Anatomically, the blood nourishes every cell of the body with food and oxygen. The blood is the fluid that sustains physical life. More than that, the bible teaches that through the blood God apparently supplies a vital life current of divine energy that makes us vibrantly alive.

Another interesting biblical picture is the idea that our bowels and our hearts are the seats of our emotions. Notice that the heart is the organ that circulates the life-blood and the bowels are the organ that nourish the blood. Modern science would say these parts of scripture are only nice metaphors; "My son, give me thine heart", "out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh", "out of his belly shall flow rivers of living waters" and many others. But in my view we ought to carefully consider the fact that the death of Christ was not caused by a torn brain but by a torn heart.

I don't mean to say the brain has no part in processing our emotions. I think it does. But I would not discount the scriptures that tell us the heart and bowels, because of their close relation to the life-blood, are central to our emotional health and vitality.

Don't forget the reins.

We see a person as whole and see Genesis 2:7 as the basic formula which constitutes this wholeness of each person.
"And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

In the beginning it says God formed the body
(but a lifeless body even when it has a brain, heart, and the organs that constitute the digestive system, is not a soul) but when God breathes life into that sculptured form, then it becomes a living soul.

So, I understand the soul to be the whole life force that animates the whole body. The brain is the control center, whether through conscious action or subconscious action, all the organs in the body respond to stimuli that comes from the brain.
When the brain sends out depressing thoughts the whole system becomes depressed -- heart, digestive system, etc. all become depressed. When the brain is stewing in bitterness or anguish, the whole system gets knotted up and ceases to function in a wholesome manner.

Indeed a person FEELS the effects of their emotions in their "bowels". All one needs to do is get upset at meal time to realize the direct influence of negative brain activity on the system.

Of course when the brain is processing thoughts of faith, praise, joy, and peace -- the whole system is positively affected which enables healthy function of the whole body, which in turn feeds the brain so it can function in a healthy manner as well.

The soul is -- a living being, a body animated with the gift of life! The soul does not function apart from the body. When the soul dies, the body is no longer animated with life -- it returns to dust.


The human spirit, on the other hand seems to be:
1. The breath of life which God gives
but it also seems to be
2. The character or personality of the person

When a person dies --
their breath returns to God
but also their character or personality is maintained in the heavenly record system, to be restored when at the resurrection the body again is formed and receives God's breath of life and becomes once again a living soul -- the spirit (character) is also fully restored in the resurrected living body.
The human spirit does not live apart from the living soul and body -- body, soul and spirit constitutes one whole living person.

Yes, I agree. What I'm exploring in this thread is the difference between soul and spirit and how all three aspects of our being interact. Dedication, you believe character is associated with the spirit and that the soul is essentially the whole being. I viewed it in a similar light but some scripture has been challenging my assumptions lately. Here's an audio lecture by Derek Prince, now deceased, from YouTube that is thought provoking.

The goal in all of this is to understand the relationship of all the components of our beings to know how to yield ourselves fully to the indwelling of the Holy Spirit and to embrace our Redeemer and yield ourselves to be held tightly in that embrace. We want to be held tightly in His embrace, body, soul and spirit. Here's the lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rkyenp09fZg&index=6&list=WL

The answer is to show what scripture gives that leads to Eternal Death versus Eternal Life, its that simple.

Well charity,

I would start by comparing Eccl. 12:7 with Job 14:10-12. They both talk about the body returning to dust and giving up the ghost, but, Job 14 asks the question; "Where is he?" (KJV)

And the answer isn't a place, but, a state of existence. All the water dries up and we don't awake "till the heavens be no more". (KJV)

I hope this helps.

Yes...and a good way to understand why Lev 17:11 says "the fleshy soul is in the blood". If you may that I expand further on your thought. But it is the oxygen from the breath[ruach, S-spirit] that gives life to the blood[soul] so that all body's cells can generate energy to be able to substain life. Basically the blood is a carrier of oxygen and food[==word] that he received. He sustains life by doing his job to deliver the goods; but in reality it is the goods that sustains life.




Could you supply scripture for that...unless you are referring to the texts of His blood sacrifice.


Good association; however getting out of the focus of Lev 17 where it relates soul with blood.

But let's give it a quick look :


Heart :

I agree the heart is used symbolically as the seat of our emotions and even would add the seat of our devotion when you consider the primitive root word "labab" meaning. The verb "labab" means "to be enclosed (as if with fat)" and translated as making cakes. I had done a study of the word fat and its used in scriptures. Basically, it is translated as "giving its best" like offering the best of your crop or "the best" as living with the riches(fatness) of the land... So "labab" meaning "to be enclosed with fat" and the heart to come from that primary root word, gives a picture meaning to the word heart (leb or lebab) as being surrounded with "fat" (the best of land provision) explaining why it is the seat of our emotion as it is a respond to be surrounded with "fat". Our devotion goes to whom we think this fat comes from.

So cakes can be offered to either : 1. God, the creator, and in the sanctuary offering service there were "cakes" offered to the Lord or to 2. Baal, when the pagans also made cakes to offer to him.

leb H3820, a form of H3824; the heart; also used (figuratively) very widely for the feelings, the will and even the intellect; likewise for the centre of anything:
Total 593x: heart (508x), mind (12x), midst (11x), understanding (10x), hearted (7x), wisdom (6x), comfortably (4x), well (4x), considered (2x), friendly (2x), kindly (2x), stouthearted (with H47) (2x), care (with H7760) (2x), misc 21.

lebab H3824, from H3823; used also like H3820 the heart (as the most interior organ);
Total 252x: heart (231x), consider (with H7760) (5x), mind (4x), understanding (3x), miscellaneous (9x).

labab H3823 law-bab', a primitive root; properly, to be enclosed (as if with fat) "
Total 5x : ravished my heart (2x), make (1x), made cakes (1x), be wise (1x).

Bowel :

The bowel I haven't studied but I hold close to my heart the symbolic picture Jesus gave of the 8th day of Tabernacle saying "In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. 39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

The 8th day of Tabernacles symbolizes in general the time, our body get's glorified. So I like this expression and picture of what will happen when the overcomers will get glorified at Jesus 2nd coming.

The main Hebrew word used for "bowel" is me'ah h4578 which means sympathy. So here the emotion is narrowed down to one thing important for the overcomers (or 144k) to possess -- sympathy and from the belly(sympathy) of the overcomers rivers of living water will flow out. Out to whom? to the remaining people. v.39 qualifies this as the outpouring of the Holy Spirit as we have witness in a small version at Pentecost by which the effect wore off quickly because the believers were still with "leavened". Pentecost was pointing to a greater outpouring of the Holy Spirit that will happen at the Tabernacle fulfillment.

me'ah H4578 may-aw'; from an unused root probably meaning to be soft; used only in plural the intestines, or (collectively) the abdomen, figuratively, sympathy; by implication, a vest; by extension the stomach, the uterus (or of men, the seat of generation), the heart (figuratively)
Total usage 32X : bowels (27x), belly (3x), heart (1x), womb (1x).


Reflection of Heart and bowel :

However we don't believe that literally our heart is the seat of our emotion and our bowel where our sympathy is generated. It is definetly the place where emotion are felt by a faster or slower heart rate and the belly feels sympathy. Isn't this symbolic--using the physical-natural realm to explain spiritual dimensions?

I can see that our emotion comes from the mind of the soul; however holy emotion probably can come from the mind of the spirit also. I would speculate that sympathy (from the belly) is mainly in relation to our spirit mind. We express this as "gut feelings" that often contradicts our intellectual mind. But I don't know.... things I haven't really studied or chewed upon much.

However the heart or the bowel doesn't explain why "the fleshy soul is in the blood".


The Fleshy Soul is in the Blood :

The case for the symbolism of blood (dam H1818) in scriptures; I've browse very quickly the 295 verses with the word dam in it. What I could capture is well over 90% of its usage applied this word to either 1. spilling the blood or murdering our brother or 2. to the blood in sacrifices. I need more time to be more thorough and find the other 10% application like we see in the beginning of Lev 17:11.

Lev 17:10 "And whatsoever man there be of the house of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, that eateth any manner of blood; [H1818, dam] I will even set my face against that soul H5315 that eateth blood H1818, and will cut him off from among his people.

11. For the life [soul H5315] of the flesh is in the blood: [H1818, dam] and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your soul: H5315 for it is the blood H1818 that maketh an atonement for the soul. H5315"

So I come up with 3 applications of the word dam (blood) in the OT.

1. Not to eat blood == this is the spiritual equivalence of not spilling the blood of our brother (not to murder) by which there's a great emphasis of most scriptures with "blood" on this.

2. Blood of sacrifice atones our soul == we well know the spiritual meaning of this is that Jesus blood was spill volunteerly for us all. Then there's a parallele of all who were murdered like Abel ... they also are sacrifices. Jesus was the biggest Martyr there was with His sacrifice.

Something interesting to consider about those that murder. The priesthood followed the law in killing Jesus; for only the priesthood could kill the sacrifice. However, the reason they were "cut off" is because they did not sprinkle the blood of the sacrifice on their [heart] altar as the law dictates in Lev 17. Of course most murderers won't likely do so; but some Jewish leaders or contributers of murdering their brother like Paul was guilty of has the opportunity to sprinkle their heart with Jesus' blood and according to the law won't carry the guilt of "eating blood" or murdering their brothers.

3. The Blood is our geneology that points to Adam -- the first Adam who was made a living soul. So I'm lenient to think that's what Lev 17:11 means by saying "the fleshy soul is in the blood".

One thing important to note that support this though is the word dam (blood) comes from Adam. Actually there's two Hebrew words for Adam. H120 means the human kind and H119 which is a primary root word that means "red" or "to show blood (in the face)". H119 is the root word for both Adam(H120) and dam (blood-H1818).


My summary

The new created man is "born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."(John 1:13) Jews and the Israelites long held strong that their bloodline is what qualify them as sons of God.

So Lev 17:11 saying "the fleshy soul is in our blood"...this symbology might be referring to our geneology(bloodline) that goes back to Adam -- the first living soul created. Geneology(blood) or its will cannot give us eternal life; as much as blood cannot give life to the body without the oxygen (Spirit) and the food (word[rhema] of God) it carries.

I agree the soul is not the heart, digestive system and other organs; however, it is the soul that commands the body. Since the body is in submission to the soul; then the body will take up the name of "soul", so that's why Gen 2:7 says together they make the living soul.

We find this naming principle when the 12 tribes split in two houses: 1. The house of Israel that comprise of the 10 northern tribes where Ephraim is the leading tribe for Jacob gave his new name, Israel, to (Gen 48:16). 2. the house of Judah that had 2 tribes by who, Judah was the leading tribe.


I agree with the above but I would reformulate the first sentence as I did above.


I dissagree as I make this qualification in Charity's respond above. The gift of life comes from the oxygen[revelation of the Holy Spirit] and food[utterance of God] received by the spirit of man.


Overall I do agree. However people that are brain dead (in coma)...isn't the body still alive? However alive via artificial breathing and providing food to the blood?



Do provide texts to support that the spirit is the character or personality of the person. I had ask this also from Charity who said the same.

And also read 1Cor 2 and other scriptures like 1John that shows the spirit is way more than what you reduced it to be in your description above. #1. it is the revelation of the Holy Spirit to our spirit that gives the true breath[ruach]. However, Gen 2:7 talks about a different breath[nechamah] that is given to the soul and body.


It is their spirit[ruach] that returns to God; it is not the simple breath and definetely not the same breath[nechamah] given to make man a living soul in Gen 2:7.

Ecc 12:7 "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit[ruach] shall return unto God who gave it."

Mat 27:50"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. G4151"


Nice words but are the concept Biblical?

I know that the Bible says the following :
1. our body returns to dust
2. our soul goes to hades or Sheowl (see Ps 16:10; 30:3;86:13; 88:3; 89:48; Prov 23:14; Ecc 9:10; Acts...)
3. our spirit returns to God.


Somewhat true. It is true for those currently living on earth. However for those "dead"...their spirit returns to God and I would say that it is alive and conscious with God. Jesus who was correcting the Saducees false concept said in Mat 22:32 :

32 "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living."

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob's spirit returned to God. So since our spirit has its own mind and self-awareness (as discussed in Post#187572); then I would believe their whole spirit are with God with its "living" attributes.

Good point. The problem is that people misconstrue the parable of the rich man and Lazarus and Rev 5 to say that eternal death is eternal life in torment. In my experience for many people this is a harder error to give up than the Sabbath being Sunday.

Very interesting. Ellen White confirms that Adam and Eve had ruddy or reddish complexions. So, before the fall perhaps their skin was more translucent allowing the light that clothed them to illuminate of their wonderful anatomy, providing a far better view of the life forces and physical systems than what we can see today.

She also indicates that before sin that was the case with the rest of nature; that is, the secrets of life in the plants and animals were more directly open to Adam and Eve: