and dismay, yet without complete conviction. It is well known that before the rise the water of the Nile is green and unfit to drink. About the 25th of June it becomes clear, and then yellow, and gradually reddish like ochre; an effect due to the presence of microscopic cryptogams and infusoria. The supernatural character of the visitation was tested by the suddenness of the change, by its immediate connection with the words and act of Moses, and by its effects. It killed the fish, and made the water unfit for use, neither of which results follows the annual discoloration.

this is by henrys commentary. i thought it was an interesting thought:


He sends for the magicians, and, by God's permission, they ape the miracle with their enchantments (Exo_7:22), and this serves Pharaoh for an excuse not to set his heart to this also (Exo_7:23), and a pitiful excuse it was. Could they have turned the river of blood into water again, this would have been something to the purpose; then they would have proved their power, and Pharaoh would have been obliged to them as his benefactors. But for them, when there was such scarcity of water, to turn more of it into blood, only to show their art, plainly intimates that the design of the devil is only to delude his devotees and amuse them, not to do them any real kindness, but to keep them from doing a real kindness to themselves by repenting and returning to their God.and this also:

The Egyptians, in the mean time, are seeking for relief against the plague, digging round about the river for water to drink, Exo_7:24. Probably they found some, with much ado, God remembering mercy in the midst of wrath; for he is full of compassion, and would not let the subjects smart too much for the obstinacy of their prince.