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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16802
01/09/06 03:26 PM
01/09/06 03:26 PM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Hoover:
Baptism is a profession of one's faith, and a statement that they want to belong to the family of God. If the SDA Church is the remnant, that would make us part of the family of God.
On a side topic, if the SDA Church is the remnant, who else can also be part of the family of God? The excusivity implied by the word remnant makes the quoted sentence oxymoronic.
/Thomas
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16803
01/09/06 03:40 PM
01/09/06 03:40 PM
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Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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Not quite oxymoronic, perhaps just poor verb usage.
Or, if one prefers, perhaps the other "non remnant" elements are mearly a part of the family as the pridical son was.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16804
01/10/06 04:30 AM
01/10/06 04:30 AM
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OP
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Southwest USA
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During the apostolic movement people were baptized into the doctrine and church of the apostles. The same thing applies today to the SDA doctrine and church. They are one and the same as the early church. The remnant church of prophecy is the SDA church, which is the remnant of the apostolic church. No other church is the remnant church. All other churches are descendants of Babylon, the Roman Catholic Church. The remnant church has been commissioned to call people out of Babylon and to baptize them into the SDA doctrine (all 28 of them) and church. To ignore the SOP would be equivalent to the early church ignoring the apostles, which, of course, they did not.
Acts
2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added [unto them] about three thousand souls.
2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.
2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all [men], as every man had need.
2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
2:47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16805
01/10/06 04:39 AM
01/10/06 04:39 AM
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OP
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Hoover:
Perfection? No!
A willingness to strive for perfection? Yes!
Dave, please reread the following quote, originally posted above, and explain the difference between "perfect obedience" and a "willingness to strive for perfection." Thank you.
quote:
There is need of a more thorough preparation on the part of candidates for baptism. They are in need of more faithful instruction than has usually been given them. The principles of the Christian life should be made plain to those who have newly come to the truth. None can depend upon their profession of faith as proof that they have a saving connection with Christ. We are not only to say, "I believe," but to practice the truth. It is by conformity to the will of God in our words, our deportment, our character, that we prove our connection with Him. Whenever one renounces sin, which is the transgression of the law, his life will be brought into conformity to the law, into perfect obedience. This is the work of the Holy Spirit. The light of the Word carefully studied, the voice of conscience, the strivings of the Spirit, produce in the heart genuine love for Christ, who gave Himself a whole sacrifice to redeem the whole person, body, soul, and spirit. And love is manifested in obedience.--Testimonies, vol. 6, pp. 91, 92. (1900) {Ev 308.4}
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16806
01/09/06 05:08 PM
01/09/06 05:08 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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Try examining this quote of our good brother Paul: quote:
I want to know Christ and the power that raised him from the dead. I want to share in his sufferings and become like him in his death. Then I have hope that I myself will be raised from the dead. I do not mean that I am already as God wants me to be. I have not yet reached that goal, but I continue trying to reach it and to make it mine. Christ wants me to do that, which is the reason he made me his. Brothers and sisters, I know that I have not yet reached that goal, but there is one thing I always do. Forgetting the past and straining toward what is ahead, I keep trying to reach the goal and get the prize for which God called me through Christ to the life above.
Philippians 3:10 – 14 NCV
It does not sound like even Paul was at perfection. Do you make the claim of perfection? Were you perfectly obedient when and after you were baptized? As my father would say, “be careful that lying does not break your perfection.” ![[Animated Laughter]](graemlins/laugh.gif)
It would seem that Paul was not perfect in his baptism, and it seems unlikely that any of use was, so can we expect of others what we do not have to offer?
What is the difference you ask? One is a human claing perfection, but the other is a person that wants to give their life to Christ. Of how much worth is the promis and claim of a human?
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16807
01/09/06 05:41 PM
01/09/06 05:41 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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quote:
Christ presents before us the highest perfection of Christian character, which throughout our lifetime we should aim to reach. . . . Concerning this perfection Paul writes: "Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after. . . . I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus" (Phil. 3:12-15). . . .
That I May Know Him p.130
quote:
Our work is to strive to attain in our sphere of action the perfection that Christ in His life on the earth attained in every phase of character.
That I May Know Him p.130
So it would seem that the work of obtaining perfection can take a lifetime. It would also seem that perfection will probably not be obtained before baptism, but we should be willing to strive for it!
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16808
01/09/06 05:50 PM
01/09/06 05:50 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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quote:
Originally posted by Mountain Man:
The remnant church of prophecy is the SDA church, which is the remnant of the apostolic church. No other church is the remnant church. All other churches are descendants of Babylon, the Roman Catholic Church.
But let's not forget that there are some family members in other churches.
quote:
I have other sheep that are not in this flock, and I must bring them also. They will listen to my voice, and there will be one flock and one shepherd.
John 10:16 NCV
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16809
01/10/06 06:45 PM
01/10/06 06:45 PM
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OP
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave Hoover:
But let's not forget that there are some family members in other churches.
quote:
Originally posted by Mountain Man:
The remnant church has been commissioned to call people out of Babylon and to baptize them into the SDA doctrine (all 28 of them) and church. To
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16810
01/10/06 06:47 PM
01/10/06 06:47 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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I read that Jesus is the one who calls them. quote:
Originally posted by Dave Hoover:
They will listen to my voice, and there will be one flock and one shepherd.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16811
01/10/06 08:22 PM
01/10/06 08:22 PM
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OP
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If Jesus is the one who calls people out of Babylon into the SDA church, what, then, are we supposed to do? Why did He commission us to do it?
Matthew
28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, [even] unto the end of the world. Amen.
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