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"Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective #146148
10/22/12 03:55 AM
10/22/12 03:55 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
This topic is opened for the purpose of studying the concept of ordination, including concepts of priesthood, ministry, eldership, bishops, deacons, deaconesses, discipleship, apostleship, etc., from the Bible alone. There are other threads where extra-biblical sources can be discussed freely, including those of policy, tradition, or modern authors and scholars. While it should be clear that those sources are not denied legitimacy here, our interest here is to look simply at what the Bible itself has to teach on this subject.

Please feel free to include Bible-study tools such as concordances, lexicons, dictionaries and the like, but try to avoid commentaries or other outside sources. Thank you!

Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146150
10/22/12 04:57 AM
10/22/12 04:57 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Let's start with all of the Bible texts (using the KJV standard) on the topic of ordination that relate to people and use some form of the word "ordain" in the English translation. (There are some uses of "ordain" that relate to objects or actions outside the scope of this topic which we will ignore.)

Principal Texts on Ordination
1 Chronicles 9:22All these [which were] chosen to be porters in the gates [were] two hundred and twelve. These were reckoned by their genealogy in their villages, whom David and Samuel the seer did ordain in their set office.
2 Chronicles 11:14-15For the Levites left their suburbs and their possession, and came to Judah and Jerusalem: for Jeroboam and his sons had cast them off from executing the priest's office unto the LORD: And he ordained him priests for the high places, and for the devils, and for the calves which he had made.
Jeremiah 1:4-5Then the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, [and] I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
Mark 3:14-15And he ordained twelve, that they should be with him, and that he might send them forth to preach, And to have power to heal sicknesses, and to cast out devils:
John 15:16Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and [that] your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
Acts 1:21-26Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection. And they appointed two, Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias. And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, which knowest the hearts of all [men], show whether of these two thou hast chosen, That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place. And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
Acts 10:40-42Him God raised up the third day, and showed him openly; Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, [even] to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead. And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God [to be] the Judge of quick and dead.
Acts 14:23And when they had ordained them elders in every church, and had prayed with fasting, they commended them to the Lord, on whom they believed.
Acts 17:31Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by [that] man whom he hath ordained; [whereof] he hath given assurance unto all [men], in that he hath raised him from the dead.
1 Corinthians 7:17-20But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches. Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised. Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. Let every man abide in the same calling wherein he was called.
1 Timothy 2:7Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, [and] lie not;) a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity.
Titus 1:5-6For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee: If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
Hebrews 5:1-4For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things [pertaining] to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins: Who can have compassion on the ignorant, and on them that are out of the way; for that he himself also is compassed with infirmity. And by reason hereof he ought, as for the people, so also for himself, to offer for sins. And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as [was] Aaron.
Hebrews 8:1-3Now of the things which we have spoken [this is] the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man. For every high priest is ordained to offer gifts and sacrifices: wherefore [it is] of necessity that this man have somewhat also to offer.


Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146391
10/28/12 10:09 PM
10/28/12 10:09 PM
Daryl  Offline

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Nova Scotia, Canada
Bumping this for further input.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146406
10/29/12 06:07 AM
10/29/12 06:07 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Now here are all of the Bible texts relating to deacons and/or deaconesses. Some of these will not use the English word "deacon" but are from a Greek form or synonym of the word.



Principal Texts on Deaconry
Strong's Number G1247 matches the Greek διακονέω (diakoneō), which occurs 38 times in 32 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV.
Mat 4:11Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.
Mat 8:15And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them.
Mat 20:28Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
Mat 25:44Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Mat 27:55And many women were there beholding afar off, which followed Jesus from Galilee, ministering unto him:
Mar 1:13And he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.
Mar 1:31And he came and took her by the hand, and lifted her up; and immediately the fever left her, and she ministered unto them.
Mar 10:45For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
Mar 15:41(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
Luk 4:39And he stood over her, and rebuked the fever; and it left her: and immediately she arose and ministered unto them.
Luk 8:3And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.
Luk 10:40But Martha was cumbered about much serving, and came to him, and said, Lord, dost thou not care that my sister hath left me to serve alone? bid her therefore that she help me.
Luk 12:37Blessed [are] those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them.
Luk 17:8And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink?
Luk 22:26But ye [shall] not [be] so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
Luk 22:27For whether [is] greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? [is] not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.
Jhn 12:2There they made him a supper; and Martha served: but Lazarus was one of them that sat at the table with him.
Jhn 12:26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will [my] Father honour.
Act 6:2Then the twelve called the multitude of the disciples [unto them], and said, It is not reason that we should leave the word of God, and serve tables.
Act 19:22So he sent into Macedonia two of them that ministered unto him, Timotheus and Erastus; but he himself stayed in Asia for a season.
Rom 15:25But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints.
2Cr 3:3[Forasmuch as ye are] manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Cr 8:19And not [that] only, but who was also chosen of the churches to travel with us with this grace, which is administered by us to the glory of the same Lord, and [declaration of] your ready mind:
2Cr 8:20Avoiding this, that no man should blame us in this abundance which is administered by us:
1Ti 3:10And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being [found] blameless.
1Ti 3:13For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 1:18The Lord grant unto him that he may find mercy of the Lord in that day: and in how many things he ministered unto me at Ephesus, thou knowest very well.
Phm 1:13Whom I would have retained with me, that in thy stead he might have ministered unto me in the bonds of the gospel:
Hbr 6:10For God [is] not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
1Pe 1:12Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
1Pe 4:10As every man hath received the gift, [even so] minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.
1Pe 4:11If any man speak, [let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister, [let him do it] as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.


Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146542
11/03/12 07:12 AM
11/03/12 07:12 AM
asygo  Offline
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5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,585
California, USA
That's the verb form. The noun form of the word is diakonos (G1249). We can see all the verses here: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G1249&t=KJV

It is interesting that Paul applies the word to Phebe.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146545
11/03/12 11:16 AM
11/03/12 11:16 AM
Rick H  Offline

Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,172
Florida, USA
Originally Posted By: Green Cochoa
Now here are all of the Bible texts relating to deacons and/or deaconesses. Some of these will not use the English word "deacon" but are from a Greek form or synonym of the word.



Principal Texts on Deaconry
Strong's Number G1247 matches the Greek διακονέω (diakoneō), which occurs 38 times in 32 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV.
Mat 4:11Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.
Mat 8:15And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them.
Mat 20:28Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
Mat 25:44Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Mat 27:55And many women were there beholding afar off, which followed Jesus from Galilee, ministering unto him:
Mar 1:13And he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.
Mar 1:31And he came and took her by the hand, and lifted her up; and immediately the fever left her, and she ministered unto them.
Mar 10:45For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
Mar 15:41(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
Luk 4:39And he stood over her, and rebuked the fever; and it left her: and immediately she arose and ministered unto them.
Luk 8:3And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.
Luk 10:40But Martha was cumbered about much serving, and came to him, and said, Lord, dost thou not care that my sister hath left me to serve alone? bid her therefore that she help me.
Luk 12:37Blessed [are] those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them.
Luk 17:8And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink?
Luk 22:26But ye [shall] not [be] so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
Luk 22:27For whether [is] greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? [is] not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.
Jhn 12:2There they made him a supper; and Martha served: but Lazarus was one of them that sat at the table with him.
Jhn 12:26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will [my] Father honour.
Act 6:2Then the twelve called the multitude of the disciples [unto them], and said, It is not reason that we should leave the word of God, and serve tables.
Act 19:22So he sent into Macedonia two of them that ministered unto him, Timotheus and Erastus; but he himself stayed in Asia for a season.
Rom 15:25But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints.
2Cr 3:3[Forasmuch as ye are] manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Cr 8:19And not [that] only, but who was also chosen of the churches to travel with us with this grace, which is administered by us to the glory of the same Lord, and [declaration of] your ready mind:
2Cr 8:20Avoiding this, that no man should blame us in this abundance which is administered by us:
1Ti 3:10And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being [found] blameless.
1Ti 3:13For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 1:18The Lord grant unto him that he may find mercy of the Lord in that day: and in how many things he ministered unto me at Ephesus, thou knowest very well.
Phm 1:13Whom I would have retained with me, that in thy stead he might have ministered unto me in the bonds of the gospel:
Hbr 6:10For God [is] not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
1Pe 1:12Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
1Pe 4:10As every man hath received the gift, [even so] minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.
1Pe 4:11If any man speak, [let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister, [let him do it] as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.


Blessings,

Green Cochoa.
Green Cochoa, I guess I will have to go dig it into it, but where did 'Elder' or the position of the elders come from, is it the equivalent of deacon?

Last edited by Green Cochoa; 11/03/12 03:07 PM. Reason: Enabled HTML
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Rick H] #146553
11/03/12 02:52 PM
11/03/12 02:52 PM
asygo  Offline
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5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,585
California, USA
It is different, but the qualifications are similar. See 1 Tim 3.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146604
11/05/12 05:15 AM
11/05/12 05:15 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Thanks to Arnold's contribution, here is the list of verses containing the noun form of "deacon" in the Greek.

Principal Texts on Deaconry
Strong's Number G1249 matches the Greek διάκονος (diakonos), which occurs 31 times in 29 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV.
Mat 20:26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
Mat 22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast [him] into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Mat 23:11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
Mar 9:35 And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, [the same] shall be last of all, and servant of all.
Mar 10:43 But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
Jhn 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do [it].
Jhn 2:9 [G1161] When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
Jhn 12:26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will [my] Father honour.
Rom 13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to [execute] wrath upon him that doeth evil.
Rom 15:8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises [made] unto the fathers:
Rom 16:1 [G1161] I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea:
Rom 16:27 To God only wise, [be] glory through Jesus Christ for ever. Amen. [[[Written to the Romans from Corinthus, [and sent] by Phebe servant of the church at Cenchrea.]]]
1Cr 3:5 Who then is Paul, and who [is] Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man 1538?
2Cr 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Cr 6:4 But in all [things] approving ourselves as the ministers of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses,
2Cr 11:15 Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
2Cr 11:23 Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I [am] more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft.
Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, [is] therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Eph 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
Eph 6:21 But that ye also may know my affairs, [and] how I do, Tychicus, a beloved brother and faithful minister in the Lord, shall make known to you all things:
Phl 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:
Col 1:7 As ye also learned of Epaphras our dear fellowservant, who is for you a faithful minister of Christ;
Col 1:23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and [be] not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, [and] which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
Col 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;
Col 4:7 All my state shall Tychicus declare unto you, [who is] a beloved brother, and a faithful minister and fellowservant in the Lord:
1Th 3:2 And sent Timotheus, our brother, and minister of God, and our fellowlabourer in the gospel of Christ, to establish you, and to comfort you concerning your faith:
1Ti 3:8 Likewise [must] the deacons [be] grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
1Ti 3:12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
1Ti 4:6 If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Green Cochoa] #146609
11/05/12 01:32 PM
11/05/12 01:32 PM
Daryl  Offline

Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,126
Nova Scotia, Canada
In other words, the Greek word isn't limited to just one meaning, therefore, those verses need to be looked at within each of their own contexts.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: "Ordination" from strictly the Biblical perspective [Re: Daryl] #146613
11/05/12 03:09 PM
11/05/12 03:09 PM
Johann  Offline
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Retired Pastor
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Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: Daryl F
In other words, the Greek word isn't limited to just one meaning, therefore, those verses need to be looked at within each of their own contexts.


Or governed by a strict order by the King, like in the KJV, to be certain the new Bible is fully in accordance with the doctrines established by papacy and inherited by the Church of England. . . and followed with waggling tails by all of those who believe this to be the only possible truth.

Actually the translators of KJV also followed how this and several other words had already been translated earlier with the approval of the establishment. This is by many regarded as the only true conservatism, conserved by tradition.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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