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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169846
11/14/14 09:32 AM
11/14/14 09:32 AM
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SDA
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Finally you agree!!! Is it NOT God's will that anyone should be harmed, that mean no rape, no abuse, no murder. So why does it happen? You an MM have insisted that it is God's will. It is NOT God's will. Now if it is not God's will, WHY does it happen? I have answered this in a long post above.
MM says that if God wants to stop an evil thing from happen, He can. In Daniel 10:12-13 Then he said to me, "Fear not, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your mind to understand and humbled yourself before your God, your words have been heard, and I have come because of your words. 13 The prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; but Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, so I left him there with the prince of the kingdom of Persia.
Right there you see that there was a delay in getting an answer to Daniel. Why? Because if was God's will that the answer be delayed? Nope. Something PREVENTED the answer from coming immediately. Huh...
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: APL]
#169848
11/14/14 03:23 PM
11/14/14 03:23 PM
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M: For some reason you think your view makes Jesus look good. You believe Jesus is willing to allow evildoers to rape, murder, and steal because He respects their freewill more than He does that of their victims.
A: And your view make God look good? God wills that people are raped, abused and murdered? You misrepresented my view. I accurately stated your view.
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169853
11/14/14 04:00 PM
11/14/14 04:00 PM
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SDA
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Luke 11:2 And he said to them, When you pray, say, Our Father which are in heaven, Hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.
Why pray for what is already happening? God's will is not being done on earth as it is in heaven.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169854
11/14/14 04:14 PM
11/14/14 04:14 PM
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Good answer. But, no, what I mean is - I know people who hate Jesus because they believe as you do, namely, Jesus withdraws His protection and permits evil men and evil angel to murder innocent women and children. For example, they believe Jesus is allowing evil men to murder innocent women and children during the ISIS Crisis. They want to know why Jesus doesn't step in and protect them. They have freewill, too. Why can't Jesus honor their choices to live safe and sound?
What do you tell them? Do you avoid question? Do you ask a different question pertaining to a different topic? I tell them Jesus is in control. His hands are not tied. He permits things to play out in ways that make sense to Him. Sin forces Him to choose the one and only best way out of millions of possibilities. It saddens Him. When we get to heaven He will explain His reasons. We will agree wholeheartedly. By faith we take comfort in knowing He is in control.
You say you believe it too. That you understand why you believe it, but you just don't see why we believe it. But then seem to argue there's a difference. I guess I'm having trouble seeing any difference.
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169859
11/14/14 05:22 PM
11/14/14 05:22 PM
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Jesus is in control. His hands are not tied. He permits things to play out in ways that make sense to Him. Sin forces Him to choose the one and only best way out of millions of possibilities. It saddens Him. When we get to heaven He will explain His reasons. We will agree wholeheartedly. By faith we take comfort in knowing He is in control. The above is only one way Jesus maintains control. There are times when He causes, times when He commands, and times when He permits. He always manages the outcome of choices in the one and only best way.
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169861
11/14/14 05:29 PM
11/14/14 05:29 PM
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M: For some reason you think your view makes Jesus look good. You believe Jesus is willing to allow evildoers to rape, murder, and steal because He respects their freewill more than He does that of their victims.
A: And your view make God look good? God wills that people are raped, abused and murdered?
M: You misrepresented my view. I accurately stated your view.
A: Luke 11:2 And he said to them, When you pray, say, Our Father which are in heaven, Hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done, as in heaven, so in earth." Why pray for what is already happening? God's will is not being done on earth as it is in heaven. You misrepresented my view. Jesus is willing to permit evil men to do evil things to innocent people for reasons that make sense to Him. This is not the same as you saying it is Jesus' will. What you mean is totally different than what I mean. I accurately stated your view - You believe Jesus is willing to allow evildoers to rape, murder, and steal because He respects their freewill more than He does that of their victims.
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169868
11/14/14 07:16 PM
11/14/14 07:16 PM
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Quote MM: "He respects their freewill MORE than He does that of their victims".
Have I ever said that? Nope. Complete fabrication and or complete misunderstanding.
Quote MM: "Jesus is willing to permit...." and it is not His will. Your logic is now approaching that of Greens. Like God kills but He is not a killer. God destroys, but He is not a destroyer. Now, MM says God is willing but it is not His will.
Last edited by APL; 11/14/14 07:17 PM.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: APL]
#169871
11/14/14 11:49 PM
11/14/14 11:49 PM
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Quote MM: "He respects their freewill MORE than He does that of their victims". Have I ever said that? Nope. Complete fabrication and or complete misunderstanding. You wrote: "So there are situations #1 where God can prevent something and He does, and #2 there are situations where God can prevent something but chooses not to for a good reason. But there is a third category according to the scriptures #3, there are things that God wants to prevent, but because of freedom, He can't.? Because of whose freedom - evil men or innocent people? Quote MM: "Jesus is willing to permit...." and it is not His will. Your logic is now approaching that of Greens. Like God kills but He is not a killer. God destroys, but He is not a destroyer. Now, MM says God is willing but it is not His will. Not His will like you mean it. You mean it as in Jesus wants evil men to hurt innocent people. I mean it as in He is willing to allow it to play out that way for reasons that make sens to Him.
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169876
11/15/14 06:25 AM
11/15/14 06:25 AM
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Because of whose freedom - evil men or innocent people? YES.
Willing to to allow rape, abuse, murder... And these are things you insist God can prevent at any time. As you say, God is in control of everything, so if rape happens, that is what God wanted to happen. And you believe that God will also kill those He thinks need killing. Sin is not much of an evil thing in this scenario and the outcome of sin is completely controlled by God.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: If One kills those who disagree with Him, does that show love?
[Re: kland]
#169877
11/15/14 02:25 PM
11/15/14 02:25 PM
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1. You mean it as in Jesus wants evil men to hurt innocent people.
2. I mean it as in He is willing to allow it to play out that way for reasons that make sens to Him.
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