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Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? #174173
06/14/15 01:14 AM
06/14/15 01:14 AM
A
Alchemy  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2018

Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
I was listening to a sermon by Pastor Bill Hughes yesterday and heard him say he didn't know who the Fit Man was. I was surprised because I didn't realize this was so difficult.

1) The Fit Man can not be a member of the angelic host.

2) The Fit Man can not be a member of the human race.

3) The Fit Man must be a member of both, the angelic host and the human race.

I believe the Fit Man is Jesus Christ.

What do you believe?

Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Alchemy] #174174
06/14/15 01:43 AM
06/14/15 01:43 AM
E
Elle  Offline
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
The Holy Spirit....as manifested at the day of atonement when Jesus got baptised("legal" death) by John the Baptist and was brought to the wilderness by the Holy Spirit (= the fit man in Lev 16)to be tempted by the devil.

When you read Lev 16, the two goats had to be without blemish and represented Jesus for the lot could fall on either one. Like the first dove, the first goat had to die, the second goat was sent in the wilderness to Azazel. This type was the same for the second dove that was release into the field.


Blessings
Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Elle] #174175
06/14/15 01:46 AM
06/14/15 01:46 AM
A
Alchemy  Offline OP
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Blessings Elle,

But, how is the Holy Spirit part of the congregation? How is the Holy Spirit a man?

Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Alchemy] #174184
06/14/15 05:07 AM
06/14/15 05:07 AM
E
Elle  Offline
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Died February 12, 2019

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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
But, how is the Holy Spirit part of the congregation?

Lev 16 doesn't say the man was from the congregation does it? I looked for it in case I had missed it.

Originally Posted By: Alchemy
How is the Holy Spirit a man?

How can a goat be the man Jesus? How can the dove, the sheep, the bull, be also the man Jesus? How can the high priest (Aaron) be Jesus also to atone for our sins? So Jesus is the goats and Aaron at the same time? How could that be? But it is.

The Hebrew word for "fit" is 'ittiy that means "timely". Some translation rendered this word as "ready". A ready man, like the Holy Spirit was ready soon after Jesus came out of the water to lead Him into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil.

Jesus was these two animals because His temple cleansing work have two main parts. The Bible tells us that baptism symbolize death which represented the first goat & the first dove that had to die. Coming out of the water = ressurection which represent an alive work (2nd living goat & 2nd alive dove). Two animals were needed to show Jesus two work and two comings:

The 1st is a death work where His death justify the world;
The 2nd is an alive work that has its basis from the 1st work shown by the 2nd dove is dipped in the blood of the first dove before it is released into the field. The first work is a Justification work, the second is the sanctification work where it deals with the devil in the wilderness.

I understand from this that Jesus fulfilled the type of the day of atonement at the beginning of His ministry so to show us the pattern of His two works that was reveal to us in Lev 14 & 16. I'm sure this type will be fullfilled again in a greater way at His second coming.


Blessings
Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Elle] #174185
06/14/15 05:51 AM
06/14/15 05:51 AM
A
Alchemy  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
Elle wrote;

"How can a goat be the man Jesus? How can the dove, the sheep, the bull, be also the man Jesus? How can the high priest (Aaron) be Jesus also to atone for our sins? So Jesus is the goats and Aaron at the same time? How could that be? But it is."

Understood. But, how do we know these things about Jesus? Because the Bible tells us. There isn't anything in Scripture or the Spirit of Prophecy that tells us the Holy Spirit is the Fit Man.

I personally believe there is another description of the Fit Man in the Bible, in Revelation 20:1-3.

Last edited by Alchemy; 06/14/15 05:52 AM.
Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Alchemy] #174206
06/14/15 01:14 PM
06/14/15 01:14 PM
E
Elle  Offline
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
Elle wrote;

"How can a goat be the man Jesus? How can the dove, the sheep, the bull, be also the man Jesus? How can the high priest (Aaron) be Jesus also to atone for our sins? So Jesus is the goats and Aaron at the same time? How could that be? But it is."

Understood. But, how do we know these things about Jesus? Because the Bible tells us. There isn't anything in Scripture or the Spirit of Prophecy that tells us the Holy Spirit is the Fit Man.

I personally believe there is another description of the Fit Man in the Bible, in Revelation 20:1-3.


There's too many elements in Rev 20:1-3 that are missing to use this text as a strong support to conclude that Jesus is that angel and it is related to Lev 16. But it does seem to have some elements of relevance. I just don't understand what Rev 20:1-3 means nor have I studied it. Where's the death and the live symbology that is the main elements and central point of these two sacrifices(lev 14 & 16)? You do have an angel(possibly the fit man) and sheol(=bottomless pit=could be an extension of the death of the soul) and the devil.......its possible. Tx for sharing, I will keep this in mind and check this relevance in my studies.

Here are the key elements of the Atonement:

Lev 14..................Lev 16......................Jesus baptism

a)1st Dove sacrifice.........1st goat sacrifice........Jesus under water(=death)

b)2nd Dove alive.............2nd goat alive............Jesus raise from baptism(=alive)

c)2nd Dove release in open field....2nd goat release in wilderness....Jesus led to the wilderness

d)priest..............Fit(ready) man takes 2nd goat ......Holy Spirit leads Jesus to wilderness

e)n/a ................Azazel..........................devil

f)cleanse lepersy(slow death of body)...cleanse the temple(=our body)...Jesus overcame 3 temptations that causes death to man

g)atonement sacrifice.....Day of atonement............Day of atonement


Another relevants that scripture shows is the 2nd dove was dip in blood of 1st dove. This shows that His(Jesus) 2nd work(=sanctification) is based on His first work(death=justification). The sanctification process that we undergo is shown in the Type by having the pillar of smoke and fire(=Holy Spirit & Jesus) leading the Israelites(=us) into the "wilderness" after Passover(=our spiritual death at our baptism in accepting Jesus and applying His blood on the lintel(forehead) and posts(ears) of our house(body))like the Israelites who wondered in the wilderness for 40 years(Jesus was in the wilderness for 40 days) before they entered Canaan(=work to bring the sword to the nations). After His baptism, Jesus went in the wilderness for 40 days before He entered His ministry to bring the sword(word of God) to the nations.

You mention in your first post that you thought that Jesus was the fit man. I think that is correct also. Like Jesus was represented as the animals and being at the same time the priest, I believe the fit man represents Him also but in the manifestation of the Holy Spirit. Some in our Church believe the Holy Spirit can be either the Father or Jesus manifested. According to my understanding and studies, I think they are right.


Blessings
Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Alchemy] #174208
06/14/15 01:19 PM
06/14/15 01:19 PM
Johann  Offline
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Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Quote:
Leviticus 16:21
And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:

Luke 9:62
And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.


According to the words of Jesus you can be a man fit for the kingdom. The condition is that you do not look back.

On the other hand you have this Fit Man in Leviticus 16 who was qualified to bring the "devil" into the wilderness.

Would you like to do that job?


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Elle] #174210
06/14/15 01:29 PM
06/14/15 01:29 PM
A
Alchemy  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2018

Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
Elle wrote;

"There's too many elements in Rev 20:1-3 that are missing to use this text as a strong support to conclude that Jesus is that angel and it is related to Lev 16. But it does seem to have some elements of relevance."

I disagree. Ellen White writes in Great Controversy 485.3 that the scapegoat set unto the wilderness is Satan bound for a thousand years on this desolate earth. I believe this directly connects Leviticus 16 with Revelation 20.

I believe the angel in Revelation 20 is Michael the Archangel, who is Jesus, who comes and chains Satan to the earth while it is desolate. I believe He does this at His Second Coming.

Also, the two goats represent the judgment made by the Father as to who is innocent and who is guilty. The separating of these two classes, who could be called the sheep and the goats or the wheat and the tares, also took place at the Second Coming of Christ.

So, Christ will come as the "Son of Man" and Michael the Archangel.

Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Johann] #174211
06/14/15 01:32 PM
06/14/15 01:32 PM
A
Alchemy  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2018

Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
Johann wrote;

"Would you like to do that job?"

No way! And I am glad I can't do it.

Re: Who is the Fit Man of Leviticus 16? [Re: Alchemy] #174213
06/14/15 02:10 PM
06/14/15 02:10 PM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
It took a lot of cleansing afterwards.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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