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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#124441
04/02/10 03:05 PM
04/02/10 03:05 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Tom, what you're saying sounds at odds with the following insight - "It is not necessary for us deliberately to choose the service of the kingdom of darkness in order to come under its dominion. We have only to neglect to ally ourselves with the kingdom of light." I don't see how. The same author wrote what I quoted: The light shining from the cross reveals the love of God. His love is drawing us to Himself. If we do not resist this drawing, we shall be led to the foot of the cross in repentance for the sins that have crucified the Saviour.(DA 175.5) To neglect requires resisting the drawing of the Holy Spirit, right? This seems clear.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Tom]
#124442
04/02/10 05:55 PM
04/02/10 05:55 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Again, we are lost by default. We must consciously choose to experience rebirth; and then we must continue to consciously choose to abide in Jesus and partake of the divine nature. True, people must resist the wooing influence of the Holy Spirit. However, doing so does not change our default status. It is no easy matter to change our status. It requires extreme effort to experience rebirth, and it requires continued extreme effort to stay converted. It is easier to be lost than it is to be saved. Ellen made this point crystal clear:
It is no easy matter to gain the priceless treasure of eternal life. {Mar 47.3}
The gaining of eternal life is no easy thing. {TMK 21.5}
It is difficult to depart from old customs and established ideas. {CT 392.1}
It is easier to learn evil than to eradicate it after it is learned. {CG 457.4}
It is easier to invite the enemy into your hearts than to dismiss him after he has the ground. {3T 325.3}
It is difficult to hold fast the beginning of our confidence firm unto the end; and the difficulty increases when there are hidden influences constantly at work to bring in another spirit, a counterworking element, on Satan's side of the question. {Mar 28.2}
In this time of special danger for the young, temptations surround them on every hand; and while it is easy to drift, the strongest effort is required in order to press against the current. {Ed 293.2}
It is difficult to arouse them to a sense of the shame and grievous nature of sin. {ML 146.3}
It is difficult to hold fast Christian integrity. {TMK 352.2}
Let self break in pieces before God. It is hard to do this; but we are warned to fall upon the Rock and be broken, else it will fall upon us, and grind us to powder. {HP 30.2}
Into the experience of all there come times of keen disappointment and utter discouragement--days when sorrow is the portion, and it is hard to believe that God is still the kind benefactor of His earth-born children; days when troubles harass the soul, till death seems preferable to life. It is then that many lose their hold on God and are brought into the slavery of doubt, the bondage of unbelief. {ML 328.2}
In many cases the moral powers seem deadened, and it is difficult to arouse them to a sense of the shame and grievous nature of sin; they slip easily into habits of prevarication, deceit, and often open lying. {CG 388.1}
We have trained ourselves to engage with earnestness and power in worldly business, until it is easy for the mind to take that turn. This is why Christians find a religious life so hard and a worldly life so easy. {2T 263.4}
To resist Satan's desires is no easy task. It demands a firm hold of the divine nature from beginning to end, or it cannot be done. {1SM 342.3}
It is easy for you to drop Christ out of your experience. {5T 586.3}
It is easy to rebel, easy to give battle before considering matters rationally, calmly, and settling whether there is anything to war against. {1T 527.1}
It is easy for the enemy to work through those who, themselves needing counsel at every step, undertake the guardianship of souls in their own strength, without having learned the lowliness of Christ. {AA 279.1}
Temptations surround them on every hand; and while it is easy work to float with the current, the strongest effort is required to press against the tide of evil. {4T 421.3}
The strongest evidence of man's fall from a higher state is the fact that it costs so much to return. The way of return can be gained only by hard fighting, inch by inch, hour by hour. In one moment, by a hasty, unguarded act, we may place ourselves in the power of evil; but it requires more than a moment to break the fetters and attain to a holier life. The purpose may be formed, the work begun; but its accomplishment will require toil, time, perseverance, patience, and sacrifice. {MH 452.2}
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: asygo]
#124444
04/02/10 08:27 PM
04/02/10 08:27 PM
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OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,126
Florida, USA
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If we know what is sin, and the cause and end result, why do we sin? Because we like it. Ahhhhhh.... Now we are getting closer to the truth, that Chocolate Moche Frappe with carmel dripping on the side with 88 grams of sugar and nearly 700 calories, tastes so good..........but in the end will take time but kill you as surely as a gun if you have it every morning. We just like sin because it pushes the pleasure zone in the chemicals in our brain, but why put pleasure in there if it always seems to lead to a vice...?
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Rick H]
#124460
04/03/10 03:28 AM
04/03/10 03:28 AM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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The chocolate desert isn't the sin - it's eating too much of it in one sitting. That's where abiding in Jesus comes in. In Christ we will exercise self-control and temperance. The nice thing about the chocolate desert is that even a small amount taste good.
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#124472
04/03/10 04:28 PM
04/03/10 04:28 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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RE: 124442 (a few posts above)
Is it easier to be lost than it is to be saved? Does it require more effort and energy to be lost than it does to be saved?
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Tom]
#124497
04/04/10 04:47 PM
04/04/10 04:47 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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1 a : to bring over from one belief, view, or party to another b : to bring about a religious conversion in This is the definition of "converted." Here is a description of being "born again." How, then, are we to be saved? "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness," so the Son of man has been lifted up, and everyone who has been deceived and bitten by the serpent may look and live. "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." John 1:29. The light shining from the cross reveals the love of God. His love is drawing us to Himself. If we do not resist this drawing, we shall be led to the foot of the cross in repentance for the sins that have crucified the Saviour. Then the Spirit of God through faith produces a new life in the soul. The thoughts and desires are brought into obedience to the will of Christ. The heart, the mind, are created anew in the image of Him who works in us to subdue all things to Himself. Then the law of God is written in the mind and heart, and we can say with Christ, "I delight to do Thy will, O my God." Ps. 40:8. {DA 175.5} Being "born again" represents the transformation which takes place when one gives up the old way, the old paradigm ("me first"), exchanging it for God's way, ("agape"), captured by the phrase, "Not I, but Christ." This is evidently conversion.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Tom]
#124510
04/04/10 10:08 PM
04/04/10 10:08 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Tom, this thread is discussing why we sin. Sorry I deviated off topic.
Do you agree it is easier to be lost than it is to be saved? And, do you agree this accounts for one of the many reasons why we sin so often and so readily?
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#124518
04/05/10 01:07 AM
04/05/10 01:07 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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M:Do you agree it is easier to be lost than it is to be saved? The following comes to mind: But the way to life is narrow and the entrance 139 strait. If you cling to any besetting sin you will find the way too narrow for you to enter. Your own ways, your own will, your evil habits and practices, must be given up if you would keep the way of the Lord. He who would serve Christ cannot follow the world's opinions or meet the world's standard. Heaven's path is too narrow for rank and riches to ride in state, too narrow for the play of self-centered ambition, too steep and rugged for lovers of ease to climb. Toil, patience, self-sacrifice, reproach, poverty, the contradiction of sinners against Himself, was the portion of Christ, and it must be our portion, if we ever enter the Paradise of God. {MB 138.4}
Yet do not therefore conclude that the upward path is the hard and the downward road the easy way. All along the road that leads to death there are pains and penalties, there are sorrows and disappointments, there are warnings not to go on. God's love has made it hard for the heedless and headstrong to destroy themselves. It is true that Satan's path is made to appear attractive, but it is all a deception; in the way of evil there are bitter remorse and cankering care. We may think it pleasant to follow pride and worldly ambition, but the end is pain and sorrow. Selfish plans may present flattering promises and hold out the hope of enjoyment, but we shall find that our happiness is poisoned and our life embittered by hopes that center in self. In the downward road the gateway may be bright with flowers, but thorns are in the path. The light of hope which shines from its entrance fades into the darkness of despair, and the soul who follows that path descends into the shadows of unending night. (MB 139;emphasis mine) This seems to be speaking to the difficulty of being lost, right? Also, Jesus' words come to mind, "Take my yoke upon you, for My yoke is easy and my burden is light."
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#124594
04/06/10 04:51 PM
04/06/10 04:51 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,429
Midland
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The chocolate desert isn't the sin - it's eating too much of it in one sitting. That's where abiding in Jesus comes in. In Christ we will exercise self-control and temperance. The nice thing about the chocolate desert is that even a small amount taste good. Sounds as if you are defining what sin is. Is eating something we know is wrong, is that sin or is that "temperance" or "moderation"? For instance you say the chocolate dessert isn't sin just eating too much is. The alcohol imbiber would use the same argument. Is eating the chocolate or sugar sinning? Or, if you know it is not healthy, that no amount can do you good, that you should not eat it, is the rebellion to go ahead and eat it anyway the sin? Is the rebellion why we sin? (Maybe we should ask teenagers or their parents)
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Re: Why do we sin?
[Re: Rick H]
#125270
05/08/10 06:25 AM
05/08/10 06:25 AM
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SDA Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
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If we know what is sin, and the cause and end result, why do we sin? Because we like it. that Chocolate Moche Frappe with carmel dripping on the side with 88 grams of sugar and nearly 700 calories, tastes so good..........but in the end will take time but kill you as surely as a gun if you have it every morning. Essentially, the root of all sin is the selfish desire - wanting that which is not intended for us. That's where Adam and Eve failed. But sin brings a thrill of sorts. It is exciting, and often pleasurable. And once you get started, you are immediately addicted. Worse than the drunkard who wants to stop drinking but has no power, worse than the smoker who wants to quit smoking but cannot bring himself to do it, is the sinner who is utterly unable to keep himself from sinning. We are all, without exception, "accustomed to do evil" and can't change ourselves. Why do we sin? Because the sinner cannot do otherwise. Even if he wants to stop, he cannot. But what if the sinner submits his will to One who does not want him to sin? What if that sinner receives omnipotence from that One? Will he continue to sin? Can he continue to sin? He cannot sin while His Seed remains in him. So why do we sin? That only happens if, like a watermelon that has been changed from its original design, we are Seedless.
By God's grace, Arnold
There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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