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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165604
06/02/14 05:35 PM
06/02/14 05:35 PM
Johann  Offline
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Retired Pastor
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
A million years from now we will still be forgiven sinners, and His righteousness covers us and we are admitted by His grace. We will never have anything in us throughout eternity that entitles us to eternal life with Him except His grace, accepted by faith.

Through His grace and sin offering we will have a perfect

koiononea

one with another and with Jesus Christ.

There is no English Bible which gives a perfect translation of koinonea, but the closest is fellowship.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: asygo] #165622
06/03/14 04:52 AM
06/03/14 04:52 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline
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Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: asygo
Grace enables us to obey, but it is an imperfect obedience that requires the covering of Christ's righteousness. If we have grace, we obey, but our obedience does not meet the law's perfect claims. Rather, Christ's perfect obedience meets those claims as we abide in Him. Therefore, the righteous requirements of the law are fulfilled IN us, not BY us; by Christ's work FOR us, not His work IN and THROUGH us.

How does that sound?


"Obedience and submission to God's requirements are the conditions given by the inspired apostle by which we become children of God, members of the royal family." -- Ellen White.

The Bible is clear that only the obedient are called children of God. The disobedient are children of the devil. Therefore, the above statement cannot be referring to Christ's obedience, for then everyone would be a child of God.

Just a point of clarification. Obviously, there is a certain "obedience" which must be our own.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165628
06/03/14 03:06 PM
06/03/14 03:06 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
By perfect obedience to the law of Jehovah we are to magnify the law and make it honorable. {CW 100.1}

The very image of God is to be reproduced in humanity. The honor of God, the honor of Christ, is involved in the perfection of the character of His people. {DA 671.3}

Quote:
Christ became the sinless sacrifice for a guilty race, making men prisoners of hope, so that through repentance toward God because they had broken His holy law, and through faith in Christ as their Substitute, Surety, and righteousness, they might be brought back to loyalty to God and to obedience to His holy law. {FW 117.3}

As the sinner, drawn by the power of Christ, approaches the uplifted cross, and prostrates himself before it, there is a new creation. A new heart is given him. He becomes a new creature in Christ Jesus. Holiness finds that it has nothing more to require. God Himself is "the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus." Romans 3:26. And "whom He justified, them He also glorified." Romans 8:30. {COL 162.4}

That which God required of Adam before his fall was perfect obedience to His law. God requires now what He required of Adam, perfect obedience, righteousness without a flaw, without shortcoming in His sight. God help us to render to Him all His law requires. We cannot do this without that faith that brings Christ's righteousness into daily practice. {2SM 380.4}

God requires of all His subjects obedience, entire obedience to all His commandments. He demands now as ever perfect righteousness as the only title to heaven. Christ is our hope and our refuge. His righteousness is imputed only to the obedient. Let us accept it through faith, that the Father shall find in us no sin. {6BC 1072.8}

God could not bring down his law to meet the standard of wicked men, neither could man, fallen by sin, meet the demands of the law by a blameless character and life. But by faith in Christ the sinner could be cleansed from his guilt, and he enabled to render obedience to the law of his Maker. {LP 242.2}

Christ has paid all that man owes to God from the beginning of his life. Sin is the transgression of the law, and through Christ man must now render perfect obedience to that law. By his righteousness of active obedience, Christ clothes me with his righteousness, in order that I shall not continue in sin, but perfect a character after the similitude of Christ. {HM, November 1, 1897 par. 10}

From a sense of thorough conviction, you can then testify to men of the immutable character of the law manifested by the death of Christ on the cross, the malignant nature of sin, and the righteousness of God in justifying the believer in Jesus, on condition of his future obedience to the statutes of God's government in heaven and earth. {RH, April 24, 1888 par. 15}

Christ bore the penalty that would have fallen upon the transgressor; and through faith the helpless, hopeless sinner becomes a partaker of the divine nature, escaping the corruption that is in the world through lust. Christ imputes his perfection and righteousness to the believing sinner when he does not continue in sin, but turns from transgression to obedience of the commandments. {RH, May 23, 1899 par. 8}

In everything Christ sought first the kingdom of God and his righteousness; and that which he did he commands his followers to do. This example he gave to the human race that they might in his strength render to God the obedience he requires, and in the end present themselves perfect before his throne. He was one with the Father. His life was a fulfilling of the law, a continual obedience to God's commands. {RH, October 2, 1900 par. 14}

God requires the entire surrender of the heart, before justification can take place; and in order for man to retain justification, there must be continual obedience, through active, living faith that works by love and purifies the soul. {FW 100.1}

Christ imputes his perfection and righteousness to the believing sinner when he does not continue in sin, but turns from transgression to obedience of the commandments.

The righteousness of God in justifying the believer in Jesus, on condition of his future obedience to the statutes of God's government in heaven and earth.

God requires the entire surrender of the heart, before justification can take place; and in order for man to retain justification, there must be continual obedience, through active, living faith that works by love and purifies the soul.

Holiness finds that it has nothing more to require.

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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165629
06/03/14 03:13 PM
06/03/14 03:13 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Man's obedience can be made perfect only by the incense of Christ's righteousness, which fills with divine fragrance every act of obedience.

Only the covering which Christ Himself has provided can make us meet to appear in God's presence.

Quote:
In Christ we are as if we had suffered the penalty we have incurred. In Christ I am as if I had obeyed, and rendered perfect obedience to the law, which we can not perfectly obey without Christ imparts to us His merits and His righteousness. {PUR, September 4, 1913 par. 3}

Man's obedience can be made perfect only by the incense of Christ's righteousness, which fills with divine fragrance every act of obedience. The part of the Christian is to persevere in overcoming every fault. Constantly he is to pray to the Saviour to heal the disorders of his sin-sick soul. He has not the wisdom or the strength to overcome; these belong to the Lord, and He bestows them on those who in humiliation and contrition seek Him for help. {AA 532.1}

Every soul may say: "By His perfect obedience He has satisfied the claims of the law, and my only hope is found in looking to Him as my substitute and surety, who obeyed the law perfectly for me. By faith in His merits I am free from the condemnation of the law. He clothes me with His righteousness, which answers all the demands of the law. I am complete in Him who brings in everlasting righteousness. He presents me to God in the spotless garment of which no thread was woven by any human agent. All is of Christ, and all the glory, honor, and majesty are to be given to the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sins of the world." {NL 27.2}

Knowing himself to be a sinner, a transgressor of the holy law of God, he looks to the perfect obedience of Christ, to His death upon Calvary for the sins of the world; and he has the assurance that he is justified by faith in the merit and sacrifice of Christ. He realizes that the law was obeyed in his behalf by the Son of God, and that the penalty of transgression cannot fall upon the believing sinner. The active obedience of Christ clothes the believing sinner with the righteousness that meets the demands of the law. {SD 240.4}

Christ perfected a righteous character here upon the earth, not on His own account, for His character was pure and spotless, but for fallen man. His character He offers to man if he will accept it. The sinner, through repentance of his sins, faith in Christ, and obedience to the perfect law of God, has the righteousness of Christ imputed to him; it becomes his righteousness, and his name is recorded in the Lamb's book of life. He becomes a child of God, a member of the royal family. {3T 371.2}

Only the covering which Christ Himself has provided can make us meet to appear in God's presence. This covering, the robe of His own righteousness, Christ will put upon every repenting, believing soul. "I counsel thee," He says, "to buy of Me . . . white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear." Revelation 3:18. {COL 311.3}

By His perfect obedience He has made it possible for every human being to obey God's commandments.

Quote:
This robe, woven in the loom of heaven, has in it not one thread of human devising. Christ in His humanity wrought out a perfect character, and this character He offers to impart to us. "All our righteousness are as filthy rags." Isaiah 64:6. Everything that we of ourselves can do is defiled by sin. But the Son of God "was manifested to take away our sins; and in Him is no sin." Sin is defined to be "the transgression of the law." 1 John 3:5, 4. But Christ was obedient to every requirement of the law. He said of Himself, "I delight to do Thy will, O My God; yea, Thy law is within My heart." Psalm 40:8. When on earth, He said to His disciples, "I have kept My Father's commandments." John 15:10. By His perfect obedience He has made it possible for every human being to obey God's commandments. When we submit ourselves to Christ, the heart is united with His heart, the will is merged in His will, the mind becomes one with His mind, the thoughts are brought into captivity to Him; we live His life. This is what it means to be clothed with the garment of His righteousness. Then as the Lord looks upon us He sees, not the fig-leaf garment, not the nakedness and deformity of sin, but His own robe of righteousness, which is perfect obedience to the law of Jehovah. {COL 311.4}

Christ does not lessen the claims of the law. In unmistakable language He presents obedience to it as the condition of eternal life--the same condition that was required of Adam before his fall. The Lord expects no less of the soul now than He expected of man in Paradise, perfect obedience, unblemished righteousness. The requirement under the covenant of grace is just as broad as the requirement made in Eden--harmony with God's law, which is holy, just, and good. {COL 391.2}

True sanctification is a Bible doctrine. The apostle Paul, in his letter to the Thessalonian church, declares: "This is the will of God, even your sanctification." And he prays: "The very God of peace sanctify you wholly." 1 Thessalonians 4:3; 5:23. The Bible clearly teaches what sanctification is and how it is to be attained. The Saviour prayed for His disciples: "Sanctify them through Thy truth: Thy word is truth." John 17:17. And Paul teaches that believers are to be "sanctified by the Holy Ghost." Romans 15:16. What is the work of the Holy Spirit? Jesus told His disciples: "When He, the Spirit of truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth." John 16:13. And the psalmist says: "Thy law is the truth." By the word and the Spirit of God are opened to men the great principles of righteousness embodied in His law. And since the law of God is "holy, and just, and good," a transcript of the divine perfection, it follows that a character formed by obedience to that law will be holy. Christ is a perfect example of such a character. He says: "I have kept My Father's commandments." "I do always those things that please Him." John 15:10; 8:29. The followers of Christ are to become like Him--by the grace of God to form characters in harmony with the principles of His holy law. This is Bible sanctification. {GC 469.2}

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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: James Peterson] #165650
06/04/14 04:00 PM
06/04/14 04:00 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
What does this mean: "AND of His fullness we have all received, AND grace for grace" (John 1:16)? What does "AND grace for grace" mean?

It could mean that the grace we have received is being replaced by another kind of grace. Perhaps something akin to the glory of the Old Covenant being replaced by the glory of the New Covenant.

Or it could mean, as some translations suggest, that more grace is added to grace previously received. As Paul put it, grace abounds much more.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: APL] #165651
06/04/14 04:04 PM
06/04/14 04:04 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: asygo
Grace enables us to obey, but it is an imperfect obedience that requires the covering of Christ's righteousness. If we have grace, we obey, but our obedience does not meet the law's perfect claims. Rather, Christ's perfect obedience meets those claims as we abide in Him. Therefore, the righteous requirements of the law are fulfilled IN us, not BY us; by Christ's work FOR us, not His work IN and THROUGH us.

How does that sound?


John 15:5 I am the vine, you are the branches: He that stays in me, and I in him, the same brings forth much fruit: for without me you can do nothing.

Are you saying that the work through us and in us is imperfect such that we will only give imperfect obedience? Is the covering of Christ a cloak for iniquity?

The work done in and through us may be perfect, but the vessel defiles it. But Jesus makes up for our unavoidable deficiencies.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: Green Cochoa] #165652
06/04/14 04:11 PM
06/04/14 04:11 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Green Cochoa
"Obedience and submission to God's requirements are the conditions given by the inspired apostle by which we become children of God, members of the royal family." -- Ellen White.

The Bible is clear that only the obedient are called children of God. The disobedient are children of the devil. Therefore, the above statement cannot be referring to Christ's obedience, for then everyone would be a child of God.

Just a point of clarification. Obviously, there is a certain "obedience" which must be our own.

Yes, there is definitely obedience that is our own. But we owe even that to Jesus, as it is His imparted righteousness. And it still does not entitle us to heaven, as that is by His imputed righteousness.

I hope to spend some time this week discussing the role of obedience in the covenants.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: Mountain Man] #165654
06/04/14 04:23 PM
06/04/14 04:23 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,583
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
"By His perfect obedience He has satisfied the claims of the law, and my only hope is found in looking to Him as my substitute and surety, who obeyed the law perfectly for me. By faith in His merits I am free from the condemnation of the law. He clothes me with His righteousness, which answers all the demands of the law. I am complete in Him who brings in everlasting righteousness. He presents me to God in the spotless garment of which no thread was woven by any human agent. All is of Christ, and all the glory, honor, and majesty are to be given to the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sins of the world." {NL 27.2}

I concur.


By God's grace,
Arnold

There is no excuse for any one in taking the position that there is no more truth to be revealed, and that all our expositions of Scripture are without an error. The fact that certain doctrines have been held as truth for many years by our people, is not a proof that our ideas are infallible. Age will not make error into truth, and truth can afford to be fair. No true doctrine will lose anything by close investigation. RH 12/20/1892
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165655
06/04/14 07:11 PM
06/04/14 07:11 PM
APL  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
"By His perfect obedience He has satisfied the claims of the law, and my only hope is found in looking to Him as my substitute and surety, who obeyed the law perfectly for me.

How is Christ our substitute?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: APL] #165659
06/04/14 09:31 PM
06/04/14 09:31 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
NON-SDA
Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: APL
"By His perfect obedience He has satisfied the claims of the law, and my only hope is found in looking to Him as my substitute and surety, who obeyed the law perfectly for me.

How is Christ our substitute?

***** STAFF EDIT *****

Christ did not obey the law for anybody. It is written, "the soul that sinneth, it shall die." Christ forgives your sin if you ask him. And once forgiven, you return into the family of God and are assured of salvation. How hard is that to understand? WOW! That is the whole reason for the Bible: to assure you of the love of God.

God forgives and will save all those who come to Him asking for forgiveness. PERIOD.

///

Last edited by Daryl; 06/05/14 01:54 AM. Reason: Staff Edit to remove inappropriate content.
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