In reality we can not actually date Adam accurately, so anything calculated "from Adam" is only supposition at best.

The Jews claim that the jubilee cycle is lost - no one knows when it occurs today. That statement by Sister White is interesting. It implies that the saints will be delivered by the voice of God on the Day of Atonement because in the type, the Jubilee was announced by a trumpet just after the Atonement was completed.

The main topic though that I'm putting out for comment and discussion is the idea that the glory of God returns to His people on Nissan 10 according to the prophecies. See my first post for more. What do you think? Is this a type of the latter rain?

I disagree for the Lord gave us the geneology beginning with Adam's creation :

And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth: Gen 5:3

Records are very clear until Abraham. Then there are a few difficulties that needs to be resolve by Biblical cross referencing.

Sorry I haven't read Karen's trumpet discussion and other discussion of this subject.

Beside Ez 45:18-20 do you have other Biblical text that point to a Nisan 10 and the latter rain? If you have it written somewhere or posted, could you point it to me.

What's interesting is from reading Stephen Jones who has been used by the Lord the past 35 years in the ministry and hears His voice....was reveal that there was a switch in the Calendar year. Here is what he explains :

"last Summer I began to receive revelation that the calendar was going to change from October to April. This was based on Exodus 12:2, when God changed the calendar in the time of Moses. I did not know what this meant until a few months later, when I learned that it had to do with a change in the Prophetic Year. No longer was the Prophetic Year to go from the 8th day of Tabernacles of one year to the 8th day of Tabernacles the next year. It was instead to start at Passover and go to the next year’s Passover.

So right now, in January, we are in the middle of the transition, because the previous Prophetic Year has already ended, but the new Prophetic Year will start in April."

He's speaking of prophetic years calendar change, but it is also a calendar change. I'll try to explain from what I came to understand by which could not be what Stephen means as he didn't expound further than what I quoted above.

rosh hashanah (1st day of the 7th month) is known for the Jews as being the day of creation and they also consider it as a beginning(head) of the year. rosh hashanah literally means "head of the year".

There's two beginning of the year: rosh hashanah and Nisan 1st. Like in a day it is mark by a sunset and a sunrise. In the creation day pattern the night was created first after the day. We recogn a day starting from sunset, as the Jews seem to recogn the Year at rosh hashanah, yet there's also Nisan that is said to be the first month. rosh hashanah is the time that the daylight are equal but starts to shorten, whereas Nisan 1st the daylight increases.

Anyway, I myself was given that understanding(of two year beginning) with a study at another SDA forum months before reading Stephen Jones revelation. So it appears that the Lord changed the "beginning of year" for man at Moses time, and now we have come into history where time is changing back to where it was. Not that anything will change from day to day in the earth & moon cycle, but the change is in the Spiritual realm. What exactly? I don't know all that it means but one thing is in terms of time when He communicates to His people(those that can hear) thru signs to show us what He's doing before it happens.

I don't know if this spring will be the time He will institute a new feast like it appears to be in Ez 45. If so, a major event will precede it and the latter rain might just be it.

The first time the calendar was changed, it was a major change in history for the progress of the kingdom when the Israelites left Egypt. So this change marks another big time of change in history. I do know we have crossed a major stage of kingdom growth this last fall, and this spring feast will be kinda the official recognition of it. But this is something totally different then the latter rain.

I find it very interesting that you had these revelation. I do believe you are on a good tract. Maybe the difficulty you will encounter is understanding what it all means. I'm not saying I do understand much, but I do keep track of what the Lord reveal to the body of believers with the current events.

I do think this is the year the Holy Spirit will be poured at some point; however I was not reveal this personally and often things take longer than what we hope. I've learned that the Lord's is not in a hurry; however I believe all things are fulfill at the appointed time set before creation. So like all things, the Lord will reveal the timing of the latter rain to His body concretely with signs and revelations before it happened. And when it will happened we will know then that it happened and we will be glad for it.

I'm glad that works for you. I'll not frighten you with the facts.

Do frighten me with facts.

I haven't heard of Stephen Jones before. He's not the only one anticipating change this spring but until recently more of the focus in the Evangelical community and by myself has been on the fall of 2015. I still think the seven trumpets of Revelation may sound this fall (see Karen's thread, "The Seven Trumpets Reconsidered") but in looking at Ezekiel's temple just recently, chapter 43, the first part where the glory of God returns, it dawned on me that this is significant. The return of His presence is to this temple, not to the Mosaic structure.

I'm saying something similar to Stephen Jones apparently - that there is a change from the Mosaic calendar to Ezekiel's calendar, from the Mosaic temple to Ezekiel's temple. The change in calendars and temples is greater than just the Day of Atonement. In Ezekiel's temple the prophetic year starts in the spring with the Atonement week. In Ezekiel's temple there is no Feast of Weeks, no Trumpets, no Fall Day of Atonement and the final day of Tabernacles is not included. The reason for these changes appears to be that these feasts have been fulfilled (except that parts which haven't been fully completed such as the Fall Day of Atonement still have a future application) by the time Ezekiel's temple and its calendar goes into effect.

But I'm curious what are you referring to here. Can you tell me more?

This change is monumental in the same sense that the tearing of the veil at the death of Christ signaled a paradigm shift from the Old Covenant to the New. The essence of the change from Old to New was the change in 1) the priesthood from the Levitical to the Melchisedec and 2) from the dispensation of prophets to the dispensation of the Holy Spirit. When the next change occurs the change is from early rain to latter rain at the "hour of His judgment" - a paradigm, dispensational shift.

In the same way that a change in priesthood at the death of our Lord was soon followed by the gifts of the Spirit, so in Ezekiel's temple, the spring atonement, judgment and cleansing of the entire temple (in the Mosaic, only certian articles and apartments were cleansed but in Ezekiel's the entire structure including the inner court is cleansed), is followed a few days later by the return of the Presence to His people.

Sorry for the lenghty post.


Did you mean fall 2014? Or you mean prediction of the coming fall 2015? Can you give me a brief summary.

It is good that you consider listening to other Christian community’s revelation. I've noticed you have mention Jonathan Cahn in your post in this discussion by which I have listened to his harbinger revelation concerning 911. I think the Lord did give him an important revelation that believers should listen to.


I have not been much into studying Revelation these past years as I wanted to have a firmer grip in understanding the laws in the Pentateuch as I believe this is the foundation of the Plan of salvation laid in TYPES and Shadows. So I cannot comment on the Trumpets in Revelation besides knowing that the trumpets were sounded at every first day of the months starting at Nisan to the 7th month of the Fall feasts. So “at the sound of the last(7th) trump”(1Co 15:52) Paul is referring to the last trumpet of the 7th month of the fall feast. So I would expect to see the events associated with the feasts trumpet in Revelation. The Feast basically shows a progression of spiritual growth for an individual and corporate body.

I'll get back to you regarding Ez 43 as I need some time to study Ez 40-48 and reflect on it as a whole instead of bit and pieces from the pass. But to comment on what you said above highlighted, I don't know what you exactly mean with "temple". I believe that since the fulfillment of Pentecost after Jesus death, the temple is our body where all the Types and Shadows of the sacrifices and rituals laws fulfillment now happens. Temple in terms of both personally(1Cor 3:16) and/or corporatly(Eph 2:19-22; 1Pet 2:5). So if that is what you meant above, I agree that's what the meaning of the fulfillment in Ezekiel temple.

The Lord’s presence (=His glory and where is His glory abide is where His name is) did depart from the temple in Shiloh (1Sm 4:21,22) because of Priesthood corruption. Then it went to Jerusalem. The Lord’s presence-glory-name departed from Jerusalem for the same reason as for Shiloh(Jer 7:14). Ezekiel did see the glory-presence of the Lord leave the Most Holy Place(Ez 10:18) and then move outside the city to the top of Mount of Olives (Ez 11:22,23). And so it remained there until Jesus returned to heaven from the top of Mount of Olives(Acts 1:12). Then the glory return 10 days later to the 120 disciples in the upper room on the day of Pentecost and was manifested in form of tongue of fire that rested on their FOREHEAD. His name(where glory is) was then written on our forehead(Rev 22:4). So now we became the temple of His glory. That’s the last place His glory was manifested -- not in a temple made of wood and stones, but in the temple made of living stones (1Pet 2:5). I believe it will NEVER return to a temple made of wood and stones again as it never return back to Shiloh or in Jerusalem’s temple. So Ezekiel's prophecies has to be read with this in mind that whatever is said is done in the Temple, in means in our body temple.

However, at Pentecost they(corporate temple) only receive an “earnest”(a pledge, a downpayment) of the Spirit(2Cor 1:22, 5:5; Ep 1:13,14) rather than the fullness --- in goal to prepare them(us) to receive the fullness(Ep 3:19) that is yet to come through the next great feast fulfillment: feast of Tabernacles.

So we presently live in a kingdom of imperfection (Pentecost is represented by 2 loaves of leavened WHEAT and we currently live in the Pentecost AGE) where the Priesthood is still with leavened who lacks the fullness. It takes the fullness to bring the Kingdom into perfection. That’s why up to now in time, we(Pentecost Church after Jesus’ death) have failed equally to the Israelites(Passover Church before Jesus) to bring the Kingdom of God (establish His laws and His government) on earth.

So that’s what I see from studying Ezekiel 44, 45 that the uncorrupt Priesthood (who are to receive the fullness first, have access to the garment of linen), will intercede and minister to the people in the Most Holy Place; whereas the still corrupt Levites will not, but will help the Priest in their function to minister to the people.



Yes I agree. I don’t know what you mean with point “2)” but overaIl I agree with your point. In Ezekiel 40-48, the Priests, Levites, Prince (after some reflection these does not represent the priesthood but the heads of tribes or nations), and the People are all present in this new age in time. What I understand from this is when the Overcomers will receive the fullness of the Holy Spirit, it will mark this “NEW AGE” and a huge “monumental change”(as you say) and transition of time will take place expodentially much greater than the Pentecost with its “earnest deposit”. I believe it can be call the Tabernacle AGE where the Priesthood will be totally uncorrupted and will succeed to bring the kingdom of God on earth where the Passover & Pentecost Church has failed. When the kingdom, starting from a stone and grows into “a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.” (Dn 2:35; Rev 5:10; 20:6); I believe there will be no more any unbelievers on earth. Everyone will have entered the outer court and be part of the temple; however they will need to go through the 3 feasts spiritual growth journey until they too receive the fullness. This is the TYPE I see in the law.



I agree with you above. My interpretation would differ. One thing I would like to emphasize is this cleansing is a revelation of what is to come. I don’t believe it is going to happen in one day, or one week or one year or even 10 years, but maybe in 1000 years during the millenium. Then my hunch, it is specifically the cleansing of the people present in the outer compartment. I don’t believe it will include the cleansing of the people that are sleeping and didn’t take part of the 1st resurrection. From what I get from other scriptures, their cleansing will take part after the millennium. I need to study more about the dimensions and layout of Ezekiel temple. From what I recall is different having 2 instead of 3 compartments. But these compartments represents the corporate body of believers. The inner court only the priest could enter where they are physically closer to the Lord. While the levites and the people are in the outer compartment(the court). These compartments are their level of faith. Hmmmm…. That’s interesting. I’ll have to come back to this as this could be there are only two feasts as you say. In the Mosaic temple design the outer court was for the people(=Passover level of faith), the Holy place for the Levites(=Pentecost), and the Most Holy Place for the Priest(=Tabernacle). For sure there’s something there for us to understand in terms of change. In terms of cleansing that takes place, it is not the cleansing of a physical temple, but the people that form the real temple where the Lord dwells.

Concerning the later rain of Joel 2, I don’t think it is the same as the Tabernacle fulfillment where the Elects(the Barley crop which is the first ripe crop of the season) will be filled with the Holy Spirit. I think the latter rain of Joel 2 happens BEFORE and will be beneficial to ALL the harvests(Barley, Wheat, and Grape) and allow them to grow some more, but the Barley becomes ripe first and is harvested at some point later after the latter rain. I don’t understand this fully either and I have much more studying and pondering on this matter still.


Yes I agree …. well it appears to be so.


Just because these feast are not mentioned in Ez 45 (are the feast mentioned elsewhere in 40-48 besides here?) does not necessarily mean they are fulfilled and excluded. What I have learn at places in the laws, that these exclusion are meant for us to focus on the information provided that is pertinent to the statement. Notice that the details of both 7 days feasts of Passover and Tabernacle is mentioned. My impression, that this is the information to take note of and figure out what these 7 days represents and applied in this time or event.

With my understanding of the feasts and rituals and specifically the 2nd work of Christ that is the main focus of the atonement (2nd dove & the 2nd goat = to remove sin from the temple, BECAUSE the 1st dove & 1st goat only cover the sin): Pentecost is the most important feast because it symbolizes the 2nd work of Christ (the removing of Sin = SANCTIFICATION PROCESS) that prepares us to receives the fullness of the Holy Spirit (Tabernacles). We have seen that Ez 45:20 talks about the Priests doing mediation for the people, thus I see this as a Pentecost work & statement for it is all about mediation. Peace offerings that are giving at all feasts, represents the work of reconciliation that the priest does. What I understand from the sacrifices, they basically show different information at different levels. The atonement of Lev 16 show a brief overview of the sanctification process showing both works of Christ. Whereas the Passover show only the first. The atonement of Lev 14 provide even more details of it by applying it to both the individual and the house(corporate body). Whereas the peace offering goes further in giving all the details and legal requirements for reconciliation by figuring out all the spiritual meanings of the symbols. Atonement is another word for reconciliation. So that’s why we see a lot of mentioning of Peace offerings in Ezekiel Temple services. So since all these services are mentioned there and they all represent mainly the Pentecost(sanctification) level of work; that’s why I don’t believe the Feast of Pentecost is fulfilled here.

I don’t know if Pentecost becomes fuses with Passover or just included in the peace offerings’ meanings. For sure some revelation of this will come for those that seek.

Just a note about Ez 45:23, the prince here is the head of a tribe or nation. He’s the one that brings a bullock. This is the specification for a peace offering from the herd (bovine). So this is for the nations(people) that the Prince represents. Peace offering are given at the 3 feasts which represents that at any level of faith(growth) the Lord accepts our peace offering by which many at that point of time will just have entered the Passover Level of faith (new believer).

Another note, many might think that Jesus accomplish the Type of the Passover at His death, but remember Jesus was our example, and we too need to offer ourselves as a living sacrifice and follow His steps to Calvary where our old man needs to be crucified with Him. Passover and its rituals still needs to be spiritually fulfilled in us (the real temple of God), as well as the Pentecost every day. To my understanding of the application of these TYPES and Shadows in our body temple, these feasts and sacrifices and rituals are not all done or accomplish not until we receive the fullness of the Holy Spirit(Tabernacles). Only at Tabernacle, we become covered by the glory of the Living God (people needed to make booth with living branches at Tabernacle and live in it for 7 days) thus receiving immortality.



I had already told you in my comments about Ez 45. Basically the transfer of authority from the Beasts Kingdoms to the Saints of the Most High was done Nov 16th 2014 by decree. This was instructed by the Lord and confirmed with signs almost a year in advance. That’s the purpose of prophetic calendar year that usually one main thing is in the Lord’s agenda that He communicates to His people that is learning to hear Him. That’s another purpose of prophetic calendar years, is for us to learn to hear His voice, we come to learn what law He is fulfilling and why, we learn to understand how He works them while being involve when a spiritual prayer warfare session is requested, and we rejoice with Him when see His purpose has been accomplished. At set dates, mainly corresponding to feasts dates, the Lord make events happens that are signs for us. Usually the prophetic year is started when He moves a believer or small group of believer with a small revelation(texts or a statement they have heard). Then the believers watches for signs on the appointed feast dates and other dates set from previous years prophetic calendar that show more information about the revelation and of what the Lord is doing that often progressively escalate to the end of the prophetic year. So for 2014, it was the transfer of authority. When the decree was pronounced (eg. Nov 26 2014) or whatever event of the end of a prophetic year is reached, more signs follows to reaffirm what has been accomplish. In this way we know, this is not from the imagination of someone and the Lord was behind this from the initiation, to fulfilling the events, while giving confirmation throughout. Nothing is done by man besides a little prayer session at times, and repeating some words (decree) that was given by the Lord. From last year decree, today, we have further confirmation of that transfer of authority for Mystery Babylon financial arm is collapsing.

As for the 2015 prophetic year by which relates to this discussion, just a few weeks ago, someone “sent word that James Maloney prophesied that this is the Year of the Dove. Then in mid-December, Diane took this photo of a dove in the sky overlooking the mountains of New Mexico in the background: We prayed about this and received confirmation that this indeed is the Year of the Dove. Perhaps it means that we will see the start of the season when the Holy Spirit is sent out into the earth in a new and special way. I hope that this applies to our own overseas trips coming up this year. Jonah (or Jonas/Jones) means “dove.”

All of the preparation that we have done over the years has been for a time such as this.”

This theme should be seen and repeated in some form in the coming events that will take place this year progressively fulfilling what the Lord has in mind while providing deeper information of the coming event and for future fulfillment.

Dove represents the Holy Spirit. So notice Stephen’s careful comment. This is from around 30 years experiences following prophetic calendars. He said “perhaps it means….the start of the season” of the latter rain. He's humble enough to admit that he himself don’t know what it means and what the Lord will pull out, for he has learn through the years that the Lord :

a) is full of surprises meaning how He applies the law,
b) very wise and deep,
c) takes cares of details when He fulfill the law,
d) fulfillment often comes in strides of lesser fulfillments that leads to the full fulfillment(eg. destruction of Jerusalem where 2 strides of partial fulfillment has come, with a 3rd coming (probably 2017) that fulfill in complete Is 29 & Jer 19),
e) is not in a hurry like we are,
f) and often prepares the ground by taking several little careful wise step at a time before a fulfillment.

Stephen, like many of us, has fallen into the trap to speculate beyond of what was reveal and at the end saw he didn’t fully know or understand the Lord’s detailed plans that often doesn’t go down as we think we have it figured out. We always have to be ready to discard our pre-conceived ideas. There’s room to speculate but it should never be presented as truth. So he has learn to say less now, and makes sure his communication differentiates clearly between thoughts that are only speculative from those things that are known by confirmation by the Lord.

I looked through Ezekiel 40-48 and the only place I saw about the 10th is:
If this was what you are referring to, that was when he was in vision. I'm not sure you can say when he had a vision had anything to do with the vision. For that would be like saying that only those can receive the Spirit of the Lord who are on the isle of Patmos on the Lord's day.

Is there some other 10th day you are referring to?