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Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153133
06/12/13 01:08 PM
06/12/13 01:08 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Jesus: If He alone saved us, why are not all people saved?
Us: If we alone decided to be saved, would we not need any help?
Love: If love alone saved us, why are not all people saved?
Mercy, faith, grace, etc. -- same reasonings as above. I have quoted from Steps to Christ multiple times. The answer to these questions is still in chapter 5. Most here just ignore it, probably because the chapter shows that salvation is a healing act not a judicial act. It also shows that we have a roll to play and it is a struggle. God's promise is, "Ye shall seek Me, and find Me, when ye shall search for Me with all your heart." Jeremiah 29:13. {SC 43.1}
The whole heart must be yielded to God, or the change can never be wrought in us by which we are to be restored to His likeness. By nature we are alienated from God. The Holy Spirit describes our condition in such words as these: "Dead in trespasses and sins;" "the whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint;" "no soundness in it." We are held fast in the snare of Satan, "taken captive by him at his will." Ephesians 2:1; Isaiah 1:5, 6; 2 Timothy 2:26. God desires to heal us, to set us free. But since this requires an entire transformation, a renewing of our whole nature, we must yield ourselves wholly to Him. {SC 43.2}
The warfare against self is the greatest battle that was ever fought. The yielding of self, surrendering all to the will of God, requires a struggle; but the soul must submit to God before it can be renewed in holiness. {SC 43.3} The next paragraph is key. The government of God is not, as Satan would make it appear, founded upon a blind submission, an unreasoning control. It appeals to the intellect and the conscience. "Come now, and let us reason together" is the Creator's invitation to the beings He has made. Isaiah 1:18. God does not force the will of His creatures. He cannot accept an homage that is not willingly and intelligently given. A mere forced submission would prevent all real development of mind or character; it would make man a mere automaton. Such is not the purpose of the Creator. He desires that man, the crowning work of His creative power, shall reach the highest possible development. He sets before us the height of blessing to which He desires to bring us through His grace. He invites us to give ourselves to Him, that He may work His will in us. It remains for us to choose whether we will be set free from the bondage of sin, to share the glorious liberty of the sons of God. {SC 43.4} Hm - Choice Many are inquiring, "How am I to make the surrender of myself to God?" You desire to give yourself to Him, but you are weak in moral power, in slavery to doubt, and controlled by the habits of your life of sin. Your promises and resolutions are like ropes of sand. You cannot control your thoughts, your impulses, your affections. The knowledge of your broken promises and forfeited pledges weakens your confidence in your own sincerity, and causes you to feel that God cannot accept you; but you need not despair. What you need to understand is the true force of the will. This is the governing power in the nature of man, the power of decision, or of choice. Everything depends on the right action of the will. The power of choice God has given to men; it is theirs to exercise. You cannot change your heart, you cannot of yourself give to God its affections; but you can choose to serve Him. You can give Him your will; He will then work in you to will and to do according to His good pleasure. Thus your whole nature will be brought under the control of the Spirit of Christ; your affections will be centered upon Him, your thoughts will be in harmony with Him. {SC 47.1}
Desires for goodness and holiness are right as far as they go; but if you stop here, they will avail nothing. Many will be lost while hoping and desiring to be Christians. They do not come to the point of yielding the will to God. They do not now choose to be Christians. {SC 47.2}
Through the right exercise of the will, an entire change may be made in your life. By yielding up your will to Christ, you ally yourself with the power that is above all principalities and powers. You will have strength from above to hold you steadfast, and thus through constant surrender to God you will be enabled to live the new life, even the life of faith. {SC 48.1} Read the whole chapter. The whole book!
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153142
06/12/13 05:29 PM
06/12/13 05:29 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
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Let's find out right here.
Find out what?
He demands now as ever perfect righteousness as the only title to heaven. {RH, September 21, 1886 par. 16}
That's pretty clear.
...
Every human has needed the Saviors transformation/renewing. Without that, we do not have title to heaven. You still haven't answered the questions about Enoch's title to heaven: Did Enoch achieve that "perfect righteousness" in his own life, or was it Christ's pending perfect life, to be credited to him in spite of his own imperfection? Did Enoch have that "perfect righteousness" when he was taken up, never to lose it regardless of the outcome of Christ's mission on earth?
By God's grace,
Arnold
There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153143
06/12/13 05:32 PM
06/12/13 05:32 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
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I have quoted from Steps to Christ multiple times. The answer to these questions is still in chapter 5. Most here just ignore it, probably because the chapter shows that salvation is a healing act not a judicial act. The vast majority of the active posters here do not deny that salvation is a healing act. There's no problem there. The problem is that you deny that salvation is also a judicial act.
By God's grace,
Arnold
There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: asygo]
#153144
06/12/13 05:46 PM
06/12/13 05:46 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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I have quoted from Steps to Christ multiple times. The answer to these questions is still in chapter 5. Most here just ignore it, probably because the chapter shows that salvation is a healing act not a judicial act. The vast majority of the active posters here do not deny that salvation is a healing act. There's no problem there. The problem is that you deny that salvation is also a judicial act. How is salvation judicial? The law condemns, it cannot remedy. How does a judicial act bring one back into compliance with the law? How does a judicial act cause you to stop sinning? What IS salvation?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153146
06/12/13 06:19 PM
06/12/13 06:19 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Every human has needed the Saviors transformation/renewing. Without that, we do not have title to heaven. So, to you, justification is restricted to renewing, correct?
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: Rosangela]
#153147
06/12/13 06:23 PM
06/12/13 06:23 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Every human has needed the Saviors transformation/renewing. Without that, we do not have title to heaven. So, to you, justification is restricted to renewing, correct? What is justification? It is setting things right.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153152
06/12/13 11:42 PM
06/12/13 11:42 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
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I have quoted from Steps to Christ multiple times. The answer to these questions is still in chapter 5. Most here just ignore it, probably because the chapter shows that salvation is a healing act not a judicial act. The vast majority of the active posters here do not deny that salvation is a healing act. There's no problem there. The problem is that you deny that salvation is also a judicial act. How is salvation judicial? The law condemns, it cannot remedy. How does a judicial act bring one back into compliance with the law? How does a judicial act cause you to stop sinning? What IS salvation? The law condemns. If you want to be saved, that needs to stop. A legal solution is required.
By God's grace,
Arnold
There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153153
06/13/13 12:50 AM
06/13/13 12:50 AM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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What is justification? It is setting things right. Both according to the Bible and according to Ellen White, justification is the opposite of condemnation; justification is pardon. Rom 5:16 And the free gift is not like the result of that one man's sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification. Rom 5:18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men. Pardon and justification are one and the same thing. . . . {CTr 150.3} Justification is the opposite of condemnation. God’s boundless mercy is exercised toward those who are wholly undeserving. He forgives transgressions and sins for the sake of Jesus, who has become the propitiation for our sins. Through faith in Christ the guilty transgressor is brought into favor with God and into the strong hope of life eternal. . . . {CTr 150.4} Justification is a full, complete pardon of sin. The moment a sinner accepts Christ by faith, that moment he is pardoned. The righteousness of Christ is imputed to him, and he is no more to doubt God's forgiving grace. {FLB 107.2}
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: asygo]
#153154
06/13/13 01:21 AM
06/13/13 01:21 AM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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The law condemns. If you want to be saved, that needs to stop. A legal solution is required. Smoking kills. Legal solution required. Not breathing kills. Legal solution required. You are not breathing? That's OK - Christ is breathing for you, you are saved! Nope. The only way to be saved is to be brought back into full compliance with the law. The law cannot be changed. We must keep the law. How are we able to keep the law? That is what saves us.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What saves us?
[Re: APL]
#153156
06/13/13 02:46 AM
06/13/13 02:46 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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The law condemns. If you want to be saved, that needs to stop. A legal solution is required. Smoking kills. Legal solution required. Not breathing kills. Legal solution required. You are not breathing? That's OK - Christ is breathing for you, you are saved! Nope. The only way to be saved is to be brought back into full compliance with the law. The law cannot be changed. We must keep the law. How are we able to keep the law? That is what saves us. APL, According to your belief, you cannot be saved. It is impossible for you to keep the law in such a way as to not fall under its condemnation. I'm sorry for you. Romans 3:23 here applies. If you want to be saved, APL, you will have to go back in time and relive your life, this time without sin. Once you have sinned, EVEN ONCE, you are condemned by the law to die. The death penalty applies, unless you have a legal solution. With no belief in a legal solution.... Selah, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
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