APL, you are misapplying PP 392.3.

More likely, it does not fit your paradigm, so ignore it, deny it, redefine it, limit it, what ever. "It was not His purpose that they should gain the land by warfare". But you say, it was His purpose that they should gain the land by warfare.

Absolutely it was Jesus' plan to use hornets and Hebrews to kill the Canaanites. The Bible and the SOP are crystal clear about it. Jesus commanded the Hebrews to wage war and they refused. Satan was successful. He then commanded them to retreat and they refused. Satan was successful. They attacked and were defeated. He did not command them to attack. Jesus punished them.


You believe Jesus commanded the Hebrews to fight because of the hardness of their hearts. You also believe Jesus commanded them to retreat because of the hardness of their hearts. Jesus wanted them to fight so Satan wanted them to retreat. Then Jesus wanted them to retreat so Satan wanted them to fight. "God had bidden ["required"] them go up and take the land". You believe the expression "go up and take" excludes armed conflict. Here's how the same expression is used elsewhere:

Sinners will have no control over the lake of fire that punishes and consumes them.

Read an alternate description of that day:

"The wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Romans 6:23. While life is the inheritance of the righteous, death is the portion of the wicked. Moses declared to Israel: "I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil." Deuteronomy 30:15. The death referred to in these scriptures is not that pronounced upon Adam, for all mankind suffer the penalty of his transgression. It is "the second death" that is placed in contrast with everlasting life. {GC 544.1}

In consequence of Adam's sin, death passed upon the whole human race. All alike go down into the grave. And through the provisions of the plan of salvation, all are to be brought forth from their graves. "There shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust;" "for as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." Acts 24:15; 1 Corinthians 15:22. But a distinction is made between the two classes that are brought forth. "All that are in the graves shall hear His voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation." John 5:28, 29. They who have been "accounted worthy" of the resurrection of life are "blessed and holy." "On such the second death hath no power." Revelation 20:6. But those who have not, through repentance and faith, secured pardon, must receive the penalty of transgression--"the wages of sin." They suffer punishment varying in duration and intensity, "according to their works," but finally ending in the second death. Since it is impossible for God, consistently with His justice and mercy, to save the sinner in his sins, He deprives him of the existence which his transgressions have forfeited and of which he has proved himself unworthy. Says an inspired writer: "Yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be." And another declares: "They shall be as though they had not been." Psalm 37:10; Obadiah 16. Covered with infamy, they sink into hopeless, eternal oblivion. {GC 544.2}

GC 544 is not an alternate description. It is identical to GC 672, 673:

1. They suffer punishment varying in duration and intensity, "according to their works," but finally ending in the second death. (GC 544)

2. Some are destroyed as in a moment, while others suffer many days. All are punished "according to their deeds." (GC 673)


APL, do you believe the lake of fire is literal fire? Or, do you believe it is symbolic?

The night was spent in lamentation, but with the morning came a hope. They resolved to redeem their cowardice. When God had bidden them go up and take the land, they had refused [They were to take the land - not by warfare, but go in. God would take care of them, just as He did when they left Egypt. The people did not fight leaving Egypt, a very powerful nation]; and now when He directed them to retreat they were equally rebellious. They determined to seize upon the land and possess it; it might be that God would accept their work and change His purpose toward them. {PP 392.2}

God had made it their privilege and their duty to enter the land at the time of His appointment [not by there warfare, but by God], but through their willful neglect that permission had been withdrawn. Satan had gained his object in preventing them from entering Canaan; and now he urged them on to do the very thing, in the face of the divine prohibition, which they had refused to do when God required it. Thus the great deceiver gained the victory by leading them to rebellion the second time. They had distrusted the power of God to work with their efforts in gaining possession of Canaan; yet now they presumed upon their own strength to accomplish the work independent of divine aid. "We have sinned against the Lord," they cried; "we will go up and fight, according to all that the Lord our God commanded us." [they now wanted to go up, but fighting was not what God commanded them to do, but they now wanted to fight!] Deuteronomy 1:41. So terribly blinded had they become by transgression. The Lord had never commanded them to "go up and fight." [repeat - God did never said, go up and fight] It was not His purpose that they should gain the land by warfare [repeat - it was not God plan that they fight!], but by strict obedience to His commands. {PP 392.3}

We are blinded today if we say the same thing that God wanted them to fight. It was never God's plan for them to fight. Yet, fight they did, and God even met them in their hardness of heart, just as we see with polygamy and divorce.

APL, thank you for inserting your comments in the passage above. It helps me understand what you believe.


The expression "go up and take" includes armed attack.


I find it interesting you feel okay about Jesus killing His enemies (using the forces of nature, evil angels, or evil men) but you are uncomfortable with Him commanding His chosen people to wage war. Jesus promised to use hornets to drive out the Canaanites. But He never did. Why not? Instead, He commanded Moses and Joshua and the Judges to do it.